Hi Betsey. Sorry I have been MIA. I haven't been feeling well today.
I understand that you don't want to play the waiting game anymore, so I won't ask you to hold off for more stabs at counseling. And, I don't think the letter is too long at all. I understand that thought IF you are not the one that the letter pertains to, but a 2 page letter about ME would certainly have my attenion. Oh, not to say that yours didn't hold mine too! I was just replying to the length critisism.
My first thought was like Mer's, that it sounded angry. I would hate for him to go into self defense mode and not get anything out of this. But, the more I think about it, the more I realize that you really CAN'T sprinkle little bits of praise into it when you don't have any to give.
This did jump out at me:
Quote: I realize that I contributed a great deal to the demise of our relationship and marriage. But I have done the work and made drastic changes for myself. I have made these changes so that I am a better person, wife, mother, and friend.
I know that you go on later to say that you are open to suggestion on how to keep on the improvement track. However, at this point, it sounds as if you are saying, "I am healed. It's all YOU now." Maybe if you added on here that you are aware that there may be more changes to make, and that you are open to them.
Also, I am right with you on the request for no crass words. However, since ML is not upon the immediate horizon, I may wait on this one. Oh, I agree that it needs to be said, but until the other things are addressed, it is pretty much a non-issue, no?
And now, I must make my run to the store for some ginger ale and crackers. If only S12 could drive....
Hope this is a little more to think about. Hopefully I'll be feeling 100% tomorrow and will be of more help.
By the way, it takes a lot of courage to not only write that letter, but to put it out here and allow it to be dissected. I applaud you. (with no Arfs to be heard...)
It's a sh*t or get off the pot letter and lays it all out on the line. It acknowldges that M is hard work and she is prepared to do it--but if Mr. W is not or will never be--then it's time to move on. Read Betsey's note to Slowly on anger--she sounds comfortable with this letter. Sure she wants the M to work, but she has reached the conclusion that Mr. W is just punching the clock and must be brought to the table. It seems to me that for Betsey, C is not about resolving Mr. W's ambivalance, but working on the M or not. If his answer is no, she is ready to move on. Sad, but the end of a long road.
Look, every sitch is different, and I know that for me personally, I am nowhere near that point of the road--although I might be a lot closer if I got to keep my kids (and I suspect W might be acting a bit differently if that in fact were reality). All we can do on this board is give our thoughts as best as possible and integrate the comments of others into our attempted solutions. If we're open--we'll recognize any flaws in our thinking or the need for modifications. But ultimately, it's Betsy's decion. Go Underdog!
I finally watched Finding Nemo last night so at last I know what you are all referring to when you talk about sharks, not eating fish, "just keep swimming" etc etc etc!!
About the sarcasm issue, my H uses sarcasm a lot, and an even worse defence - "It was a joke". So he can say any damn thing, however badly timed, ill conceived, mean, thoughtless, whatever, and if I react badly or negatively, my H can then look pious and say "For God's sake, that was a joke!!" So he never has to own any of his comments and remarks.
This weekend he was telling me the outline of his idea for his novella. Well, it was very sketchy, and when I queried bits which didn't make sense, he rounded on me with great arrogance about the fact that I hadn't understood some particular point. Even when I told him that he hadn't in fact made something clear, I was supposed to just know.
Some of you guys also touched on the fact that once the bombshell has dropped, the WAS think that everything they do thereafter is in fact KOSHER, including having an A with your best friend etc. After all, they were HONEST with you about how they didn't love you any more!!!
I read an article a while ago, rather jokey, about signs of MLC in men, and one of them is that they are full of arrogance and speak as if they are uniquely and supremely intellegent while everyone else has the IQ of a protozoa! I spotted that one in my H!
Now, I'm not going to join in with your homework assignement just yet, but I do have a question -
To all you women with the H's out there who won't commit, want to have their cake and want to eat it too, never do what they say they will, can't communicate, never turn up on time, don't remember your birthdays, etc.
Has your H actually changed over the years, or did you just not recognise these behaviours in the early years of the marriage? Were they somewhat masked by your common idealism and being in love?
If I am very honest, most of my H's present unlovely traits are ones that he has always had, they are just very much more pronounced now, as H has cut free from me and the R and feels no need to temper his behaviour towards me. He doesn't 'owe' me his best behaviour any more, and I am getting the full blast of it. I suspect the same is quite often the case with others here. What do you think?
Livnlearn
"The unexamined life is not worth living" - Socrates
I'm not asking for permission to feel what I feel or standing up and pulling a Horshack and yelling, "Oh, Oh, pick me, Mr. W. pick me!"
I'm going to be very explicit here: I really don't care which one he picks. As another non-posting DBer pointed out to an e-mail message to me, this is a "sh!t or get off the pot" letter. That it is. And I'm not arguing that point at all.
Your objections are duly noted, but I am hitting the off button to this roller coaster once he tells me what he wants to do. Realize that it's what I want to do right now. However, I would like for him to tell me what he wants to do specifically. I need to hear the words.
If he's in, I'll back off and let the MC take the reins. If not, my fingers are dialing the mediator post haste and I'm going to initiate this divorce once and for all.
Yes, I have not committed to the timing. In fact, I will probably run this by MC before giving it to him. Or I might not. This letter is long time coming and is not rash or in the vein of my crazymaking ways.
I really don't give a rats ass if he needs more time. For over 4 months, I've been fearing that the only way that Mr. Wonderful will make a decision is if someone holds his feet to the fire. It's now become crystal clear.
In fact, I should have known this was the case long ago. Working in the world of military defense, engineers get used to de-prioritizing things that are not on the front burner and bubbling over. In order to get that sort of attention, some 4 star has to come screaming, "I ASKED FOR THAT INFORMATION AND I NEED IT YESTERDAY!"
I had the soft discussion with him nearly one month ago, after I was forced to meet with a military clearance investigator. A person whose job it is to make sure that Mr. Wonderful is not a threat to our country.
I had the most wonderful convo with Mr. W. after meeting with the investigator, asking for him to make a decision. Meredith, this is the last time he told me that he had deliberately put me out of his mind because he didn't want to think about me or the miserable state of things. He apologized profusely for fence sitting and hurting me with his indecision.
He promised to begin examining himself so that he could give me some answers.
Then the night I left for DC, I was ready to board the plane when he called--telling me that he was not ready to make a decision about our future, nor was he likely to do so in the near future. Why the hell not?
So consider my letter the civilian equivalent of a 4 star, asking him for information that I need yesterday.
Thank you to the friends who have written me off the BB. I appreciate your input, suggestions and support.
There is a season for everything guys. I want the chance to live my life in peace with happiness, with my daughters. I am no longer willing to allow him to dictate the terms of how I can do this. It's been going on for almost 2 years now, and the time has come to end this stagnation once and for all.
Capisce?
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
I know you have been leading to this for a long time. This topic, sometimes undercurrent, has been in just about all of your posts. Please know I am not trying to change your mind. Each one of us has to reach a space where we say ENOUGH!
So, send your letter or save it until after the first MC session. That's your choice! You're right, you will be okay with whichever way this goes.
I do love the Horshack scene! I can't tell you how many times I have felt like I was doing that exact thing!
Pattie
When you can't make a decision because you are torn between your heart and your head, listen to the half with the brain.
Love2win, There you are! I haven't heard from you in awhile...I dissapeared for a little while, but would love to see you back on my thread...I looked for you back in mid-march.
LNL - to answer your question about H's and their respective traits....my H did not exude any of the traits that he is now showing--i.e. he was always on time or early, he was considerate in the gifts he chose for bdays or holidays, he was committed, etc... The traits he has today-forgetfulness, late on occasion, fence-sitting are not features he ever exposed to me pre-Bomb.
Betsey - sorry if I seemed to be stepping on your toes. I was trying to give you some insight to things we had discussed before. (((((((((())))))))))) I know you're tired of waiting. You deserve to be happy.
Bets, I don't think we were trying to change your mind...just give you a few angles to consider.
Everyone knows when enough is enough for them...and you have all of us behind you no matter what you decide. Whether he sh!ts or gets off the pot, your sharks will have your tail, baby. No question about it.
GO YOU!
"It is not easy to find happiness in ourselves, and it is not possible to find it elsewhere."
--Agnes Repplier, writer and historian
Just my observation - if your letter shows too much anger, irritation, annoyance, whatever, it still looks to your H like you are very "involved", while he seems content to deny you his involvement.
I think, perhaps, if your letter comes across as cooler and less urgent (and therefore needy), H may come to the conclusion that you are happy and ready to move on, and this may jog him into action a little sooner.
While you say you would accept either answer from your H, it is obvious that you would prefer him to work on the marriage than not, or you wouldn't be on this BB, right?
Livnlearn
"The unexamined life is not worth living" - Socrates
