New LBH with WAW/possibly WW, need help.

[nutts]

Update:

I came home from work, and W was crying on the couch. I guess the OM's W had a friend of her's messages my W, and sent her some awful, nasty messages, some truly low things. They were hard to read, but it was obvious she was saying things to try and hurt my W as much as possible.

It worked. My W isn't the most emotionally stable woman, and she cried for a while, and eventually, she started packing up things to stay at her mom's (her mom came and picked her and my son up). I also think a big part of her crying was she realized her A was over. Again, it hurt me to see her in such pain, but I wasn't overly compassionate, even though I just wanted to hug her (although I'm not sure she would've let me).

She still blames me for it, and she says I exposed the A just to hurt her.

Her Mom came over, and she was mad at me too, I did say I wasn't the one that had a affair with a married man, but then she went off on me because of my porn Addiction and not pleasing my wife like I should have. I guess I should've kept quiet, her mom is always going take her side.

Also, I found in my wife's purse, names of divorce lawyers, and she had also photocopied documents of our finances (savings, car payments, insurance, house mortgage, etc.)

My wife is ready to move on this thing, and I'm feeling hopeless. I hope, before too much time passes, she regains some of the feelings she had for me. Right now, I think she really, REALLY doesn't like me, and I guess her family doesn't either, as they point to me as the one to cause her this pain.

again, sigh...

[nutts]

I talked to my W tonight for a while on the phone, a little bit about how she felt because she was getting good attacked, not only from OMs W and her friends d, but OM was now also attacking her, calling her bad names and stuff.

it's obvious OM doesn't want to lose his marriage, so he's doing exactly what his W wants hi to.

it was hard for me to not console her, and I did some,telling get her those words are only used to hurt, nothing going more.

I did tell her, while I'm not thrilled with how the A ended, I am glad it's over between u2.

We then talked about moving the separation forward, and how she made photocopies only because her parents said she should. she also opened up about downsizing her car to something more affordable.

see, my wife cant sit around doing nothing if she thinks there something to be done, and what needs to be done now is moving this R towards D I her mind.

we talked about where she wants to live, which part of town, and that we'd never keep our son away from the other. I do believe her in that.

while it was nice to talk, it was also tough talking about this possible reality.

She did tell me she was going to pack up a bunch of stuff, put it in a u haul this Saturday while i am gone and put it in storage, but she decided she couldn't do that to me.

I was glad she told me that, and I hope it means more honesty going forward. we did agree on being open, but I realize I need to take that with a grain of salt.

she kind of upset that I told a friend about her A but I didn't tell them about my porn problem, since she justifies her A since we didn't have sex hardly at all.

Anyway, I just needed to journal a bit. if u stock around this long, I have a joke. a mushroom walks into a bar, the bartender says, "we don't serve ur kind" the mushroom says, "aw, come on, I'm a fungi"

good night.

[Surfer]

Nice joke!

Look, your porn addiction wasn't ideal. But your W "choosing" to accept another mans advances was a "choice". It was hers. SHE made that choice again and again. It's so easy to blame others. Or put it in a different light. i.e.:

a) Show me a man that tells you he never masturbated (or a woman) and I will show you a liar. You are a human.

b) If your W was putting out in the way you wanted it you might not have spent so much time gratifying yourself!

See what I mean. This is all just frustration at not being in control and loved. She vents to MIL, she vents back - for different reasons. W is feeling unloved by OM and feels you ruined it, MIL is upset that her D is upset (again) and you feel upset that your W had an A now everyone seems against you.

Let the dust settle. Yes, a D might take place, but in fairness I bet there are plenty of people on her that have experienced worse and have got through it (I am not saying a high percentage - but its all possible).

Stop the negative self talk, do some positive self talk. You get what you wish for.

Surfer.

[Cristy]

Hello Nutts,

I'm glad you are keeping your sense of humor, good joke!

I'm so sorry for the situation you are in.

Sometimes the best thing you can do is to do nothing. Doing nothing IS doing something. It is keeping you from doing something you'll regret or something that will have unintended consequences.

Why are you talking about the relationship so much with your wife? You can't believe anything she says and only half of what she does right now. You also need to let your actions speak for themselves. Become the best Nutts and Dad that only a fool would leave.

You are at a very fragile point in this relationship and it would be extremely helpful to know what your next move should be. Feel free to give me a call at 303-444-7004 to discuss how we can best help you determine what to do next.

Cristy
Resource Coordinator
The Divorce Busting Center
303-444-7004

[nutts]

journal:

tl;dr nothing much, but no movement towards D either.

nothing big happened today, started the day with W and S at MIL, and I went to work. W texts me later I the day we can eat at her mom's or she can grab some dinner and we eat at home. I said it's a little awkward still with ur family, she said that's fine.

I come home, dinner is ready, we eat, as a family, but before S is done, W goes upstairs to do laundry. she seemed tired or bad mood, or both really.

I had a great time playing with S after dinner, watching peppa pig, then bath and bed. I love that boy.

I then asked W if she wanted to go over finances (we agreed to do that today) but she was too tired. so, I left her in the guest bedroom and went down to watch some shows. she'll probably be asleep soon, and I'll go soon too.

basically, nothing major happened, I just wanted to writs it out. thanks.

[Georgia Bulldogs]

Nutts,

Just skimmed through the thread and I really want to commend you for doing the right thing.

Whether you recover your marriage or not, OM's wife had a right to know that her husband was having an affair with your wife. It wasn't easy to do that. Contacting her took courage and instincts but it was absolutely the right thing to do even if it has consequences you don't like or enjoy. The fact that you told her and it resulted in the affair ending (hopefully - you've got to keep watching for contact despite what they say), is just a bonus.

If the affair really is over your wife will be in withdrawal for a few weeks so my advice to you is DELAY. Wayward wives in withdrawal are depressed and often lack the will power to follow through on anything. Sure she said it was over a couple of days ago but that was just her anger. She'll get over her anger and as long as she remains in "no contact" with OM, she'll slowly start talking to you more and more and talking about separation/divorce less and less. Her pride may be pushing her to follow through but her depression and hopelessness (over losing OM, the affair and being "stuck" with you) typically overrides her fading pride's motivations. In furtherance of such, don't enable her separation/divorce. Make her undertake to do it all. You just don't feel comfortable negotiating the demise of your family and marriage. She can leave whenever she wants but she needs to leave everything behind and let a court divide it up because you aren't taking part anymore.

I also don't think following Sandi's 37 rules or whatever it's called is effective for you. Those rules work better for betrayed wives trying to manipulate home a wayward husband by 180'ing their husband and acting like they don't care. Your situation differs. Your wife felt neglected and uncherished by you so your 180 plan would actually include being more caring, empathetic and pursuing (in moderation - not desperately). It's just illogical to me to think you can manipulate a wayward wife that doesn't feel you cared about them by ACTING like you don't care about them and are happy for them. Again, I'm not suggesting begging her while pledging your undying love for her in a room full of flowers and gifts. But it's OK to express your devastation and communicate your feelings to give full indication that you give a crap, want to stay married, understand she's not in love with you but you remain willing to try to fix things and if you both try for 6 months, 8 months or 1 year (because, in the end happy loving married parents are what's best for son) and conclude you can't stay married, then you'll be willing to give her an amicable divorce.

Your wife is not going to want to recover. You seem to have passed the first hurdle (no contact - but keep a watch out for the very typical "closure contact" where the affair partners feel REQUIRED to check in with each other to make sure the other is OK or, in your situation, OM may feel he has to secretly tell your wife he doesn't really mean what he's saying and he's sorry he hurt her and/or your wife may feel she HAS TO contact him to chew him out for saying those mean things. Closure contact happens. Do not consent to it. Ask her to write her feelings down but not to send it. Remind her to check her pride. If it happens anyway, there is a risk the affair will resume but either way, withdrawal begins again and you'll have a few more weeks of irate depressed irrational wayward wife to deal with again.

Keep eating with her and spending time with her and your son as much as possible. Just be around but TRY to keep things light. Don't force conversation. Listen to her and listen some more but say little. There's just not much "recovering" you can do while she's in withdrawal but being around talking to her helps distract her from making closure contact or otherwise reaching out to her OM. The worst times are when she's alone. Idle time leads to idle thoughts so just being around helps. You can be "around" and still do some GAL stuff.

oh ---->>> your MIL is wrong and taking her daughter in is actually interfering in your marriage. On your wedding day, I presume your MIL/FIL "gave" their daughter to you. They entrusted you with her best interests and they should honor that. She's not in danger or being physically abused so your wife doesn't need their protection. She should be home with you where the two of you can work on your marriage. MIL is just enabling her daughters selfish entitled wayward attitude. It's a common mistake but it demonstrates your MIL is not a friend of your marriage.

Also, exposing to OM's wife didn't hurt OM's marriage or yours ~~> the affair did that all by itself. It appears this exposure is actually giving your marriage a chance (because without "no contact" there is no chance at all).

How does OM know your wife? If it's over how can you (and your wife, eventually) insure "no contact for the rest of her life"?

[nutts]

bulldog,

Interesting POV, about not following sandi's rules now. I'm as positive as I can be the A is over. they're not longer fb friends, my W told me the awful things OM and his W said to her, and it seems OMs W has him underwraps.

I agree she will probably be more depressed then normal for a bit, and I can try and stay around her more, trying to stay cheerful, but not going too deep on anything.

A huge hurdle as u mentioned will be her pride; now that she told people were separating it will be very hard for her to do otherwise, she so frigging stubborn. I'll have my work cut out for me, no doubt.

I'm going to have to think about ur advice, as it's different than the others, but there is some logic to it, especially the 180. right now, she stays in her room watching TV by herself, the same thing she did before the BD, and it's hard to see that it doesn't remind her of the lonely times. I'll try and get her to watch programs with me the next few days.

Thanks for the time and advice.

[Cadet]

Remember that the advice is based on
IF the affair is OVER.

And I think the part about just listening is the key.

Think of her as trying to feed a squirrel.
You are NOT going to succeed by rushing up and scaring her.
You are holding out your hand and hoping that she will come eat from it, no sudden movements towards or away.

[Vanilla]

I haven't posted to you before and your sitch is now complex.

I won't weigh in on the disclose or not disclose, my position is (for the record) in most sitches disclosure makes things worse. OP1 can be transitional and past behaviour is an indicator of future behaviour. Things can get very sneaky too.

Some W see porn as emotional infidelity and having thought about this deeply, addiction to porn is emotional infidelity. So your W may see you as the cheater. You have wayward behaviour in your sitch, you are looking for release outside of your M.

She has called time on you. She walked. Consider if she addressed heavy porn use with you. So far so reasonable I think.

So considers your M over and wants out. I get it, heavy compulsions are a drain on an R, what have you done to address that?

-------------------------------

This is where things go awry, she chose a boyfriend who was M. In her eyes her M is done, she wants out so she may be adulterous but it's not infidelity for her. I chose not to have a bf when I walked but The Giggalo had 9 OW although he considers any after filing ofor D to be a gf. My view is very different, it's adultery.

So I like the view you have dragged OM1 into your R and his W. Considering where you are OM1 I think is transitional any way.

I have no doubt there will be OM2, either there already or in the wings. That is what waywards do.

------------------------------

By concentrating on your WW and evaluatiing her (and whilst I can see some walking from your M could be appropriate) then the obvious is being missed.

What are you doing to clean up your side of the street?

Are you in IC, twelve steps and reading DB?

Applying the rules?

Reading Sandi info on WW, (fabulous material by the way).


This is in my thinking about you becoming the best you can be and there are many who have done so ahead of you, some addicted to porn or over users of it to the detriment of their M. Porn use by any partner in an M can be destructive to their life partner.

You are in the right place to get yourself together and resolved. By behaving in a wayward way your WW has chosen a destructive path. She may be out to prove to herself she is desirable and to be petulant to raise her self esteem. Her circus, her monkeys. And for the record this isn't the way to do it. Clearly your WW wants out of the M.

I like Coconuts view that this should be about you, Sandi and Cadet are saying have you done the Work? I would add to Cadets thoughts in that it isn't if the A is over, although if it's a specific embedded A it might be, more if the need for waywardness is over. I can't see that. Using Sandi rules is great guideline, I had them laminated. My wayward wasn't done with waywardness. In the end I knew I can't out every A or EA, warn singletons he was M. He just sought another one, and most of them were transients anyway. OW1 H already knew and wanted to walk, OW2 H wanted shot of her, etc. Much less frazzled V to let it pass me by, set my boundaries.

From where I am, I can't see you have. I don't believe outing OM to his W has really done much more damage to your M. Clearly it has undermined your WW self esteem even further though and more likely to confirm her views on D. Pot, kettle and black.

This is quite a tough post to write and in my opinion outing the A really didn't cause much further damage. You have time, let things cool, read learn, grow, get IC. Concentrate on you.

You are just beginning the long road to you.

V

[nutts]

Hi Vanilla,

Thank you for the time in giving me some advice.

Yes, I'm am 100% working on me. I had an IC, but not for long, I've been reading up on resolving the porn use, and I've been on track 100% since the BD. I've been working out more, eating better, and trying to get out more.

I'm going to make sure, whatever happens with this M, I'm going to be a better person, and a better H to whomever I might be with in the end.

While I work on me, I obviously want to save my family. Will my W find another OM? Possibly, but she doesn't get out a whole lot, at least not yet, stays at home with our son. I'll definitely keep an eye out for it, but I'm not going to be consumed by it. Her A is over, she suffered some emotional damage (both from just the A being over, and from the backlash from OM and OM's W and friend).

I'm going to continue to try and take it slow, watch her, see what happens, and try and make the right decisions, while I continue to work on bettering myself.

Thanks.