Keep Wearing Wedding Band? [Thread #4]

[JRuss]

Seems like nice gestures to me. Others will likely say you were being Mr. Nice Guy. All of this stuff is impossible. I like your idea of just doing what feels right, then and there.

[CT1118]

Seems like nice gestures to me. Others will likely say you were being Mr. Nice Guy. All of this stuff is impossible. I like your idea of just doing what feels right, then and there.

JRuss
I am not going to comment on FG being nice or not, if his W has a mental disorder - that is entirely a new ball game in terms of response. However, this stuff can seem impossible - and perhaps what will be will be. But the one thing which is not impossible is doing our best to become our best, given the situation, that is DB, or a rose by any other name.

FG - my first wife was diagnosed with BPD. I am highly familiar with what living with one feels like. However, before diagnosis, she was a liar, a cheater, a con artist, and an alcoholic at 28 years old. She was in no MLC or any type zone. We had no kids and I was only 30, broke, and miserable. I had nothing to do but gain and the desire for D was mutual. However, I did not make myself better in the process, it ended and I blamed her for years. I don't think I fully forgave her until this year when life forced me to take a very hard look at myself and how I have been in the past, who I am today, and who I want to be.

Listen though, all of you, the DB process is intended to make you better. To make you better as a communicator, as a negotiator, at living your life, at knowing your goals, at how to plan, at how to set objectives, at how to make choices. The hope is that by doing so, you can attract your spouses back too, but that if you cannot, then you are still a better person.

There are way too many variables in the human psychology for a one size fits all solution. DB'ing is only a model among many of an approach you can take to potentially saving your R's & M's. Yet, DB recognizes that one thing will remain consistent among all of these variables - you. You are the one who can change you. Period. There will be no enlightenment for that which you do not seek. There will be no reward for those who do not work. There will be no gain for those who do not self-motivate.

In terms of actions towards our spouses - if you read deep enough here, some say play nice, some say play hard. I do not know what is correct - I have found older posts here where people played nice and got back together, conversely, there are those who played hard and got back together. I think the only answer is what do you do for you that keeps your dignity, moves you forward as a growing soul, and improves your life.

People compliment me greatly here for my efforts on my sitch, and I truly appreciate that. But I do get tired. I have gone through so many emotions there was a pre-teen rainbow shooting out of my arse for most of the summer. I got to detachment, but still, I am a human - I can still feel let down, mad, or tired. I still ask "Am I making the right choice?" and have to re-read the reasons I wrote down months ago about shared values, desires, and benefits. I do not know if my R will ever be again, much less my M. I don't. I do know this, I am on a journey for myself - not to become emotionless, not to feel apathetic, not to blame. My journey is to become better so that I may be able to have benefit to others in a way which improves this world somehow - I can only do this if I feel good about me, fix me, and focus me.

So that part of DB, those last few paragraphs...let there be no confusion about that. That is why you are here. You came to win your spouse back, you discovered how to win yourself back.

I wish all of you love and peace of heart today. FG - chin up, right now, chin up. I do get it, I have empathy, but chin up, spine straight, shoulders back.

[Coly23]

Just checking in to see how you are doing Gump?

I know how you feel about beating yourself about about backsliding. At the time if seems like the end of the world but after a few days it loses its power.

I like that you just carried on a did dinner after your W did lots of spewing at you . You are a great H and a great Dad, not ever forget that!

[ForGump]

I'm not feeling well. I think of this as a long-term response, as in things that were set in motion a long time ago are coming to fruition now. I accept it. It doesn't feel good. I also understand it will get better with time.

As for my behavior, my W may well see me as a nice guy and a doormat, but you know what, I don't care. I'm going to do what I'm going to do. I'm certain that what I do about dinner is not going to change my W's mind. I'm convinced BPD is driving her warpath to D, and it just doesn't matter whether I'm a nice guy or not. Her brain needs a hit, a hit of euphoria from being wanted and pursued by someone new, and I can DB until the cows come home but I'll never be able to give her the drug hit she needs.

The only way she might see things differently is for her to come down from her high. Even then, she might not see me as most normal people would.

[AndrewP]

ForGump - I believe I've been called a "nice guy" and a few other words on these forums as well.

We can both be proud to hold our heads high for the efforts we have made. One of the things I did that seems similar to your own personality is that I treated my W with respect and courtesy even during the darkest of times. I can recall only two times when I ever raised my voice to her, once when I found out about OM "why the [censored] are you still here?" and once when she told me that instead of going out with friends like she earlier that she was going to OM (I threatened to take off my wedding ring and she backed down).

What I think we can both say though is that when they walked / walk out of that door that they will know that they left behind a kind, decent man who loved them dearly and who would move heaven and earth if only to see them smile one more time.

------

It's a bit sad for me these days on the forum. Even though I still think of myself as a "newbie" and I am, sometimes I feel like a vet. Over the last 6 months I've seen quite a few people come and go. A small number have indeed started the path towards reconciliation but we seem to have a current "bump" in the group that feels like / is giving up. That's just the nature of these things I suppose that there are spikes in arrivals and departures just like everywhere. ForGump - I was very impressed when you joined our group here. You were burning for answers, open and willing to help others (and still are) and generally positive and optimistic. You and CT1118 changed the tone of the whole forum with your detailed researches, thoughtful answers. I must admit that reading what you wrote helped give me strength when I needed it. Prior to that much of the feedback I was getting on Newcomers was "GAL", "detach", "move on" (which I interpreted as give up). I was getting very disheartening. Even though I am positive you'll hang around for a while, I just wanted to say "thanks".

Just to close I think it was Cadet who posted on someone's thread something to the effect
"You only have to give up when they pile dirt on you".

[Coly23]

AndrewP, I had the same thoughts today about the 'bump' in the current group. I want so much for one of us to start the road to piecing because I think it will give the rest some hope which st the mo end is definitely lacking.

But I also agree that we shouldn't give up!

[Cherry]

There is some dark times. There is also some v inspirational people. I find a lot of similarities with psysara both ourselves and our wh. She has had many ups and downs, but she is holding up great.

It is super hard not to give up, but I guess we just need to continue working on us. If it hadn't been for this site, I'm sure I'd be a super teary depressed woman barely getting through the day.

[CT1118]

ForGump, Coly23, AndrewP, Cherry...so much in the above. And bless all of you for the support that has been offered. This is the hardest GD thing I have ever faced, and as I believe you all have read my tale, that is no small statement. FG, hold your head up high. If this experience led you to do one great thing, you have helped me on my own journey. But you have done many great things, so don't stop there. There is nothing wrong with nice guys, I am one of them. You have shown nothing but strength to this point; even coming here and bleeding showed strength. Imagine how few of us come here and speak to the most despicable things in our lives, the greatest trespasses, and the issues that others would die before they told, and then think of the many who don't. We came here wanting to have our marriages last in and era when they simply do not, not in greater numbers anyway. Simply fighting for this something to be proud of.

To be honest, most days I do not think I will make it. Somehow I just keep trying though, simple read like as Coly23 said:

But I also agree that we shouldn't give up!

.

Looking at things for what they are to you does not mean you have given up. Do not ever give up on yourself my friend - I do not think that you have.

Just know:

What I think we can both say though is that when they walked / walk out of that door that they will know that they left behind a kind, decent man who loved them dearly and who would move heaven and earth if only to see them smile one more time.

I am not sure they know that at the time of walking out, but they will know it one day, and they will be old enough to care about what they lost. Their search is longer than ours. Yes, they made us realize that we made mistakes too, but we understood to cure a headache, you do not remove the head.

Lastly, I can't speak for Cherry:

It is super hard not to give up, but I guess we just need to continue working on us. If it hadn't been for this site, I'm sure I'd be a super teary depressed woman barely getting through the day.

But I have to imagine that when she said that about this site, part of what made her not give up was your story, your words, and the affect you have had here thus far my friend. I know I would have meant it that way. This site has been the glue which held my pieces together many times. People like all of you.

If your W never sees you as normal again I think she is right. Normal these days is selfish, self-righteousness, and instantaneous experience - you sought the selfless, the self-equal, and the long run my friend - that ain't normal no more. I wish you the best night you can have.

[mulesqb]

Hey FG - Just checking in on you. You seem down. I just wanted to say that's ok and part of the process. When I felt like that I always thought of it as "mourning" the breakup of my old M whether or not I was going to reconcile later on.

It's ok to have down days. I actually hear some strength in some of the things you are saying.

For as long as I have watched this site the big question to me was always how long does LBS stay in limbo? What's long enough, and how do you determine that? I don't know the answer to that question. I just think every person has their point. I remember back in the day a very well respected poster named FIB posed the question about DBing and whether it was all worth it for the LBS to go on for potentially years in limbo with what could be false hope or a long journey to reconciliation.

I think after a point the LBS has to look within themselves and determine a few things...is the wayward spouse still a person you could love? Have they changed in a way that you can see a future together? Can you trust them again?

Then there are the personal questions about the person you are now.

All food for thought..

Keep being you.

Strength and Honor.

Mules

[AndrewP]

For as long as I have watched this site the big question to me was always how long does LBS stay in limbo? What's long enough, and how do you determine that? I don't know the answer to that question. I just think every person has their point. I remember back in the day a very well respected poster named FIB posed the question about DBing and whether it was all worth it for the LBS to go on for potentially years in limbo with what could be false hope or a long journey to reconciliation.

Someone on my thread gave me an excellent answer to this that I use regularly - sadly I can't recall who it was to give them proper credit.

The answer is 1 day.

This is a journey with many twists and turns and you can't know where it will end up. So what I try to do and what works for me is to wake up each day and decide if today is the day I'm going to stop waiting. If I feel myself wavering I search around for motivation, whether its Love, Duty, Compassion, History, it's all fuel to the fire that keeps me standing.

If on that one day I wake up and I am sure that I am done and can find no more fuel to keep me standing and know that no more fuel will be coming in the future, then on that day, I'll be done. That day hasn't come and may never.

This might not work for everyone, but it works for me.