Zues, I agree with a lot of your posts, but not so much with this one. I think that perhaps your looking at the bottom line..which is how to save a marriage and I respect that. But there is something about the dynamics in this thread that doesn't sit right.
Plus I'm feeling a bit sensitive here too
Originally Posted By: Zues126
Regarding the resentment about the police call...I've seen this pattern a lot. It reminds me of juju's WAH who was angry at her for getting the courts involved to get child support. Whether these actions were necessary or not isn't really the point. It's not hard to understand his point of view. It ties in to the card game from my first post.
I don't understand this comment. Why isn't it about whether these actions were necessary? Chickie was locked out of her home and separated from her children. Her husband had just thrown water at her, tried to throw a computer at her and physically hit her in the head? I would have been more worried about the safety of my children during that moment then the embarrassment husband would face. If he ended up hurting the kids, and she didn't call the police she would have to live with that.
This does not seem to be a tit for tat incident.
My husband walked out and would not give me child support because he felt like my parents were supporting us. I asked him on 2 occasions and both times he refused and then would make comments about how because I was asking him, reconciliation would not be an option and that he would take more time with son (in which case I would tell him, I would like for you to see son more). I even went to his mom, and while she offered to help pay for things she did not want to get involved and even mentioned court. It took me 5 months to take him to court and that was after I found out he was taking 9 day vacations somewhere traveling via plane while my parents were helping me so I could afford to take son to pool. My husband also was living rent and expense free with his mom and earns 3 figures, not accounting for moonlighting. My parents were paying for everything I could not.
Chippie If you would like, I could give you my old posting name and you can read about the agony I went through debating when and how to ask him for this support. I was a wreck for months because I was afraid it would affect his willingness to reconcile with me. This was also not done as a tit for tat. It was done because I was not being fair to my parents, myself, or my child by allowing this to continue.
It's 2016. What are some of the worst things people can say about a man? He's abusive, I'm not safe around him, he's a deadbeat dad...those words paint the picture of a guy straight out of the 50's wearing a wife beater, drinking too much beer, insulting his wife and bullying her around, and ignoring the kids. These days that's considered not just a deal breaker, but a deal breaker that leaves the woman talking to her friends about what a jerk her guy was, and setting him up to be the villain in her personal narrative, where the next guy that jumps in gets to be the white knight, the good guy who isn't like that. So when he sees you talking about him like you think he's abusive or a deadbeat, that is going to provoke a reaction.
XW did this to me. She called me abusive, said she was walking on eggshells, that she couldn't be herself when I was around. She couldn't feel safe. And much more. I was nothing like the guy in the description above. I certainly never laid hands on her, I've never been abused or abusive. But I know. "Not all abuse is physical". These days any time a woman is in emotional pain the husband is thought to be abusive. I don't know, I spent three years in a soul torturing painful sexless marriage, that's not abuse, in fact it always comes back to "she had a reason, probably because YOU were a bad husband..."
. Yes I agree. Calling the abuse card to justify walking away from a marriage and family is disgusting. My husband did that. He told me, his friends, and coworkers that I was verbally abusive. He misquoted things I said and discussed horrible gifts I gave him as proof of abuse. He also told me and mc he felt like he was walking on egg shells and I was given title by MC as being hyper sensitive. There are a lot of articles out there written for men that describe it as abusive when women nag or complain about things getting done. And you know what? For the longest time I really believed I was horribly abusive. I still question myself. I often felt frusturated and I am certain there were better ways I could have communicated. I am constantly asking myself " am I villifying? Am I being unfair?"
There was an incident before having my son... I was upset with husband because He was spending money on luxury car and season tickets and not saving money and not clearing his stuff so I could get the nursery finished. I am sure he perceived it as nagging and criticism. I was due in a few weeks and was getting really stressed but was super tired so the argument was occuring with me sitting reclined in bed. Husband took the book out of my hand and threw it at my stomach.
I was not scared, the book was a paper back but I was super surprised at his action. I asked him to leave, he apologized immediatly and I forgave quickly and he never left the apt. I don't know if this action is abusive. I don't know if chickies husband actions are abusive. But they were shitty. And humiliating.
A few months ago my husband brought up the fact that I actually once kicked him out in order to prove how horrible I was to him.
I have never brought this incident up and never will accept where I am anonymous. I am not looking for a white knight. My husband is not dangerous nor is he a physical threat to me. Just someone who could not figure out how to negotiate or argue appropriatly and perhaps needing control. But I will ask you this...
Did you or any husbands here act in ways comparable? I'm not talking about yelling or hitting a wall.
I am sure that my husband and chippies husband felt similarly to you and perhaps 90% of the nice guys here. But not fair to compare unless you also walked away, refused to support your kids, threw things at your spouse, I can name some more too but won't. Entirely different.
Just as we are entirely different from your wives.
Yes, there is abuse out there, it is extremely serious, and I'm not dismissing that. What I was though was more of the "Nice guy" type. If you look at the forum here you'll see that applies to like 90% of guys. It's because for decades we've been saying the guy from the 50's is a monster, so we're all trying to be the opposite. Sensitive, thoughtful, respectful, anything you say dear. All with the expectation that the wife will reciprocate, appreciate him for not being a 'bad guy', and that she'll meet his needs. When this doesn't happen he becomes hurt, then resentful, and often passive aggressive. What the husband wants more than anything else is for the wife to love and respect him, and to meet his needs. His behavior, be it guilting, punishing, avoiding, different forms of control, is often a desperation attempt to communicate what he needs from her. But instead of her saying "oh, love of my life, I can see you were in great pain because I wasn't doing xxxxx and you need that from me", she says "you are abusive, I don't feel safe with you, you need to leave!"
So calling the cops, getting the courts involved, all of these things...it is the most grievous character attack that can be made on a man, coming from the person who's viewpoint he cares about the most. I think it's a good thing he is so upset about the cops, that means he cares what you think. What I'm guessing he wants to hear is something along the lines of "H, you're a good guy. There are a lot of bad guys out there, you've always made sure to take care of me and the kids, and I was lucky to find you. I was upset when you did a/b/c, but in retrospect I can see that was a reaction to something else, and that you were really wounded by x/y/z and simply doing everything you could to communicate that to me. I'm sorry that x/y/z ever hurt you that much, and that instead of hearing you I blamed you and your reaction."
I wouldn't say that unless it was true. Yes maybe earlier in relationship when there was truth to it. But not when husband is behaving poorly.
If a husband wants respect it has to be earned. Throwing things like a child is not going to earn a husband respect. Learning and implementing good leadership skills will.
I tried that when he had left and it just served to prove to him how justified he was in his thinking and I think it makes ones word worth less. Kind of like praising a kid too much when they are doing things half assed. Instead I would get help from top counselors and social workers. If we had done that earlier there might have been a chance.
Looking back I am greatful i involved the courts. My only regret is that I did not do it sooner. I have started a college fund for my son. i have no idea where husbands money was going prior. I know it was not going for son or family though.
My brothers and I were raised with strict consequences. I made mistakes in my relationship, husband left. Husband refuses child support courts get involved. Husband locks out wife and throws stuff at her police get called. That's life. We have to be responsible for our actions.
Maybe you can't say that. Maybe he is an abusive dangerous animal. Maybe you can't provide x/y/z, or he's unreasonable for expecting it, maybe he's carrying open wounds and no matter what you do he is in pain and blaming you. I can't speak to any of that. But the bottom line is this. Validate both that he's a good guy, and the wounds you inflicted that he feels drove him to behave this way. Do that and he'll follow you around like a puppy dog.
What would he say drove him to that escalated state? Why did he feel he had to raise his voice? What weren't you hearing?
***REMINDER, I'm not suggesting that abuse is the victim's fault. Somewhere there's a line between abuse and normal pain/anger. If it's abuse, it's abuse, and you at some point walk away and protect yourself. Only thing is that you can't save a marriage if that's your call. So while we don't want to rug sweep or be in harm's way, we also don't want to jump the gun on that label when this dynamic plays out in many normal relationships.
