GAL going well. Need help with LRT and 180

[bigybiz]

Phoebe:

Thanks for your comments. I really feel for you and your struggles. Keep on the path, I'm sure you are doing great. I really liked my DB coach's comments about small consistent actions are key. Any help I can give you - please reach out.

I have not been able to get the messaging tool of this site to work.

I was beginning to doubt myself a little. I have no idea what is making an impression on my WW/WAW. So it's hard to know what is working. I'm willing to stretch myself and totally do what is not expected.

I'm doing OK at GAL and I think I'm getting ready to step it up. I realize that I can't just start doing what she has been resentful about. I need to do new things - hard to know what they are.


All DB/DR's let me know what works for you and throw some ideas at me/us.

[sandi2]

Apologies for hijack

Sandi if you read again, I lit a good friday votive for your beloved D and offer hugs.

V

You don't know how much it means to me that you remember, V. You are one of the most kind and sensitive persons I have had the good fortune to meet. To handle all the things in your life......and still remember the pain of others is a rare quality, however, you certainly have it. Those who have your love and compassion are very blessed, indeed. It does not go unnoticed by those of us here on the board. I hope you never lose it.

Thank you so much, sweet Vanilla.

[SH_]

Hey bigybiz,

I am right there with you trying to figure out what works for our unique situations. (Or so we think them to be unique) It's a challenge for us maybe, as reading the textbook steps don't always fit neatly into what we perceive is our experiences.

I understood/percieved sandi2 response as more of a caution to not seek out to many opinions or strategies because one may become stuck in analysis paralysis or may use conflicting strategies that can more conflict. Also I love her signature quote about doing what is right not what feels right, and getting results. This is something that I am trying to use as my guide.

IMHO take a few ideas that make sense to you even if they may feel contrary to what feels right and then try it. If it works, stick with it, if it does not, stay out of the cheeseless tunnel.

I know that is clear as mud, but guys like you and me that want step by step instructions may need to step out and go with some trial and error to get results.

Keep up the good fight and you will make it through a stronger better person for it.

[sandi2]

Thanks for your candid reply. No I'm not tallying votes - just trying to weigh all the opinions and apply them in my situation. I will admit that I get deeper and deeper into this sit I am seeing the light at the end of the tunnel and I totally get the process. I am so much more confident then I was a few months ago.

The post you put on Melo's thread was awesome. If I had read that two months ago I may not have been able to truly value it. So keep it coming.

I know MWD says keep doing what works. The problem is I don't know what works. So that's why I'm always looking for outside ideas. My little brain can only come up with so much.

Please keep it coming

Okay, I understand. And, I am glad to help where I can. But I hope you can see what I was saying about some posters we've had previously.

So, about the basement renovation, let me ask you something. If you renovated now, what would be your true motivation for doing it?

What had been your W's plans about the basement? I mean, was she intending to make into a family game room, a guest bedroom, a study office? How recently has she said anymore about wanting it done?

Subconsciously, I think a lot of LBH'S try to say it is for the kids and himself that he does something (that his W just happened to want for a long time), when truly, he is wanting to "do" something that will please her. He wants to have win her favor again. Maybe he's trying to make up for the years he neglected those type of things. Maybe he is still searching for a magic formula. Whatever it is, I do think it is normal for a LBH newcomer.

Btw, where is your grown D staying, since she moved back home?

[bigybiz]

Sandi2: Thanks for the reply.

The basement reno was supposed to happen last summer. Due to my financial mismanagement that did not happen. In the fall when the wheels started coming off our MR we almost started it again - but did not.

We will be adding a bathroom (we only have one) and making a room that could be a bedroom and/or a rec room depending on the flow of children in and out of the house. Right now it's semi finished.

She has not mentioned it - but she knows it's on the horizon. She plans to move out at the end of June and her intention is to walk away and leave the kids and I here.

What is my motivation - a second place to pee. It does need to be done and we will all benefit from it.

As we all know, I have been catching up on the house projects as a way to "change anything". Yes, it is making up for the years of neglect - guilty as charged. She has not acknowledged them but she see's them happening.

Yes, my daughter is sorta camping out. He stuff is in the MB with the WW/WAW and she is sleeping in the bunk bed with my youngest.

Am I trying to please the WW/WAW - not really am I trying to make regular consistent changes - yes.

M

[GWH]

bigbiz,

I feel for you People that do the in house separation. That has to be tough. Anyways hang in there brother, and i hope you find something that works for you.

[bigybiz]

GWH: Thanks for your note. Yes, the In house sep is hard. My heart cries out for her and as I work from home everything is reminder of my sit. I've read a few threads/post where people's spouse are hours away and/or they only see them for a few minutes every week or two. That also sounds hard.

I'm actually challenging myself to make some kind of change(s) every single day - I'm pretty good at the GAL but without my W here I would not be able to get a grasp on what I need to change inside me. Those changes are the hardest and I'm sure will take the longest to become evident to her. Yes, she may not see them - in fact I know she does not want to see them.

I'm hoping that she will see the changes (and hopefully she will make a couple on her side too) before the clock runs out and she moves out in June as she as stated.

[sandi2]

It really will not change her waywardness, whether you complete the basement or not. If you can do it for yourself, and have zero expectations in it affecting her decision to stay or leave.......then do it.

Look, I am all for self improvement in the LBH. If he needs to make changes in order to be a better man, father, and H, then he should. But here is what I have seen play out in M's with a WW. The LBH comes to the board, and he is told to look at himself and what he has contributed to the breakdown of the MR. (I have given that same advice over and over again). But then the H goes into overdrive, trying to make up for the past and hoping his W will see his changes and decide to stay. And how many newcomers worry about their W separating and not seeing his changes? He either doesn't understand or else we are focusing too much on inconsequential changes. It just seems there are too many LBH'S who are missing the mark. No matter how much we say to do it for themselves, they still want to do it to win her back. And that's the mentality that causes them to put on the super husband cape and ends up being a servant in a loveless M, rather than the man who makes a change in the relationship.

Here's what I have concluded after observing the board and in real life cases for many years. Those are not the type of changes that affect the heart of a wayward woman. At one time, changing his bad habits would have positively affected her heart, but after she is in rebellion against him and the MR...........it's not going to have a big impact on her feelings. There have been numerous stories where the WW would tell her H that she saw how hard he was working, and she recognized how he had improved. But guess what? It did not change her heart. Enveribly, the WW left or continued her waywardness under his roof. It did not change her feelings for him.

The type of changes I have seen work for both the man and his WW's feelings, are the attitude and interrrelationship changes. When the man changes the relationship DYNAMICS. Until he changes that part.........he could kill himself trying to do enough to make up for the past, but it won't affect her.

I think when we tell a newcomer to look at her complaints and evaluate himself, the end results is him feeling guilty. Then he gets the idea he can improve himself enough that it will appease her, and thereby, fixing the M. That simply won't happen with a wayward. Speaking for myself, I intend to try harder in carefully explaining what type of changes he needs to make.......if I know how to communicate that message. He does need to work on himself, but the problem I'm seeing is that most LBH'S with a wayward take on the whole responsibility and blame for the M breakdown, and so then he's ready to prove what he can do and how great he can be..........only, she doesn't care. It doesn't cause her to realize she really loves him! I am not saying he should not try to make personal improvements, just don't expect it to fix the problems the MR has now. He needs to improve himself, and combine those improvements with changing the dynamics in the MR.

I know you have this problem, b/c you are thinking how it will affect her and the MR. It isn't going to affect the MR by redoing the basement. It may relieve some tension from the household by having a second bathroom while everyone's trying to get ready to leave for the day.......but that's about all.

Her problem, now, has nothing to do with the basement. Her problem is her wayward feelings toward you, and they have gotten out of hand. Her bad feelings accumulated over a period of time, and now she is rebelling. You could buy her an entire new house, and although she might be excited over the new house.......and even show some signs that appear to be happiness.........it is short lived, if the relationship dynamics have not changed.

[bigybiz]

Sandi2:

Thanks - I'm proud to say that your advice is what I expected. I'm going ahead with the basement - because I need it not because it will make any difference to her. In fact she might hate the construction etc and move out - That's a risk - but I'm not scared.

I am making the attitudinal changes too. Since I read your post on Melo's thread, I strive to make sure every word I say to her - I look her square in the eye. That was a game changer for me. I feel so much more "powerful" when I talk to her.

As you know I'm quite proud of the changes I'm making

GAL - that's easy for me. Exercise, spending lots of time with the kids, involving her on my terms, socializing, got my motorcycle learners permit, bought a new suit, etc

Spiritual - Many times a day I ask God to change me into the man he needs me to be, I've asked for forgiveness for my past wrongs and moved on. I'm making sure I don't do them again or trying.

Practical/Physical - cleaning up old messes, catching up on house projects, starting and finishing new projects, decluttering, cooking, cleaning more than I've ever been, walking softly in the house, not filling the air with my voice.

The attitudinal and the dynamics stuff - that's where I need the most help. So keep the info coming. I reread the DB and DR books, my DB coach has recommended other books that I'm reading to.

Am I ready to go on without her. Between you and me - I'm getting there. But, I'd prefer not too.

[bigybiz]

Help, Help, Help. I just inked a deal to by a used "intro" motorcycle - very small 250cc. How do I tell her. She still lives in our home, she is still my life insurance beneficiary.

Do I just say - BTW - I bought a bike? I'm not asking her permission. There will be some $ issues.

All ideas welcome