What I don't understand is why you did it and immediately say it's a cheap lesson learned.
It is only learned when you actually start handling it in a different manner.
Hey Sandi,
This is very conflicting for me, probably a little emotional last night. She has been requesting this since the start of S, originally I didn't wanted to not enable her by simply giving to her. However; now she has essentially figured out a way to do it and it is fair for her at this point be able to have something to make a home for my kids while there. I know this won't bring her any closer to coming home, but if I continued to hold out it would be pointless and only look spiteful and controlling. Also, probably something she wasn't expecting me to do.
I also kind of see this as a sign of progress with detaching and one step closer to dropping the rope.
I guess the lesson learned is I haven't yet learned. Thank you for calling me out on that.
Almost convinced myself today that I should just go file. This process [censored]. I can honestly say that every time I see her, I seem to care about her less. That scares me. I still love the "US" in my mind, but i am not sure if that part of her will ever return.
Boxing up her stuff, I found some old photos of us. She was a completely different person just two years ago. I look at her now and I see someone totally different. I can't describe it, but I see sadness. I found old letters that she had written to me, but never gave me. I saw her thoughts, and it was confusing. She has for so long, even before I was in the picture felt misunderstood. She felt alone and lost in her mind. I think anxiety and depression have always plagued her. Iknow I am not perfect, but I am being blamed for something that has been there for a long time.
I saw a portal to the past, where she was struggling with being a mom, wife, adult and trying to do something about it but it doesn't reflect what i remember in reality. it was a surreal experience to find these letters. She used to say that I didn't communicate my feelings, but i see she was hiding so much about hers. I wish she would have given me the notes she wrote me (good ones, apologies, angry ones). I wish she would have told me the way my actions made her feel both happy and sad, And not just the things i was doing "Wrong". I as a man am not the best at expressing how I feel. As the husband, I thought that i should be stability and confidence. To shield her from the struggles and not express my fears. We got pregnant early and in our early days we struggled with $$, life etc. I didn't want her to know that things were tough. i didn't want to burden her with the things I felt were my responsibility, my burden to carry.
It is weird to see that her issues have plagued her for so long, and i am the scapegoat. Not perfect, but she had a lot of baggage. She also really isn't anywhere close to the anger that I see so many WW expressing. I think it is guilt masking it. No ILYBNILWY to date. No I never loved you, no I never should have xxx. Really nothing.
We had the "Talk" with kids to explain her new apt. She said mommy and daddy argue and mommy needed a place so that she wasn't so "Frowny". She said, mommy needed a place for. "a little while". When asked when she would come home, she just didn't answer the question directly and answered another posed my child.
This is probably the 5th week in a row that she told me she was going to file, and still nothing.
I guess I just continue to DB to the best of my abilities and learn to do it better. I read the threads of other DB'ers who have been here before and i wonder, "once a WW, always a WW?"
I read the threads of other DB'ers who have been here before and i wonder, "once a WW, always a WW?"
I don't believe it is that simple. It depends on what the woman experiences and if the man gets complacent after they reconcile. Now I don't read all the threads of those who "return" to the boards, but the ones I have read tell how they did not require their WW to do the necessary work in order to have a successful, healthy MR. Some men were too eager to get her back under any conditions. The issues and her waywardness were usually swept under the rug and no type of family therapy was used. The other side I often see are those H's who just got lazy and stop enforcing his new changes and fell back into his old habits.
So, no it's not once a WW always a WW. It depends greatly on the woman herself, and on how the man deal with her waywardness.
You are wanting to give up and get out of the pain. So, you see filing for divorce as a quick end to what hurts. It's your decision to make, but I don't think you have the right motivation by trying to believe she can't change her waywardness. You may be right, and there may be so many deep issues in her that she won't ever be that girl she once was. I don't know that any of us are, but that's not to say we can't be good again. I do believe most people with this type of baggage needs professional guidance, and the couple would definitely need it to make things work again. But, you can't force her. She has to want the help for herself.
My advice is to not take a wayward back until there is sufficient signs that she has made vast changes/improvements, and is willing to do whatever it takes to make the M successful. If her attitude and heart has not changed, do not take her back, hoping things will be different.
The work never stops. You cannot get lazy and fall back into old habits and think things will have a different ending the second time around.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Thank you Sandi. I needed your post. I know that filling is not what I want. I just want this pain to go away, but that's not going to happen with either scenario. You are right, it will be hard not to just take her back right away if she is still WW and just having a hard time in the real world.
The gift of time is so true. I need to use this time to become stronger, more confident in myself and truly believe that I deserve better so if/when the day comes I can recognize if she is really willing to do anything for the M and not just convince myself that she is.
This is out of my control. I can only control myself. People can change if they want to, and maybe this is the new her or maybe this is just her right now. Maybe the future her will be a better wife, mother, friend, partner, etc. from this experience. Who knows. I just need to DB, improve myself, work on my issues and keep the door open while regaining her respect. That way my next R (w/wo her) WILL be better.
"It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!" <--So true!
Those men who have a WW that is extremely bitter, cold, angry, and vindictive, may need to get a lawyer who has a reputation for getting everything possible for his client. The LBH needs a lawyer who will fight to gets rights for the father, spousal alimony, physical child support, or whatever he can get.
The LBH who has WW that seems to be more dangerous, or threatening........or if the H stands to lose a lot and suspects she will go after all he has..........needs to get a lawyer who is not afraid to go after her.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
So, I am thinking about having a family member pickup the kids from her when we do the swaps. It would be easier for me to do it this way, but not 100% I am not doing this to just get a reaction from her.
This would be more inline with going dark, but eliminate the interactions that we do have where I can act "as if" and look nice/smell nice etc.
Thoughts on the pros and cons of daily interaction vs. absence?
Well, I now see that I have no choice but to file for D to protect my children. WW has and continues to make choices that are not in their best interest. Her justification for her decisions are absurd. Based on what I have learned about a WW, I think it is probably safe to say that her actions will only become more and more selfish and her lifestyle will continue to spiral further and further from that of a mature, responsible mother. This is not to say that I am done DR'ing, because I am not.
