Still hoping for progress II

[vise82]

Hey

Just stopping by and I see you stated that you were not ready for hard core yet.

I too had that thinking.

It is not an easy thing to give your life over to the advise of a stranger and trust them that what they say will give you the best chance at saving your MR.

Just be careful with that. Most advise that feels wrong maybe the right thing to do. Don't hold back too much.

I also read that you said you are worried that your W is easing you into this. My W has said that to my face as we were in house for 9 months now. There may be some truth to it. But is that a bad thing.

[daybyday]

I appreciate ALL advice because it may not apply right at this moment, but later down the line I can draw from such things. I don't believe anyone trying to advise me is trying not to help. All of it helps, I just may not be to the point of using it right now.

I am not naïve enough to believe that WAW may be WW. If and when that is discovered, it is a different mind set and ball game.

I guess the easing is not a bad thing. At least we may have more time than if they went straight to the D. Nobody knows how they will feel with the passage of time. Especially if there is still love there. I relate it to that annoying friend at work that we all have. We choose not to be around them because they do things that annoy us. But if that person were to recognize what annoys us, change those things for the better, I for one could start to become friends with that person.

That's why 180's and GAL are so important to us right now. I have a long way to go with both but am doing well in general.

[sandi2]

I have a question about the spaces where WAS used to have their stuff. How did you all do with that? I am reluctant to use the closet space, vacant dresser drawers etc. for thinking that if she were to come over for something that she would see my things there and think that I have moved on already. What do you all think? It is symbolic to me but it is easily undone.

Why are you still in that frame of mind, worrying that she will think you have moved on? She needs to believe that you are moving forward, and doing just fine without her. I think it would be a fantastic idea to move your things to the empty spaces. She needs to get the message loud and clear that she has set you free and so you are available to do whatever you so desire. She left the home you provided for her, so she has no right to expect you to keep her spot vacant........ just in case.

This may not be how you feel, but I am trying to tell you what the WW has to realize, in order for her thought process to start working normal again. Believing she could lose you, could be the best formula to jump start that process. But as long as she thinks you are home pining away for her..........she feels smug and secure.

I am going to say this to all H's who have a WW. As long as guys play "melty man" (as Starsky would say), they will live in their own prison of fear. They will always fear what the W may think! Those guys will continue to be at the mercy of their manipulative WW. They may call it by names such as "being friends", "cooperation", "standing", "doing it for the kids", "co-parenting", or whatever description they wish to call their melty-man ways, but it all boils down to the fact he has the nice-guy syndrome. I am not saying those examples I listed are wrong. I am saying that a lot of nice-guy types hide behind them. And for the record, we do have men on this board who do not have the NGS, yet have a WW. So all LBH'S are not nice-guys, just to clarify........it just seems the majority are.

[daybyday]

I understand what you are saying. But in an earlier response on sandi's reflections you explained a distinct difference in the way you db between WAW and WW. At this time, and I say that knowing what could be or may have already happened, but at this time I have no evidence of EA or PA.

So I am trying to db as a WAW. If I am wrong and in your opinion you think she is wayward them I am confused by your earlier advice. I am not trying to be contrary by any means. Your advice is so valuable to me and everyone else.

You had said that with WAW you give space and try to gain friendship back. With WW you proceed differently. Just confused that's all.

[daybyday]

Sandi, I got to thinking after I responded above. It really wouldnt matter would it if WAW or WW? She still needs to realize she may lose me so filling her spaces is a step that way. Am I right in that assumption?

[daybyday]

Cadet could you combine my two back to back posts? Thank you

[sandi2]

I went back to review your threads and to find your post to me in my thread, b/c I didn't want to mistake your sitch with someone else. I will admit that the user names and stories get very similar and there's always that chance of a mixup.

To refresh for any other readers hete, this is our conversation from my thread:

Great stuff Sandi. Thanks for such depth. Wouldn't alot of this apply to WAW also? I mean even though WAW may not have acted I would bet that most have thought about affairs and that would be a prompt for wanting out. So for us H's waiting for them to come around, they could be playing us just like WW do. I guess GAL is as much about gaining your respect for yourself as it is for WAW or WW respecting you. But you TRULY have to GAL for yourself and NOT to win back spouse. That is very difficult.

Thank you! Yes, a lot of it would be applicable to a WAW situation, just as MWD tells in her book. The reason the W walked away would probably determine what the H would do. When I think of a woman, who has no ill intent in her heart, leaving her M behind and waking away broken hearted and defeated.........I picture a woman who is in pain and/or sees no hope in things ever getting better. There are cases where the H is just too awful to live with, and she can't take it any more. It just seems that the majority of the stories that come here involve a wayward spouse.

I also think that ocassionally there are some women who leave that are just really discouraged and believe they could be happier starting over, or whatever, that has no signs of waywardness. I think these women may few and far apart......but I believe they exist.

Whenever I think in terms of a woman "playing" her H, I see hints of a wayward wife. She may not be riotous or in an A, but she might be completely selfish, spoiled, and have a sense of entitlement. Hey, there some real b'tches who are not in affairs.

But don't confuse this with a woman who has sorrowfully given up on her H ever contributing to the MR and walks away b/c she has lost all hope. She would not be "playing" him b/c she is done with him. Her H would probably have to make some life long changes before she would be convinced they were legit. If all her attraction for him had faded, he may have to work hard and long to get that back again. However, it is what is in her heart that led her to leave him that determines if she was wayward or if she is a hurting WAW.

In my mind the two types are easy to distinguish, but that doesn't mean I am that great and explaining it the differences.

Sandi, I got to thinking after I responded above. It really wouldnt matter would it if WAW or WW? She still needs to realize she may lose me so filling her spaces is a step that way. Am I right in that assumption?

I am relieved that you've figured it out before I send this post, but in case others may be confused, I will post it anyway.

[daybyday]

Thank you Sandi.

[Uphill]

First I'm going to say, I am not 100% up to date on your sitch. But in reading the last two pages, I have something to share. For a few months, I left everything in the house as she left it. She would come in and make herself at home whenever we would have a kid swap here. One day I had finally had enough of looking at pictures and things how they were so I rearranged the house. I won't say I tore walls out but I made it MINE. Replaced all of her pictures with new ones of S4 and myself.

I know DB is not about getting a reaction, but this hit home for her. She saw the pictures gone. Saw the couches moved. New rugs. Just a whole new feel to the home! That day is the first I saw any kind of genuine disgust from her towards anything I have done. It made her realize that it was no longer our home, it was mine.

It took a few days, but finally she mentioned what was bothering her (I already knew). Said it shows she was never anything to me. That was my chance to just let her know that none of this was my choice. But it is the hand I was dealt, so I have to accept what she wants and move forward as if we are done...

So I continued. Room by room. I have the whole closet. Both dressers. Both bathroom cabinets. Everything. As I went through the house it was tough, but now the bitterness of living in the home I bought for us isn't so painful either. It looks the same but her "touch" isn't on it anymore. It's mine. I decided where things are.

[daybyday]

Good deal Uphill. That sounds great. I'm gonna start doing that little by little.

Had the first kid swap today. She invited me in to her apt and the first thing she says is "wow! You look thinner! have you lost more weight?" I said yes. She said how much? I said 40lbs and then i quickly chnged subject back to S13. She was anxious to show me her used couch and chair and told me to sit and see how comfortable almost like she wanted me to visit. I got up and said we gotta get going. Out we went. Strange interaction for WAW.

On another note, I posted a recent pic on FB last night and got a lot of good feedback and likes. Mostly from girls who I consider attractive. WAW liked it too. I can't quite figure why she would like it. Either A. She is "marking" her territory even though she ILYBNILWY. or B. Trying to keep up appearances or C. She genuinely liked it.

My MIL knows the whole sitch and she liked and commented "my great looking SIL" WTH? It's hard not to read into stuff.
I'll take it for what it is worth. I got some good feedback from pretty ladies and right now my ego sure needed it. It feels good for a change.