Now what?/ One Day at a Time

[melweb]

I know, I know, Sotto. I see your point. I just don't want that b.i.t.c.h to win!! Is that wrong and childish?? I don't want her to think I have crawled into a corner in the fetal position as she steals my husband away. Won't it frost her a$$ knowing we are down there together. I have zero expectations that it will save M, and I will certainly not engage in any sexual relations unless and until he ends A and recommits to this M. uughhhh....

I have decided not to contact OW H. I have my own problems. I think this A has not a snowballs chance in hell-- too many things going against it! But I am with you; I will be the bigger, more mature, rational person in this little love triangle. One of has to be. And who knows--she could be just telling my H want he thinks he wants to hear. I don't know, and I don't care.

I really do appreciate all your help and advice. This MLC beast/affair has me really confused, sad and angry. Can you be all three at once?

[job]

Yes, you can be all three, i.e., sad, angry and confused.

I want to say this...you are not in a competition w/the ow. You are far better than she is because you aren't committing adultery, nor are you lying to your spouse. You have more self respect and trust me....you are the prize. Hold your head up, back straight and know that no matter what happens, your h is a fool to be searching outside the marriage.

[ciluzen]

Yes, you can be all three at once. And more! But as much as we want to blame the other woman, and REALLY want to hurt her or show her, she is NOT our problem. She is a symptom of HIS problem.

By the way, I hear Tahiti is very nice. Or the Bahamas. Or anywhere. Maybe even another resort in Mexico. With a Margarita and lobster and mariachis and a texted picture of all that and a bevvy of hot guys salsa dancing around you. Just sayin'...GAL your huarachis off!

[melweb]

Thanks job. I so needed to hear that. I think its starting to hit me because you have me crying with your kind and supportive words. Plus I had a tough evening. H wants to have a drink before dinner ( we usually do... Or did). I oblige. But dang if that man cannot just STFU about R. I can't even remember all that was said, but more of the same ol', same ol'. " Its over, its been over for years, he needs passion." Blah blah blah. I try to be logical( oh why oh why do I do that?) and say he didn't give us enough time, it was only a month and a half. That feelings change as proven by that month and a half. Again, I can't even remember all I said, but I knew I needed to STFU and just kept going. Not blasting him, but trying to be sensible. Smh!!! Clearly it was no use. Went in one ear and out the other. I also noticed his wedding ring is off

We have dinner together. Convo is good and free of R talk. In fact, an outsider would have never known that his lying, cheating a$$ is leaving me. He helps pick up dinner, and at least I remembered to leave the kitchen first. But failed miserably at DBing tonite otherwise.

Cil-- you are too funny. I would love mothing more than to GAL with the cabana boys. This trip is bought and paid for by H's company.

[melweb]

Man, did I sleep like crap last nite!! I even took an all natural OTC pill and then a simply sleep by Tylenol. I need to find something that works!!

Ok, so some things have dawned on me, especially after last nites R talk. He is just regurgitating the same lines from the first BD. ILYBNILWY, I will always love you, its been over for years, I need passion. Blah blah blah. Not reading anything into these statements as I have heard them all before, just now I have an A to deal with somehow. I know I am not in competition with her but it sure feels like it. I am going to do everything I did that worked before. Be a woman only a fool would leave!

Also, like before his actions don't match his words. For example, (and this might seem trivial to you guys) but during reconciliation he would leave my coffee cup, spoon and creamer, and sometimes a love note, on the counter in the morning. I had told him it was those kinds of little things that meant a lot and made me feel loved. Well, he did it this morning, minus the love note. Again, NOT reading anything into this, but its the kind of mixed message he keeps sending. And I mean, why?? Why do that at all?? Guilt? Ok, but why that particular thing that he knows what it means.

As far as the dang R talks he keeps persuing, I need something that will stop my roll. Any suggestions? I start of really good DBing, validating, listening, eye contact, engaged, then I say to myself 'I'm just gonna say this ONE thing' but clearly I cannot say just ONE thing!! Ugh. I am not getting angry or hostile, but trying to be logical/ reasonable with a very illogical, unreasonable man.

I know you guys are going to call me out on this, but in my heart, I feel like an S or D is not what he really wants. That he thinks he has the easy part done by telling me its over. But we have not told S15 yet, and he has not packed a bag and walked away from his family. That can't be easy.

I know this is his journey to take and I can't stop it, or slow it down, or make it go quicker. And even my IC said that he may have to leave in order to realize all that he is giving up and leaving.

Gee, now who is regurgitating? Sorry. I guess 3 hours of sleep makes one kind of loopy.

[job]

Sometimes they do things w/o even thinking about it and then again, he may not consider what he's doing something that would be called one of your love languages.

I think your h still a bit confused about what he wants to do. He may be still in the stage where he thinks it is over and continues to say this to convince himself, you and others. If he's pushed a bit, he may say and/or do something else about a separation/divorce...but since you have pretty much left him alone, he's quite content to say this stuff. He reminds me a bit of HaWho's h in the fact that he's packed nothing nor has he moved out. There's no way to tell what he wants because his actions do not match his words. Trying to mind read, over analyze, etc. will drive you batty.

I will agree w/your IC, he may have to leave in order to truly realize what he is giving up...but he will need to leave on his own.

[ciluzen]

Quoting you,

"Also, like before his actions don't match his words. For example, (and this might seem trivial to you guys) but during reconciliation he would leave my coffee cup, spoon and creamer, and sometimes a love note, on the counter in the morning. I had told him it was those kinds of little things that meant a lot and made me feel loved. Well, he did it this morning, minus the love note. Again, NOT reading anything into this, but its the kind of mixed message he keeps sending. And I mean, why?? Why do that at all?? Guilt? Ok, but why that particular thing that he knows what it means."

Habit? Comfort? Guilt? My H has done things like that as well. Pours me a glass of wine and brings it to me (his LL is AOS), acts like everything is fine. Mixed messages because they have mixed feelings.

"As far as the dang R talks he keeps persuing, I need something that will stop my roll. Any suggestions? I start of really good DBing, validating, listening, eye contact, engaged, then I say to myself 'I'm just gonna say this ONE thing' but clearly I cannot say just ONE thing!! Ugh. I am not getting angry or hostile, but trying to be logical/ reasonable with a very illogical, unreasonable man."

When you find something that works, let me know, ok? I'm awesome until the dam breaks and I have to SAY something. I guess the point is, its all about them right now, so it does no good to say anything that isn't validating. I am reading a book right now, I Don't Want To Talk About It about male depression. Very insightful and helpful in understanding our H's situation. It might help us with the way to approach those convos.

"I know you guys are going to call me out on this, but in my heart, I feel like an S or D is not what he really wants. That he thinks he has the easy part done by telling me its over. But we have not told S15 yet, and he has not packed a bag and walked away from his family. That can't be easy."

I won't call you out on this. My H BD, moved out, and filed all within 6 months. The night I got the papers he admitted that he didn't WANT a D, that he never pictured being D, and had a hard time even saying the word. He wasn't happy, and wouldn't even say he was happier after moving out. Just felt that it was his best chance at happiness down the line . Problem is, if this is MLC (based on depression) or is just plain old male depression, then they will find out that their sadness will not go away with the bandaids they are trying to create. We can't tell them they are depressed (they won't "hear" it) and we can't tell them that they are getting rid of the one person that now understands what is going on and would love them unconditionally. They have to work it out or seek help on their own. Unfortunately, male psyche being what it is, they want to hold it in and carry on. Depression is a "wimpy man's disease" and what man wants to see himself as a wimp? Also, they don't like feeling like a failure, and getting a D is a failure. This adds to the depression. D@mned if you do, d@mned if you don't = MLC. All we can do is be the lighthouse.

[HaWho]

Hi Melweb - your h does remind me a bit of mine. He gave me the speech over and over again and he kept threatening that he was getting an apartment.

My h's tag line was that he needed a woman to look at him "meaningfully." And after BD #2 he went through this period where he kept telling me he had no feelings for me anymore. He kept doing it to the point that I avoided rooms he was in.

One day we were in the car together and again, out of the blue came the "I feel nothing for you" speech. I finally turned to him and said calmly "I got the memo the first time." And when he walked out of the car I rolled down my window and said, with a smile, "by the way, it's not normal to keep telling someone that over and over again." He looked shocked. Not sure if he didn't realize the repetition and/or did not realize how weird it was. Not good DBing on my part as you are supposed to validate, but sane people can only take so much craziness.

Your h reminds me of mine because mine was what I would call "a cake eating dreamer." He had all sorts of dreams as to how this was all going to go. And he thought I was going to go along with it (all part of his dream).

You can't reason with the MLCer. It's time to go into roommate mode. Stop talking. I promise you, you will be more powerful through listening. You will start to see things you will never see by reasoning with him. I began by biting my lip as he talked until it became second nature to just listen.

Here's something I did that did work. Once I got the gist of what he was saying (and it was repetition) I kind of yawned and said "ok, well I have some stuff to do" and I left him in the middle of his soliloquy. Or I would get up and say "ok, well, I'll let you get in with your night." I stopped staying for the whole speech and I was always the one who left first. It did shock him. To this day I am DONE with r talks. No temptation on my part to ever ask anymore. I heard months and months of garbage.

As for the OW, you have told him there can't be a marriage with 3 people. But your actions need to reflect your boundaries. Otherwise he thinks he can have it all. It's an either/or scenario here and your actions need show to this. Either he wants a married woman who cheats or he wants the wife he married. And right now, there is no way he wants you. No MLCer is ready for his spouse right now, he's too broken. And so, if for right now he chooses the OW, you haven't lost ANYTHING if you have retained your self respect.

Regarding the trip to Mexico, often what I did in the early days before I had regained my own strong boundaries was, I thought: what advice would I give my kids? What if my kids knew this and were watching me?"

It's not about winning him back or beating OW. It's about: who am I and who do I become in the midst of craziness? Do you really want THIS version of himself back? Do yo believe he can just shake this off in a few months. Time to apply lots of logic where there is none.

[job]

HaWho,
Very well said. I couldn't have said it better!

[HaWho]

Thanks Job. You have helped me so much in my life, you have NO idea. Or, actually you probably do because I was such a hot mess at the start of all this!

One last thing Melweb. In case you are not familiar with my sitch, when I say my h kept threatening to get an apartment, he wasn't just going to move there altogether. No no. He wanted to live there a few nights a week and live here a few nights!!! Something told me he wouldn't be here on Friday or Saturday nights. LOL!!

Ah, those cake eating dreams . . .