When the goal is positivity

[Zues126]

You're right Painter. He has a responsibility to provide for his children, and if he isn't willing to, she can't allow them to suffer because she is afraid of hurting his feelings. Strong boundaries and bold action are needed.

My main point is that it doesn't have to be either doormat or combative. It can be collaborative.

Your H does the same thing my H does - puts the cart before the horse and turns the blame around. *HE* could have supported his children voluntarily... Why should it be on you to give him an ultimatum, threatening legal action? Is he saying he has to be threatened to do the right thing? Sounds like he's venting his anger over being forced to do something he didn't want to do, and making it your fault that he financially deserted his family.

This gives me pause. I'm not sure that taking unilateral legal action, threatening to do so, or dropping ultimatums is a constructive response. If Julie does this, even if she's right to protect her children's needs, she's wrong in how she handles the approach.

Her and her husband are not as far apart as they seem. They both want to be able to provide for themselves, they both want each other to be ok, and they both want the children to be taken care of. Those are the main priorities, and they are mutual. Why not start from there and build on it?

Sure, each of them have different ideas on what that looks like, they each have different fears about how those differences might impact them. All the more reason to deescalate, move slowly, and try to establish communication in which those similarities are recognized, the fears are voiced, validated by both parties, and they work together to find solutions that are ok to both of them. I'm guessing they can't do it alone, so a counselor or mediator is a great idea. I agree this is hard stuff, but this is also a great chance to show that she can manage through this maturely.

I am divorced, and I know firsthand how scary it can be. There was also at one point a severe distrust for XW, she did some things that were deceptive and extremely low trust. I get the conflict between "I want this to work" and "If it doesn't I don't want to be the one that gets screwed". In the end I truly believe there are ways to protect yourself without being confrontational or adversarial.

For me, I got a lawyer, an IC, and a DB coach. I took no action that didn't involve the approval of all three. As a result I never lost any sleep over whether I was too firm or too weak. I followed the lead of experts that had seen this thousands of times. And I made it clear that my priorities were R if possible, good co-parenting relationship if not, all while ensuring that BOTH me and XW would be ok and have a good relationship with our children. As it turns out we didn't R, but we do co-parent alright, and we are both going to be ok. I had many opportunities that I could've escalated things, but I'm glad I didn't.

The last thought of my ramble has to do with recovering from an affair. I was thinking about this earlier. The betrayed party feels tremendously insecure and needy, and as a result can overwhelm the affair-haver with constant questions and demands for reassurance. They FEEL needy, and they WANT reassurance. They think that because the affair that caused their feelings was such an injury to them, their sole job should be to not leave, and their partner should be responsible for proving an endless amount of reassurance whenever they want it. That is not the case. It's not enough for the betrayed to stay. They have to stay AND manage their neediness for reassurance. They can express those needs at appropriate times, and it's fair for the betrayer to know those needs exist and make it a priority. But just because they betrayed doesn't mean it's all on them to make the recovery work.

I bring this up because just because one party is wrong and generates hurt in the other party, doesn't mean they are free of responsibility for working through that hurt and responding maturely. Julie is here, WAH is not. Trust me...if he were here, I'd have a thing or two to tell him about what he's putting Julie through!

Thanks for talking about it Painter. One thing is for sure. She should never let fear interfere with her taking bold action to preserve herself or her family.