Looking for Advice--Please Read

[Zues126]

JB, I love your post.

The one idea that keeps coming to my mind is this- a marriage is a forever commitment.

You said: I don't know if now after being apart for 5 years and with the evolution we have both made over the six years we have not been together, if we could make it work.

I think it's a shame so many marriages fail without having that opportunity.

I'm not putting words in your mouth now, just talking about me. What I loathe is society's view that you leave a marriage because it is a destructive cycle, go through a period of rebirth and rediscovery, mature, learn how to be a better partner, then try to rebuild a new marriage with someone else later. To me that isn't marriage. You can call it a marriage. But my definition of marriage is a lifelong commitment, so we're using the same word for two different things.

I'm not suggesting any action that reinvests in a destructive cycle. But I think giving up is wrong.

Ginger challenged me the other day about staying in a relationship that is dysfunctional or has emotional abuse. I don't have all the answers. But I have some ideals. One of them goes like this- why does the answer have to be divorce?

Say someone gets to the point where they feel threatened, or unable to be themselves without fear in their own household. Say that person gets to the point when they feel it is negatively impacting the kids, themselves, etc. OK. For now I won't debate what that limit should be. But suppose, instead of filing divorce, killing the relationship, moving on, dating other people, and remarrying...suppose that person just separated, got some space, and lived singly, raising their kids, staying legally married. Suppose that person set some firm boundaries to protect themselves.

If M is a lifelong commitment, doesn't that mean you give that person those 5 years to see if they are capable of that change?

From what I've seen on these forums people feel very needy and desperate to be loved by someone, and entitled to that. It's part of their life plan, that someone will treat them the way they want to be treated. So the whole 'should I give up' is a constant game of evaluating the chances of their spouse doing for them what they feel entitled to.

I don't know. I feel like society thinks I'm crazy for suggesting that there is purpose and meaning in remaining in a committed relationship indefinitely with no guarantee of reciprocation. So many people talk about moving on and finding someone that will...fill in the blank. Someone that will grow with them. Someone they can be themselves with. Someone more mature. Etc. To me that sounds crazy.

I have used this comparison before but it's been a long time and the newer posters haven't heard it. I view a marriage as a commitment equal to choosing to have kids. Suppose a person had a child, and they thought their child would be a football player like them, but they don't want to play football. Suppose that child had emotional problems and there was a dysfunctional relationship. Should the parent give the child up for adoption and try again to have a kid they want? Most people would think that's outrageous...but when it comes to spouses, it's encouraged, "good for you, you deserve better".

I get that if your spouse divorces you, moves on, starts a new relationship, remarries...well, you move on as well. The same way that if your child ran away from home and fell off the planet, well, I could see considering starting another family someday. But until that happens, I guess I just don't see why more people don't stay true to their partner. Give them a year. Give them five. See what is possible.

Some of the people on this forum that have saved their marriages stood by for a number of years and endured multiple affairs, in fact entire relationships in between. Mr. Bond comes to mind. It's pretty inspiring. We hear stories of people remarrying after 5 or 10 years. I didn't always get it, but I do. Each of us gets to define what marriage means to us. Our spouses can do what they want to do, but we get to decide who we want to be, what we believe in. And to me the desire to jump into a new relationship to get what we feel we deserve is along the same lines of those that walked in the first place.

Lady, JB, this was more just stuff I've been thinking a lot about. JB's words are more relevant to your current sitch. I'm all about being detached, having no expectations, and letting go in the sense of not needing the R to work for you to appreciate the life you've been given. Whatever gives your family the best chance at health and happiness I'm all for. But if you do let go, I'd encourage you to let go in a way that involves you giving him space to take his journey, and not in a way that involves you building a different life that closes doors behind you. I don't believe in closing doors on a spouse.