WW, My Addiction, Patience, and HOPE

[SciDad]

Trumpet,

You're not alone. No papers are filed, but I've been put on notice that if things don't seem better after a certain amount of time she will "stop trying." From my end it's hard to see her efforts, but whatever...

I'll try to reply with more thought provoking insights in a little bit, but I wanted to leave a quick note before I get pulled away.

Stay strong and keep doing the work - it WILL pay out, I swear

[sandi2]

she know's I'm focused on the marriage, and that selfless love is how a great marriage works. She's heard that before at marriage retreats, she's just in denial mode

I'm going to be very blunt here. I don't think it is denial, Trumpet. Yes, she's still in the OM's camp, and as long as she is, she's not really "wanting" all the stuff that make great marriages work. I think that may be what a lot of guys don't get through their heads. The WW does not want it. Even while she's going through withdrawal from the A/OM, she does not desire a MR with you, b/c that would require feelings that she doesn't have yet.

I am not just trying to find fault with your Pastor. I think he is like a lot of counselors who give advice as though the WW is 100% back into wanting the MR. Just b/c she's there with you in body, doesn't mean she is there emotionally or in spirit. There is a difference between doing something based on a decision and doing something out of feelings. I may not be the best at describing how the Pastor's suggestion appealed to her feelings, but it put pressure on her. She did not see it being helpful, but saw you trying too hard. It took a long, long time before I could say I felt the desire to work on having a good marriage. I would say that I was willing "to be willing" but I wasn't to the last part yet. IOW, I wasn't leaving him, and was just there.....that was all I could muster at that moment, and for a long time afterwards. If he had placed as much pressure on me as you have your W, I would have probably left, IDK.

Pastor's going to be reaching out to her, just as another person to talk to. Her friends are really pushing for her to continue filing. She has a couple friends that told her she was wise to slow down, but some of her best friends from college aren't practicing Christians, and some are already divorced - they're grinding their anger axe by giving bad advice to my wife.

It's a confusing time for her, although she says she has ended the A, her emotions and addiction are screaming bloody murder.

[trumpet]

Interesting exchange tonight.

I got home a few minutes before W and D14 got back from a lesson. I had meat in the crockpot, so I served supper. The initial exchange was very good... this morning was very good. She even made me a cup of coffee.

Knowing that she might be in bed/sleeping after I take S12 to his dance lesson, I quick told W that with my addictions group that is now meeting, that there is some confidential materials downstairs, and to please stay out of them. She looked at me and said 'ok' very quickly. Mind you, the kids are eating, and this was only a 15 second conversation, but I just wanted her to know how important it was. She followed up after my second sentence with a desparaging remark, in a way that seemed to hurt me.

Here's where I probably went wrong - I confronted her on the remark. It was a bit disrespectful. My W right now does disrespectful very well. I trailed my W upstairs to just mention that I was hurt by the comments... couldn't leave well enough alone. In the end, she shut the bathroom door, told me to go away, and took son to dance lesson, after I wanted to take him. I did pick him up, but it seems like any conversation that might be more than kids, surface level-type stuff is met with anger and disrespect.


A few more things were said, but no yelling, no shouting, no cursing/swearing. Just me with some hurt feelings, and my wife seemingly mad at me, not wanting to talk with me.

Sandi's words that she posted today ring true tonight - that my wife still really doesn't want a R with me. A friendship, yes - for the kids. But the fog that she is in keeps telling her to find every small issue, blow it up, so that it can be yet another nail in the coffin.

In the end, she isn't putting effort into the relationship. She's putting effort into being friendly. I'm afraid that I can't put up with just friendly forever - I want my wife back! But how long is it going to take? I know, I know, no one has that answer.

I'm going to flush tonight, and just start again tomorrow with a nice greeting and go from there.

[Zues126]

I don't think you handled it terribly. No worse than not saying anything and being walked on.

Maybe instead of telling her you feel hurt and looking at her with expectation of her caring and apologizing or changing her behavior...needy, controlling...maybe instead just state you boundary and terminate the conversation, in a way that suggests you don't really give a crap is she continues to disrespect you, but you won't be there to put up with it...

[Free]

Trumpet,
I am no expert here, but I think that you need to lower/kill your expectations for now. The roller coaster you are currently on (everyone here is on one) is attached to your expectations for reconciliation.
Of course you want your W back. We all want back the girls we married.
I don't know how long it will take for your W to fully clear from the fog, but I know it probably won't be any time soon.
And the fog clearing is no guarantee that your M will reconcile.
I know you want to save your M badly. Go back and do what has worked.

[Georgia Bulldogs]

When you courted your wife did you chase her around having conversations about your feelings and talk of sacrificial love?

She's not ready to be your wife...yet. She's got to get through withdrawal right now. "No contact" is your only concern right now.

Other than that - just be present and try to be fun. Bonus if you can get her out for a good night out. Foggy recently wayward wives love distraction and escape. They like to act like high school girls and focus on the superficial. You want to pull your wife out of that mindset ---- which sometimes involves going into the fogginess of superficiality to lead them out.

How would high school Trumpet have pursued a girl? Do that without the pathetic falling all over yourself begging to get any sex attitude.

If that fails...just sit there and listen to her.

[trumpet]

Free, Sandi, and others:

The worst what I feared did come true - I found evidence that my wife was back to talking with OM. She has again professed her love to him, and says we have no future. She has been back to talking with him for the last 3 days. Her snap at me tonight was something very out-of-the-blue since we've had good interactions for a few days, so I did snoop. The Divorce is back on, and she says she'll be serving me papers. "15 years of you not loving me [censored] - I deserve better." She told me repeatedly that I don't love her (how did she get in my head?), and that the only way for her to be happy is with me gone. Lots of spew, lots of anger, and doesn't really care what those who care for her think. She will do what she wants.

I have some decisions to make on Thursday. Do I let this sit for a couple days, and see if she truly does serve me? If so, my path is set. Do I leave the marital home? I asked her to leave tonight if she is continuing in the EA - she will not leave under any circumstances. She wants 'her' bed (was ours), her house (it's ours), her car, you get the idea.

She deserves to be happy, our marriage was dead when it started, yadda, yadda, yadda... the same crap we all hear.

Leave the house? I tend to go back to - why should I? It does make it difficult with both of us here, esp. when she now plans to be open in the affair. I have to teach our D14 and S12 on Saturday PM - and it's on the 7th Commandment - adultery. Ugh. Difficult spot to be in, but my wife refuses to teach her kids any catechism material. She even recognized she'll probably have to leave HER church - she put the guilt on me for that one as well.

Should I file on her? I lean to 'no', as she already started the paperwork, so having her actually serve me would be fine - at lease I'm not in super-limbo land, like I've called it.

Very tough night. Searching for answers that aren't there. I'll get some sleep and see what the morning brings.

[G8r]

So sorry to hear that Trumpet. Was hoping and still hoping things work out the way you would like them to work out. Hopefully, this is just a small snag and things rebound.

[sandi2]

This has pretty much been going on since 2013. I think as long as she diggs in her heels and says she's not leaving......she's sure you will settle down and life goes on as it has previously. It seems to me it's time to do something different. Could you move out and take the kids with you? Could you leave her with the house, the car,.......and the payments? Find you and the kids another temporary place, and give her no spousal support, at least until you talk to the lawyer? Have you talked to the lawyer to see your options? Did you ever separate your finances and protect your savings, retirement, CC, etc.? I don't give a lot of legal advice b/c I don't have a lot of experience with it, and b/c it may vary from state to state/country. It doesn't mean you have to file if you get legal advice.

This comes as no surprise, and answers why she continued to refuse any sort of transparency.

In case you get another shot at R in the future, tuck this in your brain. Do NOT approach a WW who has just disrespected you in front of your children by telling her you are hurt! To a WW, it makes a man sound very weak to tell her she hurt him. She doesn't respect hurt feelings. She doesn't care. The only thing she will respect is seeing you stand firmly. Where were the boundaries? Where were your actions to enforce the boundary?

This woman has suffered no loss! She intends to keep her cushy lifestyle and her kids. Meet with your lawyer to see what his legal advice is.

[trumpet]

I am numb and dumbfounded.

Would moving out be a sign of weakness?

We have no money, essentially. I have been getting us out of debt for the last 2 years.

She borrowed $2,000 to file the D from her parents.

I've gotten good advice from a lawyer. The D is filed, no reason to counter file.
She sees her action, but refuses to acknowledge the hurt and pain. She keeps hearing her friends say they'll be fine. There is no way to convince a wayward. My thoughts go to how I can snap her out of it. It will have to be BIG. She feels the damage is too much, that she's too hurt, and can't forgive me for the pornography that she says destroyed our family. Feeling personally responsible for this right now, which is probably wrong, as its her actions that put us in this exact spot.