WW, My Addiction, Patience, and HOPE

[sandi2]

She wants the conversation, the texts from me, the phone calls, since she's not talking to OM, but really, she just keeps trying me on for size.

And, she can have those things from you.......if she will do her part and write the letter, call the lawyer, and agree to transparency. Otherwise, she will crumble to the pull of the A. She has not reached that point of being willing to do whatever is necessary to save the M. I think it is more YOU that is pushing her, trying to get her there.......and she's digging in her heels.

She said yes on Sunday, and she meant it. Was it a moment of weakness for her? I consider it a moment out of the fog.

Maybe, or she was just trying to get you off her back about it. She either agrees or she doesn't. You can't hammer her till she gives in about it, b/c I doubt it would be authentic.

Why another R talk? What will it accomplish? Nothing is going to work as long as she's holding on to the OM.

I have told her 3 times this week that in order for US to reconcile, these things have to happen. She greets those requests with disrespect, including eye rolls, huffing, and trying to end the conversations with 'bye trumpet' or 'we're done talking'. 'You're treating me like a 2 year old!'.

Not a good sign.

Here is how I see this, and it's just my opinion. I don't think it is a matter of patience that is needed here. As usual, the WW is daring the H to see if he will bend over and let her ram this up his a$$. The more R talks, the more pressure he applies, the more "reminders" he gives..........the more she realizes she has him by the b@lls and he won't do anything.

It boils down to this..............either sh't or get off the pot. Just sitting there is not accomplishing anything.

[trumpet]

Sandi,

I agree.

We can be friendly, neighborly... sometimes, she slips back into the old wife, smiling, small talking with me. We even sat on the couch together for a bit today.

How much do I interact and show her I'm not cold as ice trumpet? That's my sitch right now.

She's still not going to write a letter. She did finally mention last night, after her taking out some anger on me, that not contacting him, no calls, no texts, is really hard, and she's still hasn't contacted him in a week. Can I check? Nope... she says she values her privacy, and I can't. I have to just trust her... gah!

She comes back to my addiction as well. Saying it's a convient excuse that I have, since I have a name for my addiction, and I'm using it as an excuse. I camly let her know that yes, I'm broken, and knowing that I needed help, I'm currently in counseling, and it's nice to have support. She's in the camp that there is nothing wrong with her, and me 'making' her go to a counselor (she set it up, and put another session on the calendar). I told her last night that if she doesn't want to go, it's not a problem - just don't go. I told her it's up to her if she wants to work on the R. If she does, the NC, letter, IC, and then MC would need to happen.

Subborn WW. GAH!

[sandi2]

My question would be, "What do you have that you would not want your H to see"? That is the issue. To tell you the truth, I like my privacy, too. Even though I have nothing to hide, I just like the freedom of saying something without someone reading over my shoulder. However, this will not be something that continues till the end of time. It is to help give her strength to do the right thing.......which we are more inclined to do when being watched.

She is VERY resentful of your porn addiction, and I can understand why. You will have to be careful or you will sound a little self-righteous to her. You may think that's crazy, but you talk as though you have already beat it. You talk as though you have come through the addiction. She, however, is not convinced of it. And, as long as she can reference back to your porn........she feels what she's done in comparison, is not so bad. IOW, she feels the kettle is calling the pot black. It just doesn't fly with her.

I really think you are pressuring her way too much. There is a difference in insisting and in pressuring. Right now, she may feel she is doing all that she can do not to contact the OM, and that you are not helping matters. I remember very well how tough it was for me, and I had the information from the board, so imagine how it hard it would be if a person was not informed.

Would she be willing to read just the diffinition of PEAs on the Internet? It explains the feelings of an A being liken unto real love and the addictive power. IDK, you have pushed so hard that she may rebell about anything at this point. She doesn't want MC, so what will she do?

I see two things here. 1) Her unwillingness to do whatever you (the betrayed) feel is necessary to save the M. I think she sees herself as being the other betrayed person in this M, in relationship to your porn use. 2) You are trying to push her, very hard, into something that has to come willingly from her. Otherwise, it isn't successful, and will only build more resentful.

I think between the Pastor's comments and your pushing, she is fighting the whole process. You need to decide what you will do if an agreement of transparency doesn't come. I don't think she's going to agree to it. I am not saying it won't work, I am saying I think it will be unlikely.....given the addictive pull of the A. She may end things with this OM, but get into another A.....b/c she'll need a fix. It is too easy to pretend she is being faithful, while continuing aome type of an A.

Everyone who has an addiction needs a way to cope, don't you think? They need support and encouragement, and a plan what to do on the days the temptation seems unbearingly difficult to overcome. She needs the same thing.

[Georgia Bulldogs]

They (above) may be right OR she may be acting like a typical wayward wife in the first week of withdrawal.

My wife was hesitant to write a no contact letter too....mostly because OM broke it off with her and told her to leave him alone after exposure.

First few weeks are difficult as their sneaky little affair routine is disrupted and all the rationalizations and justifications for having the affair in the first place remain. They mourn the loss of OM and they are overwhelmed with the idea that they are stuck trying to make it work with you.

I like the ideas you expressed about being detached from the upset and anger. Not needing to preach and teach to her anymore. However, if she truly is going "no contact" the more support you can give her with just your detached presence, the better in my opinion. Don't be up her butt chasing her around for conversation because you know it'll just be hateful talk and she's not ready to really listen yet. Just be there - around - in the same house.

My bet is that absent a "no contact" letter - there will end up being "closure contact". The withdrawal is more than she bargained for and it's telling her subconscious that - "wow - you liked him more than you thought". She's likely to fail but maybe not. No contact is more important than a "no contact" letter - but absent the letter white knuckle cold turkey "no contact" is just a game of chicken the wayward usually fails.

One of the best ways to support "no contact" is to take a trip together far far away. Gives the wayward a distraction to think about before and during the trip to help them through the initial tough weeks.

[trumpet]

Sandi,

Thank you - I think you pieced together what I've been feeling and what my wife has been feeling the last few days. I'm not looking to talk about the R. I was being overly cold to her, and I think over the last day and a half we have settled in a bit, where I'm more natural, but more selective in my words to her. We spent the day together, watching some football, eating lunch, and taking family to S12's futsal game.

I've given her some compliments today - her hair looked great, and her complexion has been better than it's been in years - she's been working out hard, and lost 15 lbs. already. On a strict diet - this is the first time in 15 years she's going gung-ho on her weight and health. I was witholding some of that, and it felt natural to give her those - she deserves it. the new trumpet knows that he needs to compliment her more often than he did. I need to show her I care.

I was the guy that used to say I had 'unconditional love' for her, but that was just fooey, since I had the addiction. Love is an action in my life more than it ever has.

Geogia Bulldog said something that stuck with me - since we both have an addiction, I might need to be a bit more complimentary to her, since from the looks of it she isn't contacting OM. I'm going to lay off the NC letter for now, and show her I care a bit more than I was. I need to at least show her I'm a kind, caring trumpet, rather than the cold trumpet I was when she was actively talking to OM.

At least, from one day of it, it's paid off. I'm still letting her be during the workdays. And still reading books. We'll see if the resentment/anger goes down with a little effort on my part. Trying something different - like MWD stresses in DR.

[trumpet]

Update time.

Sunday was good - Monday, not so good. She's struggling with the withdrawls of the OM.
I asked her last night, per the suggestion of our pastor, this question "What can I do to put you first?". His reasoning is that we both need to focus on putting our needs in the back seat, and our partner's needs in the front seat, like Christ.

Well, that went over like a lead balloon. She got upset from what I could tell, and left the room. At least she knows I want to put her needs above my own, even with the EA so close in the rear-view mirror.

I'm doing well mentally and emotionally. Physically, I need to get back on the workout regime. My achilles/calf strain is an excuse. I'll be signing up for Planet Fitness and $10/mo soon. I can at least wake up early and ride a bike or elliptical vs. running for now. Might even stop by tonight.

Meeting up with my old roommate from college and a good friend. We had grown apart in the last 5 years. Lots to catch up on. He's a good listener.

One positive note - my wife sent me a note telling me she changed her email password. She said it wasn't really appropriate - the password included the word Divorce, so maybe that's a good sign?
I told her she could make it anything she wants - it doesn't bother me. I did make mention that accountability vs. her privacy is a fine line right now, and that it's worthy of discussion in the future.

Made it to a men's bible study this morning at 6:30AM.

Got another couple marriage books in the mail. Got plenty of things to read right now. Divorce, and marriage bomb drops make you humble, and realize you can't fix things, and you need help yourself. I'm finding a TON of things within myself, and how to communicate well with my spouse, with every book I read.

[sandi2]

Well, that went over like a lead balloon. She got upset from what I could tell, and left the room. At least she knows I want to put her needs above my own, even with the EA so close in the rear-view mirror.

She's not ready for that kind of stuff yet. I understand what you want to do, but speaking as experiencing it myself........it is emotional pressure. It's like this guy who is following her around & wanting to do something......anything....."just tell me something I can do to make you feel better"..........and it's too smothering for her.

You don't have to be cold and act like a horse's rear. Neither is she ready for you to be gushing over her and appearing "too helpful"......if that makes sense. Give her some time. Let her mourn the ending of the A.

I do believe that staying occupied helps. Do activities that are fun. Keep it in groups, if possible........like the family, other couples, friends, etc. Attend things together. Go somewhere new. See shows and watch funny movies. But don't push having talks with her. Don't push for intimacy, however, if she was sleeping in a separate room......as part of the R agreement, she should at least be sleeping in the same bed with you.

GB is right in how hopeless the WW feels in the beginning of withdrawals. She probably saw this OM as her last shot at happiness, and now she has to resign herself to living a life with you. (Sorry,^^^ that's expressing the WW's feelings). It is difficult for her to believe she'll have those "in love" feelings again.

[trumpet]

Sandi,

Thank you again. I didn't think stating that question would help - my gut was it was going to make her angry, but I did it on the suggestion of the pastor. The reaction was what I thought it would be. The only positive is that she know's I'm focused on the marriage, and that selfless love is how a great marriage works. She's heard that before at marriage retreats, she's just in denial mode - her heart is still in OM's camp, and she's struggling.

Pastor's going to be reaching out to her, just as another person to talk to. Her friends are really pushing for her to continue filing. She has a couple friends that told her she was wise to slow down, but some of her best friends from college aren't practicing Christians, and some are already divorced - they're grinding their anger axe by giving bad advice to my wife.

I have to let go of the fear that if I don't do something, I fail. Just moving forward like I have been is the way to go - with a focus on my happiness, which will in turn show others around me I'm the lighthouse in the storm. If I am TRULY happy, I won't be able to hide it. And she will want to know that person - since it wasn't me for the last couple years.

81 days porn free. It truly is a daily choice - but it's a lot easier after the first 45-50 days or so. I struggle a bit some days, but struggling is better than giving in.

[Free]

Stay strong Trumpet.
Im sorry to hear of the bad advice your w is receiving. Misery loves company.
I laughed when you wrote TRULY in bold. That's what we all want to show, but more than anything, we all pretty much fake it.
True happiness will happen over time.
Be well.

[trumpet]

I soooo want to trust her. It's been tough.

I haven't seen her phone, but she's still NC with OM.
She's wearing her ring.
She's being nice to me - made coffee for me this morning.
I ask how her workouts in the morning are going. I do compliment her on how her weight loss/strength training is going.
She was happy to see me reconnect with my college roommate. Didn't ask any questions about what we talked about.

On the surface, it seems like a positive direction.
There is just a gut negative reaction to all of this - that I'm being set up. For those who have had any reconciliation with their spouse, is this normal? That 46/47 days from now, I'll get served the papers, and her being nice right now is just a front to hide the OM?

Every day I move forward, and every day I realize I'm the focus, not the R. That I can fake the pleasantries, and be nice to her, but I'm on constant vigil to not give into wanting to be with her, asking more questions, laughing, being like old times. I have to work on ME, my relationships with my kids, and most importantly, my relationship with God. I am the most happy when I feel centered, when I'm not thinking about her, and when I can focus on my own well-being. That the trust I had in her is just gone. The gut reaction that even the nice things she does are to really just cover up the EA that might still be happening.

She's going to MKE today for a work meeting. First thing I thought was that she was going to meet up with OM. Of course I said nothing. Just told her safe travels as I left this morning to attend my first session of a hidden addictions group.

This addictions men's group has me really excited. I'm more of an open guy, so sharing is fine with me. The more I talk about my addiction, the more I feel like I've got a handle on the struggle, and can keep the handle in my hands. My relationship with Christ is an order of magnitude better than it's ever been, and with that, I don't feel the need to have my wife validate my existence anymore. In that regard, there are moments that I actually look forward to being divorced from my wife, where I'm not feeling so put down by her.

It's also scary to think that while I might be working to make myself stronger and ready to make a healthy marriage work for probably the first time in my life, that maybe, just maybe, that through my self-discovery that I really don't want my wife in my life. That the longing for the relationship is just so that I don't feel rejected, as a divorce is the ultimate put-down.

I don't see much of my wife working on things. She's neck-deep in the EA fog to notice. Respect still isn't readily apparent, as so much as what the kinds of respect I'd want in a marriage.
Not being around her means I'm not getting disrespected, so therefore I'm in a better mood.

I have a timeline in my mind, but it scares me. The filing of the D means she has 60 days. That puts it around March 5th. I had given things until my birthday, March 13th or so, to start to see the Titanic turn around, or at least show some course change, to avoid ME filing for divorce. I don't want to divorce, I know God hates divorce, and I'm on a divorce busting website. What scares me is that these thoughts cross my mind - would I be willing to file the D if there is no remorse, no work from the W on herself, and on the marriage? I don't deserve to be 'happy' - I'm not a believer that God put me on this earth to just find my happy place and stay there - He has work for me to do, and life is tough. Do I take being in limbo until then, which was my first thought? Or do I give her 6 months?
Is that me being selfish?

Ugh. Opinions are welcome.