I had planned to just get space and catch up on emails, etc. - no talk. He essentially went and did his own thing anyway (in the garage), so no confrontation. I think he thought about it, since he came to the bedroom, looked around but left the lights off and left to drink some more. But this morning it was a return to his usual spew.
Me: 42, H: 38 Married: 12 years (second M for me) 14D, 9D 2015 EA (PA??), porn addict, *pastor/counselor* MLC
At a counselor, he said he wanted the marriage but not to work on himself w/a IC. Piecing?
A good while back now, there was a thread that heavily debated "tone" of the written word and who is responsible for that tone.
The writer or the reader.
While a writer can do things that indicate tone, like use descriptive words, italics, bolding, etc...
The reality is that the final meaning placed on the written word lies with the reader.
In your case, you are unhappy with your H, you have many many negative (some I'm sure justified) feelings regarding him, you expect to hear nastiness from him...
So THAT is what you read in his words.
I don't disagree, his second text sounded like a man who is at the end of his rope.
I want you to consider the first text differently.
IF you thought your H was happy...you would have received it as a more positive message.
You keep saying you are confused...it is obvious that you are.
One of the things that makes dealing with these situations easier is simply stepping back and looking at the situation like you are an outsider instead of involved directly in it.
Around here, one of the things that used to be preached a lot was the 48 hour rule. If something occurs, instead of instantly reacting from emotion, do nothing for 48 hours. Then reevaluate the situation and see if you still feel the same way. Then you decide what to do.
Let's talk about something a little different.
How did doing whatever your plans were last night (email I believe you said) make you feel?
Good, bad, indifferent? While you were doing it, did you spend more of the time wondering what he was doing and thinking or were you busy?
"Acceptance doesn't mean resignation. It means understanding that something is what it is and there's got to be a way through it."--Michael J. Fox
I hear what you're saying Cat. I also have heard this from him many many times and it always means the same thing, thus the second text just to reinforce it. I did not react to it at all - I just recognize it. Yeah, he's at the end of his rope. Am I supposed to do something, based on what you're saying here? My understanding is no. Regarding your different question: kinda indifferent (I'd rather be doing other stuff, but it's good to clear things out, detach and not engage/be spewed upon. And that was my main goal. And yes, not thinking much about him, other than checking in here and catching up on Fo.2's sitch. So, yes (reading your mind here - lol), I have been trying to redirect/refocus away from him anyway. Often I am successful, though not always. Yes, focusing on what I need to focus on about myself, prayer, etc. I get it.
Me: 42, H: 38 Married: 12 years (second M for me) 14D, 9D 2015 EA (PA??), porn addict, *pastor/counselor* MLC
At a counselor, he said he wanted the marriage but not to work on himself w/a IC. Piecing?
Well, off from work soon, to head to another night. Plan: just putz around & take care of things I want to take care of...maybe do some crafts, chat on here...do some artwork w/D14 if possible. Still trying to figure out the best possible response (NOT reaction) if H wants to talk. Avoid the spew when it's obvious that's all it is. But I wonder if there's some stuff I read as spew that is not. Hmmm.
Me: 42, H: 38 Married: 12 years (second M for me) 14D, 9D 2015 EA (PA??), porn addict, *pastor/counselor* MLC
At a counselor, he said he wanted the marriage but not to work on himself w/a IC. Piecing?
Like I said, you two are not on the same page right now so there is nothing you can do together to make progress. You both have to be willing to communicate with sincerity and (assuming what you're posting is accurate) he is not there yet.
Regarding concrete things you can do for yourself...what I meant there was detach, GAL, etc. The usual stuff.
There's no magic as you know. The main thing you can do right now is continue growing and doing things that make you stronger, healthier, happier, etc. Maybe even talk to an IC on your own.
If he ever came to you and said he wanted to work on the marriage, perhaps your response could be something like, "I want that too, but I don't think we can do that in an environment where there's sarcasm, yelling, accusations, and belittling, or where you think I'm {insert whatever valid complaints about you he has here}. We have to work to get to a place where we can be sincere, open, honest, and accepting. Do you want to discuss how we can do that?"
I don't know whether that's a good idea or not. But I think it shouldn't be said unless he expresses sincere interest in working on the marriage. Again, if he's got issues with compulsion, depression, etc. and is always lashing out, all you can do is keep yourself and the kids moving forward.
IC is in the plan...that appt is at the end of the month though. He believes he has stated things like that (though truthfully, he hasn't laid out any 'roadmap' to getting better other than Kyrie has to change and I don't). Not looking for magic, just looking to stop making the same mistakes without burning bridges/going nuclear. He insists he's tried to lead us but I refuse to be on the same page as him, so he manipulates things by always pulling out that hammer, rather than dealing with things. Hopefully that makes sense. IOW he can *always* say that, and mean it, whenever the conversation goes in any way other than, H is always right and wife is a total failure.
Me: 42, H: 38 Married: 12 years (second M for me) 14D, 9D 2015 EA (PA??), porn addict, *pastor/counselor* MLC
At a counselor, he said he wanted the marriage but not to work on himself w/a IC. Piecing?
You are getting a lot of advice. I know some of it is conflicting. Hard to piece all of this together.
I hope I can reduce some of your burden or clarify something for you. For instance, -the Porn- it's HIS issue, not yours. Especially if you call it an "addiction", then it's really not Yours to fix or solve. My dad was very well educated, always gainfully employed in a prestigious (but stressful) job, devoutly religious, and a highly functioning alcoholic.
My mother could not "make" him stop drinking. My 8 siblings & I could not "make" him stop. His doctors' warnings could not "make" him stop or "wake him up" to HIS problem.
Only terminal cancer & death in 8 weeks, stopped that brilliant man from drinking. Now, some 20 years later I realize that there are plenty of opinions about alcoholism, the role of genetics & the role of choice, but the only thing I KNOW
is that only my father (& God) could help him with HIS problem.
In other words, for now at least, I don't see anything for you to "do" about your h's porn.
From this thread, I see the options presented as you cutting him off physically, and or leaving the home (to "show him what divorce looks like/teach him a lesson"?),
or as Zeus said, accepting him as he is now (& hoping things improve, with you GAL/Detaching).
Please learn from our mistakes!! My whole first year here, I felt strongly that my h ought to "feel the consequences of his actions" and I sure did not want to enable him to cake eat.
But my DB coach rocked my world with a very different perspective. At the moment, 2 things come to mind most:
She said 1) "yes to an extent, every WAS/MLC 'cake eats' for awhile.
That's b/c the LBSer is here trying to save the marriage, & the WAS/MLCer is not. So, no, they do not have the same motivation as the LBSer.
AND
2) "it's Not the job of a spouse to 'teach the other spouse' a lesson or "show them the consequences of their choices. Life does that for them." This ^^ was a hard one for me...
To be clear, she did NOT say to lie for him or cover for him or enable crappy behavior endlessly; she just made it clear that MY role was not as my h's judge, teacher, "spiritual guide" or punisher.
The DB journey for me was mostly a spiritual one, with a lot of self discovery. To be completely open, I had to dig deep when Coach said all ^^this stuff bout "life teaching h". After serious soul searching, I saw an unpleasant side to myself I'm not crazy about.
I had to admit that at least some of what I was saying about "showing h the consequences", was in actuality a cover for me, b/c I was angry, humiliated and very hurt.
A part of me wanted to punish my h. I used terms like "justice" and "fairness" as euphemisms for my desire for retribution, wanting him to feel pain - while telling myself that only with his "remorse" could I feel "safe" with him...B/c if he was in a lot of pain from his choices, I believed he'd be less likely to repeat the behavior...and there is a certain logic to that. But my motivations were not all pure, (and definitely not working!)
Facing this side of me to work only on myself, when in pain, was was the hardest thing I've ever done. But at least I knew some of what MY "work" was. For one thing, I changed my focus from wanting to "show h the consequences" to instead, giving my h something to miss. The happier our times together, the more fun the kids and I had, the more inner peace I felt/projected, the more positive images he'd have to miss later on...and the more good times the kids could look back on later, regardless of where the marriage headed. I had plenty of work to do in my "sandbox" so I learned, eventually to stay out of h's sandbox.
He had HIS stuff to work on, and I had mine...does any of this resonate with you?
I really hope some of this helps you.
Do Keep on keeping on. IN TIME, this will get better, regardless of what your h does.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
