I doubted, but I'm certain this is MLC

[Ancaire]

Hi guys! I'm starting a thread over here, even though most of my posts are still in Newcomers. I realize now that I really am dealing with an H in full MLC, and the advice is often the same, but the time involved? It could be years! I'd like advice strictly pertaining to MLC, as well, so I thought it would be a good idea to start a thread here, for the long haul.

Here's a recap of my situation to date, condensed:

BD was early August, completely out of the blue. No warning, nothing - just a cold little three line e-mail, which he texted me in the middle of the night to ask if I'd read. I hadn't, so I spent the next several hours in sheer shock.

H's mother died three years ago. I realize now, that he really did start to change around this time. He slowly but surely became more critical, colder, and mean. When I married him, he was easily the sweetest man on earth. His childhood? Awful! He was #10 of 11 kids, in a single-parent family. His father contributed nothing to his children. Not money and very rarely time. Once in a while, he'd show up with a bunch of broken toys for them to share. He spent his time away from the family touring the Orient.

My H was shy, a bit overweight, and always lost in the shuffle. His personality was timid. His father doubted his paternity because he had brown hair, rather than white-blond like the rest of the kids.

Immediately following bomb drop, I did everything you're not supposed to do. I begged, pleaded, cried, attempted to reason with him. We used to be on the same page regarding D. It was not ever going to be a possibility. We were parents, and we were in it for the long haul. I couldn't accept he'd changed his mind on something so important.

I also realize now, as I'm typing this...about the time his mother died, H became very anti-church. No interest in religion. He began hanging with a new group of friends I absolutely despised. No family values, women coming and going, every single one of them cheaters if they happened to be in a R, heavy drinking. I couldn't fathom why my H, a family man, was so entranced with this group. My response was usually sarcasm and not-so thinly veiled comments about the quality of people he was choosing to spend all his free time with. He is an adult, and I don't own him, but I let him know I didn't like it. I rarely spent time with him with his new friends, because they repulsed me. Their comments about ethnic groups, women, and life in general made me sick. They loved to laugh at me, and refer to me as "the Liberal". I never enjoyed myself with that group, so I started staying home more and more.

[Ancaire]

Part II

As I stayed home more often, H began hanging with his new friends for longer and longer, as well as more frequently. I was fine staying at home and letting him go alone. I've always trusted H. He was a fine, upstanding man, a father of five and devoted husband. I didn't understand why he liked them, but it was obvious he did, so I just chose to let him go play with his friends, rather than cause a fuss about it.

We were shopping for a home this July! I made one comment about the location of the house, "Either you'll be miserable, or I'll be miserable." I was referring to the distance the house I really liked was away from his buddies. I was anticipating he'd be spending all his time driving across town to go see them, and I was irritated about it. H's version of all this, is that comment is what sealed the deal. So, he started thinking about it, and realized we have no common goals, I don't spend time with him, and we needed to D.

As I said, I disagreed, violently. I started looking for help online, and fortunately stumbled onto this site, as well as the MLC site run by Heartsblessing. Both these sites kept me sane! I calmed down, and started implementing changes. He did notice, because I stopped for a period when I had a bad fibro flare-up, and he commented that I'd been doing better before sliding back downhill.

I began to get a sneaking suspicion he was seeing someone. My intuition was screaming at me. We had a giant blow-up, and the truth came out. Not to my credit, I promptly informed all of my adult children of the situation. The main reason is because I was hurt - but also because he had denied, over and over and over, that there was anyone else. He blamed the demise of the marriage on me to every one of the children. I bitterly resented that, because they were mad at me! "Why couldn't you make the few changes Dad asked for, Mom?" I did! But when I would feel badly, which happens when you're chronically ill, I would backslide.

[Some very pertinent info on me: I suffer from several chronic illnesses, Congestive Heart Failure, Fibromyalgia, and Chronic Major Depressive Disorder, along with a host of smaller issues that usually accompany those things. This started around 2008. I was hospitalized for the 1st time with heart failure then. The depression was not new. I think it's inherited in my case, but my childhood was awful and traumatic...it left its' scars.]

H and I would talk infrequently about why he was unhappy, and I would make changes. At the same time, I would tell him what he was doing that was upsetting me, and he never made the smallest effort to implement any change - thus my lack of motivation to keep up my end of things.

After I told the children what was going on, all heck broke loose. H was beyond furious with me, saying that OW was NOT the reason he left, it was because I'm so awful. The kids had plenty to say to him about all his lies, and he felt the weight of his choices.

He eventually broke under the pressure and agreed to try MC before pursuing D. I wasn't thrilled, because I could tell his heart wasn't in it, but I was committed enough to my family to try, at least.

I have seen my formerly sweet H throw a tantrum like a two-year old...complete with kicking feet. "What did I do to deserve this?!?" was shouted at me when I informed him I would be seeking spousal support. I've been told I'm lazy, worthless, and not up to his standards. He's pretty much ripped me apart. I've "ruined his life", all he "wants is to be happy", and "I'm not in love with you."

He's become emotionally abusive to the point that he calls me names he used to apologize for saying at the beginning. He doesn't bother with apologies anymore. Foul, awful names. He stands over me, and threatens me with his sheer size to intimidate me into doing whatever it is he wants at the moment. All the money is his. I didn't help do a thing. I've been a burden, etc...

I've seen a look in his eye lately that absolutely terrifies me. I can see him fighting the urge not to hit me. He really, really wants to. This monster is not my H! I'm still struggling with the reality of what has happened.

[tfish08]

Mine says what about me? I DESERVE to be happy!!! and you are not it. I have no feelings for you, It rips you apart but as everyone says ...this is about them not us Stay strong. My H has dead eyes it is freaky

[Ancaire]

Part III

Back to when he suddenly decided to work on the M. I told him I'd already made some plans to move on. I wanted to get trained in Phlebotomy, so that I could work at least part-time (that's all I've been cleared to do by doctors) and make a decent wage. He was all for that! Sent me off to a class starting the very next day. I guess while I was out of town at the class is when he broke it off with OW.

We were getting along fairly well, but not quite comfortable. I could tell he was really angry about something. It took me about a week and half to dig it out of him, but he finally told me how he was feeling. He said I blackmailed him into staying with me because of how much it was going to cost him in a D to get rid of me. He was angry because he had to break it off with OW. Those two statements alone about slayed me! Had I known he felt that way, I would have just moved forward with the D.

He went out of town for a week, and when he came home, we talked some more about it. He still felt blackmailed, but was okay with it somewhat. He knew it was the right thing to do for our family. He wasn't as upset about OW as he'd led me to believe (right.) He had a pool tournament that weekend and there was a house party he was going to at his buddy's house, and I was NOT welcome to attend. That hurt. No way around it. I asked why, and he said it was because of all the awful things he'd said about me. He was going to have to fix the damage he'd created. (I'm pretty sure this means he's been lying his butt off about me, and now had to backtrack.)

I went out with my kids the night of the party. We went to a karaoke bar, and had a great time. I drank 2 gigantic margaritas. As the night wore on, I got more and more irritated because H wouldn't answer any of the texts I'd sent him. What could he be doing? Why wasn't he answering me?

So, I made the worst mistake of my life that night. Even though I was smart enough to get a ride home at 1am, at 2am, I was angry beyond reason. I still hadn't heard from H, so I decided it would be a great idea to drive out to his friends house and discover why he wasn't answering me.

I was sitting inside my car out front, and H stomped over to demand why I was there. I explained to him that he wasn't answering my texts, and I wanted to know why. He just ordered me to go home, which made me even more angry and hurt. We started quarreling, and for some reason (probably intuition again) I asked H if the OW I knew about was the only one. He said I didn't want to know. I insisted that I did. Then he said there had been "2 or 3 others" and that is the last thing I clearly remember.

He said I began screaming, and backed my car up like I was leaving. But I didn't leave. I turned around, came back, and slammed into a parked truck. I told them I thought it was H's truck. I don't remember any of this. But I do know the truck I hit was parked right beside my car when I was talking to H, so there is no way I could have thought it was H's truck. It was his dirt-bag friend's truck. They promptly called the police on me. While the police were there, I am told I asked them for a gun so I could shoot my H. I was clearly out of my mind.

Rather than sending me to jail, the police sent me to the hospital. I found out there that depression, alcohol, and the patch I wear for pain control do not make for a happy combination. I had no idea. Nothing like that has ever happened to me before. But I've never been hit with anything so painful, either. I was absolutely suicidal, and was put into a psychiatric facility for the next two days, until I stopped asking for someone to kill me.

Apparently H and his buddy had other ideas. A week later, I was arrested and placed in jail overnight on felony charged of criminal mischief. I bailed myself out, using a credit card ($1000!)and when I got home, H hit me up with his newest proposal. His buddy would drop the charges if I would agree to 7 months of spousal support instead of the 5-7 years I am entitled to. I declined his offer, which enraged him. I was, however, on to him at this point, and had secretly recorded the entire conversation.

I'm still in shock they had me thrown in jail to play divorce games! I was featured on the evening news, incorrectly, as a nutcase who ran down some innocent guy in his truck, because I thought it was my H. My dignity was in tatters. My reputation was ruined. I've never even gotten a traffic citation, and now I'm a "felon" - H's favorite way of describing me these days. He likes to play "compare the worst crime". He's only a cheater, while I am a felon.

I got a good defense attorney, thanks to my mom sending some money, and they are pretty sure they're going to be able to get it dropped to a misdemeanor by the end of January, and later totally expunged. His friend's truck has been repaired and paid for by my insurance company. I didn't got over to maliciously ram his truck. I had to talk to an investigator, in person, to tell them what I remember. I remember nothing after feeling that searing pain, and then my memory starts returning in pieces when I was in the ambulance on the way to the hospital.

My H literally drove me out of my mind. I have such a hard time trusting people. I was sexually abused as a child by an adult I loved and raped as a young woman of 22. To say trust is difficult? It's an understatement. I did, however, completely trust my H. To find out he'd been betraying me for the past few years? I guess my poor mind just snapped, after all the stress and strain of the prior few months, and then his lovely little revelation.

He takes ownership for none of it. Says we could have repaired our M, but since I had to go and be a crazy woman, there is no hope now. He says I can place the failure of the M squarely on myself.

I've realized since then, how very much he doesn't want to be married. He let his friend have me thrown in jail to benefit him! Jail was awful. Let's just leave it at that. I stopped trying then, and started placing my focus on myself.

I've messed up and attempted to bring up R twice since that night. About a month later, I asked just what it was that I did that was so unforgivable. I had a breakdown and did a stupid thing. It's not like I cheated, or hurt anyone. He came back with he was afraid of me, because I wanted to shoot him that night.

Last month, closer to Christmas, I messed up and sent him a letter, asking him to please stop, and consider our kids. Needless to say, he declined. I was so angry with him for putting himself ahead of our children, I just cut him off, told him I was sorry I gave him the letter in the first place, and never mind.

Ever since I found out about OW, I moved all his things out of the MBR and put them in his office. He sleeps over at his friend's house, and works from home during the day. I stay on my side of the house, and he is supposed to stay on his.

He has no problem breaking into my room. I hide things that aren't important so that he can find them and think he found something. I have to leave the room unattended when I leave the house, and I figured out early on he was snooping through my stuff. He really wants a copy of the recording that I made, because he doesn't remember exactly what he said. I never should have let it slip that I had it. He copied it off my computer once, and deleted it from my drive, but fortunately, my L had told me to send it to lots of people, just in case. I found his copy, and deleted it, restored mine, and let him know I knew what he'd done.

He'll pick my door lock, barge in, and attack me verbally when he gets upset about something. I suspect OW is pressuring him about how long the D is taking. He'll be relatively pleasant for a time, and then suddenly start demanding that I move out, agree to his terms, etc.

Last time he barged in and told me to be out by the end of the day! L said not so fast, and called his L and put a stop to it. I will not talk with him anymore. I've told him to correspond with me via e-mail or text, since he can't be civil. I'm leaving out a lot of the spew - since I know you've all heard similar.

We were supposed to have an emergency hearing on January 6th, but he suddenly started behaving. He wasn't giving me any money, won't get my car out of the shop, and is insisting I leave right away. How am I supposed to do that? He does not care, he just wants me gone.

At this point, I'm resigned. We'll be D whether I want it or not. As abusive as he is, and the fact that I physically cannot handle the stress, it's probably for the best. This version of H? I want nothing to do with. Every once in a while I see a glimmer of old H, and my stupid heart starts beating faster. I miss him so very much.

Thanks to my DB friends, I've been forced to face the reality that anywhere near H right now is not the safest place for me to be. I've finally accepted that. I'm attempting to find some help to get me out of here. H wants me to go live with my 76 year old mother and her H in a city 3 hours away from here. I do not want to do that. I'm a grown woman. I don't want to live with my mom. I don't care much for her H, either. It would not be a good situation. My children are here. My doctors are here. I think H is still trying to control me by deciding just where it is I need to live.

So, my priorities right now? Not H. My health #1. Finding a place to live, #2. Getting the funds together will have to be part of the divorce. I just learned that H has taken out a loan against the 401k. I didn't think he was supposed to touch the marital assets while D was pending. He does all kinds of things he's not supposed to do, with little to no repercussions. How is that possible?

Job recommended that I break down what I need to do into smaller steps so that the entire thing is not so overwhelming, and I find that to be excellent advice. I need to figure out everything I'm going to have to do, and then break it down. I've got a lot of homework for today.

I know H needs to not be my concern. I get it. I just have this feeling that I'm giving up too easily. On the other hand, trying to fight for our M? It's like attempting to baptize a snarling, spitting, clawing wild cat. I know others have been in this same position. How do you come to peace with the inevitable? Is it as simple as just not focusing on H right now? As you can see, I'm still kind of new. My situation has been crazy and fast. I'm on a timeline, too, because we've been renting this house, and our lease is up in March.

Someone tell me I can do this? I'm starting to feel scared again.

[job]

YOU CAN DO THIS! As I mentioned in another posting, your health is the most important thing right now. As your doctors have pointed out, it's a little at a time and yes, it's going to hurt, but once you are starting to get back on your feet, you'll begin to feel better. It's just like recovering a bit from being hit by a MLCer wanting out.

As for the two statements your h said about the blackmail and that he was angry he had to break it off w/the ow, they all have some excuse as to why things go the way they are. Some get blamed for the sun coming up, others get blamed for purchasing a certain type of laundry detergent and yes, others get blamed for living each and every day. They have to have some excuse for their anger and wanting out. He had choices to make and clearly he was stomping and kicking about them. They do like to rewrite history and will tell others some of the wildest and nastiest things about us just to be able to justify why he feels the way he does. If the people that he is saying this stuff to know what's right, they'll speak up there and then (which your h will then distance from them and not have any further contact) or they'll come to you later to tell you about it. There's nothing you can do about his rewriting of history...but you can hold your head up high and continue to be the woman that you are. A lot of the people will eventually figure it out.

Don't expect your h to respond to your texts. Don't expect him to be the "reliable" man that you once knew. That man is now the mirror image (exact opposite) of the one you use to know. If you continue to expect him to be a certain way or do certain things like he use to, you are going to be disappointed, angry and frustrated. You are dealing w/ a "pod" person who is off in his own little world and now it's all about him.

No more confrontations w/your h. You see what happened this time when you did so. Do not drink alcohol w/your meds and yes, alcohol is not a good mix for depression. You were very lucky that you didn't do more damage to yourself, other people in the area, and the vehicles. So, now you need to leave the alcohol alone.

Please stop trying to make him see reason. You can't get rational out of insanity. He doesn't want to hear it. He doesn't want the responsibility of a wife and family right now. All he wants is to run, be responsibility free and do whatever he wants and yes, even possibly spending money like water. In other words, stop poking the bear and remember...he fired you as his wife, companion, lover and mother of his children. You are not his mother and the more you attempt to guilt him into doing the right thing, the more determined he is going to be to run the other way.

I'm going to ask you this...are you absolutely sure you hit the truck? Could that truck have already been hit and you just happened to come along and became their patsy? I find it very interesting that his buddy was willing to drop the charges if you agreed to 7 months of spousal support and not the longer time. Yes, MLCers can be very smart and vindictive and will come up w/all types of ways to make us react to them. He knew exactly what buttons to push to get you upset and do something that you normally wouldn't do.

Because this guy likes to play games w/you, I would suggest that you go very very dim on him and only speak when he asks you something. Get a locksmith out there and have a good lock put on your MBR door. Makes copies of bills, bank statements, credit card statements, etc. for future use. Do not leave anything of value in your room. Remove anything that could be used as evidence, i.e., in favor of your case to a safety deposit box to a friend's house.

My concern is that he is trying everything he can to get you to lower the spousal support time limit. Stay strong, keep your lawyer apprised of everything he's saying and/or doing. It's important that you document everything so that you have a record in case you need to pull it out at a later date.

It's difficult w/the way things are going right now for you, but you really do need to keep your focus on you and your health. You've got to get stronger and be able to get back up on your feet. Try to remember this...if he starts talking and begins to get angry or threatening or if you sense that he's baiting you, end the conversation and leave. You can do this in a civil manner by saying "h, oops, I've got to be somewhere or I need to do something. I'll be happy to continue this conversation at a later time." The more you argue w/him the happier he is because he knows he's getting to you. Take that power away from him and put that power back on you.

I know you can do this!

[Sotto]

Hi Ancaire, welcome to this part of the forum! It certainly sounds like a dramatic change for your H after his Mum passed away and he is the right age for MLC too. I don't have much to add to Job's wise advice, but for me two priorities stand out for you:

Focusing on your own wellbeing and your steadiness in very challenging circumstances

And

Working closely with your L and constructively (but with your own interests central) in respect legal and financial matters.

Do keep posting - there are some wise people, and it certainly makes a big difference to my life to spend some time each week with them.

Take care xx

[Cadet]

Welcome to MLC - do you need my MLC welcome thread or have you seen all of that homework?

[Ancaire]

I didn't know there was MLC homework. I'm sure I'll find it, though. I'm going through the threads. Thanks, Cadet!

[Ancaire]

Well, yesterday was interesting. I truly hope it was the final argument I ever have with H. I foolishly allowed him to goad me. Weird thing is today? I'm not feeling all that badly about it. Once we finished spewing bile at one another, we were able to begin having civil interactions. It has been a long time since we've even gotten that far. I plan to put WW3 behind me and keep moving forward.

As soon as I typed the above paragraph, H showed up. He had D questions to ask me. Once again, I'm sitting her crying. He let it slip that he'd borrowed money from FIL to divorce me. For some reason, that slayed me. I am going down a cheeseless tunnel, I know. But it kills me to think of all the vile lies he's been telling about me being told to someone I really love. I'm so hurt by that, I'm having trouble catching my breath.

He wants me to hurry up, get it done. He won't help me get my car out of the shop. He won't help me with basic start-up costs for a new place. He's got money in the bank to pay for a lawyer in case we wind up fighting in court, but he won't use any of it to help me move out.

I e-mailed my L early this morning asking about his current actions. He hasn't made a payment on my car in over two months. He called them and told the lender to come pick it up - he wasn't paying for it anymore. Fortunately they refused to do that unless I agreed to it, but he's killing my credit. How am I supposed to find someplace to live with him letting all my bills go unpaid.

I guess I'll wait and hear from L. I don't know what else to do. I need to stop crying, that's for sure. Maybe I'll give myself 5 more minutes to mourn and then move it along?

I've been encouraging everyone else all morning...and I'm dying inside.

[job]

I'm so sorry you are having a rough time of it, but some of them do borrow money from family members. The old saying that blood is thicker than water is so true when it comes to family. So, now you know not to speak to your FIL about the situation. You can't control your h and the lies he's telling people, but you can control how you react and deal w/this situation.

If your h had money in the bank, why would he be borrowing from your FIL? Don't you have access to that account? Even though you are separated, half the money in the bank is possibly yours. You need to ask your lawyer about this. The same as you being able to receive a portion of his retirement and/or 401K. Your lawyer can negotiate to have your portion of his retirement paid to you up front now or upon his retirement (but that depends on what company he works for). If you've been married 10 years and he's paid into social security, you'll be eligible to receive a small portion of that retirement each month when you turn 66 (I think).

Cry, scream or vent here, but do not call your h up and talk to him about how he's destroying your life, etc. That would be one more reason for him to divorce you. He doesn't care what he does or says to and/or about you right now. He's desperate to end this marriage because he thinks the grass is greener over on the other side. The more you try to reason w/him the harder he's going to shove back and yes, run.

He wants the divorce, then let him do the heavy work for it. If he wants it bad enough, he just might negotiate w/you and get your car out of the shop and give you some money. After all, didn't he want you to negotiate w/him on a shorter period of time for spousal support? Two can play that game if push comes to shove. But this tactic only works if he's truly desperate enough to want the divorce.

Ancaire, I know this is upsetting, but you've got to put your business hat on and start thinking of ways to help yourself and also w/dealing w/your lawyer. When a person is emotional, they are all over the place and make poor decisions. Start looking into government and state assistance programs and see what they offer.

Once you've calmed down, pick yourself up, dust yourself off and start doing some research. You can do this!