Please can I ask I read a lot of your posts on other threads as well and something you often say it's that if I have been needy and weak and she has felt as she has often said to me it is like having another child how do I now become the strong confident man that she may be looking for when when pretty much wants nothing to do with me emotionally.
I could do what I am doing
On a friends basis we are good On a parenting basis we are good She seems happy to stay in the house whilst we are getting along and I am doing my share of the housework and being a better father to our children
Many Thanks
Ghost
Last edited by ATPeace; 01/02/1612:40 PM.
Me:48 W 41 M:18 T:26 2 D 18 & 4 2 S 17 & 13 Bomb: 20/7/2015 in house separation D filed 06/17 Separate houses 10/17 D Final 29/12//17.
How can you be a confident, attractive man if you are so dependent on your W? What is the point of me going into a long, detailed post about confidence, if you won't try to do what we advise? How many times have we tried, only for you to come back with more spinning? Are you even trying to prevent these repeated thoughts? When is your next IC session? Are you going to get help for yourself.......Or just continue doing whatever will impress your W, like going to some group of male abusers? That is about the craziest thing I think you've done.......and don't you dare start telling about reading your W's book again! I am sick of hearing it, b/c I think you are misled by the whole thing.
One more time, Ghost........Stop being a people pleaser! Stop being a "yes dear" kind of man. Stop trying to please your W and stop trying to please your kids. You talk about how much you love your kids, but you just started doing all this stuff to win your W back. Now, you are scared sh'tless b/c you may have to ask your boys to share a room?! And, god forbid that your W might give them better, b/c it will probably make then love her more than you. That's pathetic. This type of stinking thinking has to stop NOW! It will lead you into a state of subservience to your kids, and they don't need you to be their servant, they need a strong male leader!
Be your own person and do what you want.....not what your W wants. Stop trying to "win" her. You are so scared that nobody will love you, till you run everyone away by your craziness. The only thing you have done what has been suggested, is to spend more time with your kids. But you are doing it to get your W back, so your kids aren't getting the benefit. You spend time with them b/c you can continue on in your co-dependency and just call it being a good dad. When your W leaves, then your dependency on the kids will go into full drive.
You are a drowning man. If you don't try to save yourself, you will die.
If you are happy living in the house with your W, knowing you will never be any more to her than a friend.......then have at it. You aren't going to do what we say, anyway. You are just trying to keep us attached b/c you don't have anyone to talk with you. Your post get more and more irrational. Get professional help for yourself.........NOT FOR THE MARRIAGE.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Hi ghost. I feel for you as I'm a very routine driven guy. However , use this time to explore you'. What do you like or what we you like to do.
I ride super bikes Since W left I ride the bike whenever I want to. Before she was always moaning that I could be killed !!!! I bought myself a nice car I took the kids on holiday to Spain , I bought loads of new clothes and take the kids for breakfast on a Saturday morning I've taken the kids to the theatre.
Do you get what saying ?
Use this a chance to do what you want
Grasp that W is gone for now. It's so tough to hear but it's true
Get hold of your nuts in your hand and squeeze them - hard. Do you like it? No, thought not, but that's what your wife is doing to you right now. Only problem is, you're just complying.
Please, for crying out loud, get up off the ground and show her that she can't treat you like shite anymore. I've felt like you buddy, and once you've realised how badly you were being treated, it's easier than you think. Credit to Rd, Sotto, Azzork, NDY for showing me what a muppet I looked to my wife by being a sop.
M 45 W 52 SD22 S9 D8 BD 6 April 2015 Not living together 4 Dec 2015
How can you be a confident, attractive man if you are so dependent on your W? What is the point of me going into a long, detailed post about confidence, if you won't try to do what we advise? How many times have we tried, only for you to come back with more spinning? Are you even trying to prevent these repeated thoughts? When is your next IC session? Ok I have another IC session booked for next week during my previous sessions I have been talking about wanting to try and bring my W closer to me during the next session I will talk to her about be being codependent and my spinning Are you going to get help for yourself.......Or just continue doing whatever will impress your W, like going to some group of male abusers?sandi2 I do not even think this is about impressing her she does not give a damm,if I go or if I do not go this is about me trying to find myself and IF just IF I have not treated her the way that she wanted to be treated then I need to take a close look at why That is about the craziest thing I think you've done.......and don't you dare start telling about reading your W's book again! I am sick of hearing it, b/c I think you are misled by the whole thing. Sandie2 I am not sure if you understand how these programs work .....I chose to self enroll and since doing this I have come to realise that I have been controlling ..... I am starting to slowly understand how my W must have felt during our marriage trapped and unhappy ....I also I understand that theese were her choices she chose not to go out with her friends she did this to try and make me happy to reassure me ....I could tell you that my W has deep emotional problems and she has massive trust issues and that I feel that I did not do enough to help her during our marriage I feeI have let her down and I owe it to her as her husband to stand with her beside her or ....I just walk away walk on forward and leave her to try to put her life back together the best that she can.
One more time, Ghost........Stop being a people pleaser! Stop being a "yes dear" kind of man. Stop trying to please your W and stop trying to please your kids. You talk about how much you love your kids, but you just started doing all this stuff to win your W back. Am I doing this to win my W back at the beginning I would have agreed with you 100 percent however I am actually enjoying spending the time with my children and I do realise just how little time I did give to them when they were growing up and how this would have frustrated my W as she wanted me to spend time with my children and I did not spend enough time with them ....I realise she wanted to try and control me to spend the time with our children .....in a happy marriage is it not right that you should want to please your partner , Now, you are scared sh'tless b/c you may have to ask your boys to share a room?! And, god forbid that your W might give them better, b/c it will probably make them love her more than you. That's pathetic. sandi2 I actually think it is more that I am scared shi'tless that our family is about to be broken up splt in to two homes our children every three or four days moved from one house to the other for the good of WHAT ?? my wife's and my happiness how is this in the kids best interest...Sure I also think how the heck will I get over not seeing my W ...hardly a day has passed in 20 years that we have not seen each other I do struggle to get to grip on what life will be like with her not in my life ...perhaps she may also be having similar thoughts or perhaps she is stronger and does not give a sh1t I really do not know This type of stinking thinking has to stop NOW! It will lead you into a state of subservience to your kids, and they don't need you to be their servant, they need a strong male leader! Agreed I needs to be a strong leader and I also want to be the best dad that I can and that will that mean giving them nice things and doing things for my children putting them first at times unconditional love for them
Be your own person and do what you want.....not what your W wants. Stop trying to "win" her. You are so scared that nobody will love you, till you run everyone away by your craziness. The only thing you have done what has been suggested, is to spend more time with your kids. But you are doing it to get your W back, so your kids aren't getting the benefit. You spend time with them b/c you can continue on in your co-dependency and just call it being a good dad. When your W leaves, then your dependency on the kids will go into full drive. So my option Get a life for me...for the past 20 years my family have been my life I have lived to provide a home for them given my children the hobbies that they wanted my daughter a horse and my son his tennis ..they have never gone without I had my enjoyment from playing tennis two or three times a week. I thought was a loving husband as well it seems I screwed that bit right up.
You are a drowning man. If you don't try to save yourself, you will die. I am confused I am hurt and I am deeply distressed that my marriage is over, I love my family I love my W
If you are happy living in the house with your W, knowing you will never be any more to her than a friend.......The other option is not having her as a friend have the children see that we have parted and drag them into a life of separate houses ...no this is not want ai want absolutely not what I want and if that means me not being happy You aren't going to do what we say, anyway.
You are just trying to keep us attached b/c you don't have anyone to talk with you. Your post get more and more irrational. Get professional help for yourself.........NOT FOR THE MARRIAGE. I have an IC booked in for next week I will speak to her more about me and not about my marriage and working in being a better person
Please believe I am not trying to me difficult I do aprichate your advice and I am fighting to stay strong my option to grab my balls tell her I'm done and sell the house is not where I am right now sorry I truly am sorry yes I will work on me put me first but I am seeing a happier W over the past six months..
I love you all
Ghost
Last edited by ATPeace; 01/03/1608:38 AM.
Me:48 W 41 M:18 T:26 2 D 18 & 4 2 S 17 & 13 Bomb: 20/7/2015 in house separation D filed 06/17 Separate houses 10/17 D Final 29/12//17.
Hi ATP - absolutely speak to the counsellor about your own codependency and also how to better manage your fear and control issues. Also, think about how you can reluctantly accept the fact that your M may have ended and that your family may divide. That you may separate may not be something you get to control, but you do get to control the kind of life you create for yourself and your family if you live separately going forwards.
You say that you may need to grab yourself by the b@lls and tell her it's over. But to me, taking yourself 'in hand' means to pull yourself up by the bootstraps and create the kind of life you want for yourself, face your own fears and be there for your kids. None of that has anything to do with what your W is up to, it is all about you.
I think this is one of the central points you need to grasp. It is all about you now. Your W is 'out' but I sense you thinking - if I hold on as hard as possible - maybe she'll change her mind. Actually, I think all of us need to let go in order to hold on. If we let go, we stop being something to fight against, we truly respect our spouse 'wants out' even if we didn't want that. We accept that M is a choice and one of us could change our minds at any point.
You say below - so my option is to GAL for me.....then you spin on about the fact that your life has always been about your W and family.....so how could I possibly GAL?? Is what I'm reading. Well therein lies the problem. Acceptance. Your life was all about that and you lost yourself in the process. Now is the time to find yourself again. You didn't ask for this, but you are where you are and it gives you the best shot of happiness going forward.
I have to ask you - why would your W return at this point? What has truly changed? You essentially remain the guy you were before - codependent, fear-ridden, controlling, unable to contemplate a future 'on your own.' Please don't think I'm being mean and forgive the bluntness. But that's how I see it
So, a central question for you is how can you do a 180 on these difficult areas? - become independent, confident, accepting, looking forward to whatever future you are blessed with? Not for your W, but for you.
I still sense you are resisting the DB process, and so many people are trying to help my friend. I hope you start to make some good progress soon. I'm just going to summarise the things I think you need to focus on:
Facing and dealing with your own fears Becoming more independent (this includes a GAL plan) Accepting your M may end, you may separate and you CAN be fine/happy Letting go of the need to 'win back' your W - let her go Finding YOU - not H, Dad - You
Take care ATP - remember, the only way is forwards. You are still going 'around' at the moment and it is a cheeseless tunnel for you.
Xx
T 13 M 7 Me 48 H 46 SS 15 BD 7.14 PA D final 5.16 (H filed)
We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
Now it seems like you're defending your actions which beggars belief.
It also asks what you want to get out of this forum. What your final goal is. DB just in case you did not get the memo is about improving yourself to win back your spouse. You want her back so badly you dont care if you deteriorate yourself if it makes her happy. seriously?
First stop lying to everyone. Most of all yourself. It IS about impressing your W and what frustrates you is that she does not respond. Secondly you do not need to take a close look at why you did not treat her the way she wanted because it was out there already. You have controlling issues, are passive, boring and jealous.
Most programs are to come to terms with a problem, address it and then overcome it. I think. You chose to self enroll to please her. Your W has felt no different than many WS/WAS in a doomed M. Helpless, trapped, sad, etc which is why they call time out. She is no special than the others. You messed up and she wants out. I think you will find a case or two here G. Before checking out most S also change or adapt to satisfy the pre-LBS until they take no more.
The deep emotional problems and trust issues you mention ... have you ever thought that she dragged them in and they were her own flaws? They contributed to her acting as she did? You mentioned she had problems too when you both met. So marriage was an escape for both of you.
Have you ever thought she is NOT perfect? She has her own NON G INFLICTED problems too that she needs to sort out?
"...I feeI have let her down and I owe it to her as her husband to stand with her beside her or ....I just walk away walk on forward and leave her to try to put her life back together the best that she can..." Yes you may have let her down, you may owe it to her to stand beside her if she has problems but at this point you have BIGGER problems and what she needs is a strong emotionally INDEPENDANT, attractive and CONFIDENT MAN besides her. If that is the route you want to take. Unfortunately you ARE NOT that man.
"...and leave her to try to put her life back together the best that she can..." To be quite frank G she is doing a damn better job at putting her life back together post G era than you are. The one with piecing problems is not her but you.
"....in a happy marriage is it not right that you should want to please your partner..." Yes but you are not in a happy marriage. In fact you are in no marriage at all. That is where you keep scr3wing up. Where you still have trouble letting go. As you are no longer in a marriage stop trying to ... please her.
"...sandi2 I actually think it is more that I am scared shi'tless that our family is about to be broken up splt in to two homes our children every three or four days moved from one house to the other for the good of WHAT ?? my wife's and my happiness how is this in the kids best interest...Sure I also think how the heck will I get over not seeing my W ...hardly a day has passed in 20 years that we have not seen each other I do struggle to get to grip on what life will be like with her not in my life ...perhaps she may also be having similar thoughts or perhaps she is stronger and does not give a sh1t I really do not know..." I'm going to go out on a limb here G. This is really about you. You are using your kids as an excuse but the real fear is within you for YOU. The ending is the dead giveaway. YOU are the one afraid of the consequences more than how it will affect your children. Survival mode G.
"...Agreed I needs to be a strong leader and I also want to be the best dad that I can and that will that mean giving them nice things and doing things for my children putting them first at times unconditional love for them..." G, You HAVE to start being a strong leader for the sake of your mental health, physical health, children and any hope of getting your W back. Being the best dad is NOT giving them nice things. Even though it is probably what your parents did for lack of love. It is not about doing things for them. It IS about putting them first. Any dad here will give you his take on what makes a great dad and I can assure you it does not start with presents and tennis classes. Putting them first does not mean letting them walk over you. Winning my son back did not mean I was his shadow. It did not mean I gave him access to my account. It did not mean saying yes. My way was to say NO when I had to but give when I COULD. It meant being a MAN, a role model with my virtues and defects. It meant that even though he is 20+ I would still give him an ass whooping if I had to. It meant that if he went out and came back late I would pick him up if I could but if I could not he should take a taxi. He would often take a taxi or walk so as to not wake me up and even though I offered to pay for the taxi he would out of his own pocket. It meant surprising him with small gifts but just enough so he did not feel it was his right. It meant accepting NO when I said NO. It meant so many things. Interactions just like Sandi says. It is not about how much money nor how much time. It is about the way you spend both that gets the message across. You love them enough to lay down your life for them but also enough to whoop their a$$. Unconditional love is not about giving them everything unconditionally. Unconditional love is about loving them no matter what and believe me G it has to work both ways. To know you got it right means that if push came to shove, your children would love you no matter what and not because of a horse or tennis lessons but because you are their daddy. Your D must feel again like daddys little girl and your S you are their hero. Not an ATM machine.
"...So my option Get a life for me...for the past 20 years my family have been my life I have lived to provide a home for them given my children the hobbies that they wanted my daughter a horse and my son his tennis ..they have never gone without I had my enjoyment from playing tennis two or three times a week. I thought was a loving husband as well it seems I screwed that bit right up Your family or kids if you prefer should still be your life. It is your obligation to provide food, shelter, etc for your family. What we call in english .. a HOME. My son does not care much for tennis and a horse in our appartment wouldnt fit. We never could provide such luxuries for him. He still loved us. I messed up with him through something that had nothing to do with money. I also won him back without buying him. It is called love. I was soft when I had to and strict when I need be. Some days he hated me and then would initiate conversations when the message sunk in. Others I got it wrong and apologized. It is called parenting. I see this money thing in many of your posts. You place a high value on money and the wonderful things it can give. If you had a normal working mans wage, I wonder how you would cope. It is true when they say money cant buy you love. Especially with kids.
"... I am confused I am hurt and I am deeply distressed that my marriage is over, I love my family I love my W..." Which is why you are drowning and instead of learning to swim you are complaining about the waves and wishing for calmer weather.
"...If you are happy living in the house with your W, knowing you will never be any more to her than a friend......."The other option is not having her as a friend have the children see that we have parted and drag them into a life of separate houses ...no this is not want ai want absolutely not what I want and if that means me not being happy .... aaaand this is where it comes down to. The reality of G. Why in my opinion posting here for you is a waste of time and why you will never succeed.
You are happy to be her doormat. Your DB is to stop her from leaving at whatever cost. You cherry pick if it fits in with this masterplan. Everything you have done, All you are doing and will do is to please her so she does not leave, regardless of how it leaves you and the kids. She has full control of your life. Period.
"...Please believe I am not trying to me difficult I do aprichate your advice and I am fighting to stay strong my option to grab my balls tell her I'm done and sell the house is not where I am right now sorry I truly am sorry yes I will work on me put me first but I am seeing a happier W over the past six months..." You see, you still g-e-t i-t w-r-o-n-g big time. You still cannot see the land between black and white. The shades of grey. No one is telling you to sell the house you are. You still see your options as being a doormat or close shop. The f*****ng thing in the middle is where you are slipping and sliding because it requires character and you do not want to confront it. You still see your life as carrying on being the creature you are or jumping off the bridge into the river. You do not want to work on getting your life in order because it requires a quality you dont have and dont want to work on because it involves coming out of your comfort zone.
Your biggest problem is really you. No surprise there I know. Your last words ... "I will work on me put me first but I am seeing a happier W over the past six months.." Is your get out of jail free card. The "but" is your escape from working on you.
You still dont see that not only by DB may you regain your wife if it is to be but it will also help you in the future you both may have. It will help you to avoid making the same mistakes.
It will make you stronger, confident, a role model for your kids. It does work, believe me.
You however are willing to drop all this and run back. You are willing to drag all your fears, insecurities back into any new R with her. You will disappear from this website in a split second if she gives you a second chance and stop working on you knowing you have many serious issues that were never corrected after BD #1.
You say your children come first but any advantage from working on yourself here they may benefit from will be chucked out the window because your wife is really above everything else.
You will make the same mistakes again and find yourself here in the future with the same pleas for help but with a much more deteriorated family.
All because your wife seems happy lately, yet you still have not gotten to know your wife nor her reason. You still think your inactiveness, spinning, constant R talks and 2 gym days is winning her back. Good luck with that thought.
And now for the twist G. The reality is that who you are really doing all this for is YOU. What you are really afraid of is being alone.
I dont doubt you love your W and children but your driving force right now is fear. Without a family you feel you are nothing, a nobody and incapable of living alone. Your W and family are right now tools to achieve that real goal. That is why you cannot grasp that sometimes in order to achieve we must let go.
And that is why you need DB and the advice given here more than you know.
We can only give advice and try to put you on the right path but at the end of the day your life is in your own hands and you will never succeed when instead of advice you want corroboration.
Sorry ghost, I wish there was something anyone on this forum could tell you to make you see but maybe this is the path you need to take to find yourself.
At some point you will need to take responsibility for your own happiness and move past your fear, or hit rock bottom and have no where else to go.
At this point the advice were all giving you, which is the same over and over, is showing our own co-dependence and need to fix someone who is clearly resisting or incapable of it right now.
As with other things, sometimes we just need to let go and let people live the life they choose, meaning you, no matter how destructive it is.
Accept what is, let go of what was, and have faith in what will be
Ghost.. have you read no more mr nice guy?? I think you have said that you read it... but did you actually read it?? You seem to be the poster child for it. You need to figure out who YOU are.
