WW is onboard with trying to save the M

[Zues126]

J, the biggest thing I learned was that I had to be there for myself. If I felt I was abandoned, I had to give myself the nurturing, unconditional love, and support I craved. Whatever it is that you looked to WAW for, odds are you are looking for it elsewhere because you aren't taking care of yourself.

Take care of yourself. Be there for yourself. Be your own partner. You can do this.

[trumpet]

JGuy, getting caught up on your sitch.

I'm feeling for you. My need for emotional connection from my W is at an all-time high, and her need for me is at an all-time low.

Lots of parrallels with me - my wife had PA, 2 years later had EA, and I had a porn addiction throughout the 15 year marriage. I'm getting IC for the addiction, and over 6 weeks have come to realize I was using it to replace the emotional/physical affection my wife can't/won't/didn't give. She replaced her anger with me with another man...

So, I'm struggling with now having no coping mechanism for having a wife who is emotionally cold/distant, and we have had no sex for 3 years. She considers it 'icky' and something she might not ever do again - she says she just doesn't need it.

I come from a Christian background, but I don't expect everyone to do what I'm trying to do... save the marriage, even if I will never have the emotional and physical needs met.

What do you want to do? Does she feel the same way?

[sandi2]

So here's the thing: When my inner child is screaming and insists that he wants my W and nothing else will do, how do I redirect that need into a more healthy channel? Ignoring my inner child doesn't work. I can't kill my inner child... and I can't snap my fingers to make him grow up. I am reading many books that suggest I never received the nurturing that I needed from my mother, and so I never progressed to develop a healthy self-nurturing instinct, and never went through the natural process of detachment from my mother during adolescence. Instead, I grew up with my inner child unconsciously attaching to my SO's. This is extremely difficult for me now as it's all buried in my unconscious... I feel so incapable, and yet I fear that saving my M depends on it. God help me!!

I do not know what happened,and don't need to know about your childhood. Neither do I want to sound insensitive. I can only tell you about the wayward wife. You get whatever help you need from the professionals, but do not look to your WW to be the mother for your inner child. She is going through her own issues with a pain that is different from yours....but nevertheless, very real for her.

She cannot be an emotional nursemaid to your inner child. She just won't be able to handle it. Talk to someone else about your hurts and needs, but stop being this little insecure boy who is wanting his wife to mother him. She even doubts she ever was attracted to you. Know why? B/c a woman is not sexually attracted to her son! If you have acted the role of her child who is always needy, wanting her attention, wanting her to fix his emotional hurts..........then it killed the attraction.

Everyone has needs. And as an adult partner in a MR, we should be able to have normal emotional needs filled. We want to look to our spouse for sexual needs, love, emotional connection, etc. Obviously, everyone doesn't get those needs filled, and problems arise. If the emotional fallout from a traumatic childhood becomes more than the W can handle, or she wears too thin b/c of the constant draining effect, it can be a serious threat factor to the MR.

I think most everyone has something left over from bad things that happened during their childhood. Some people have traumatic experiences that scar them emotionally. I believe a loving spouse would hope their love would help to heal the spouse with emotional scars. In the beginning of the R, the spouse who is more emotional stable/secure may give & give to the spouse with the issues. However, after years of giving & giving........and maybe not feeling they get their own EN met........it could cause resentment.

In some relationships I have seen, the stronger, stable spouse becomes like the emotional caregiver to the weaker spouse. We see wives who act more like the H's mamma than his W. Eventually, she starts talking to him and treating him as just one more kid for her to raise. Now, some women may learn to accept that type of MR, but the other women will slowly start resenting him. And I am not trying to take a jab at you when I say this...........it does affect the level of male attraction if the H needs these reassurances all the time. If he is scared, hurt, lonely, fears being abandoned, etc., thereby becoming more attached......more clingy......more needy. The more & more he needs something from her, it's like there an emotional tax that drains her dry.

That wife not only resents his constant draining effect, she also notices her sex attraction is bombing out. She is loosing the feelings she had when she fell in love with him. She begins daydreaming of what it would be like to have a "real man" come rescue her and ride off into the sunset.

Now please listen. I am not discounting your problems in the past or present. I am, however, tying to get you to understand that if you want to really get her back....and keep her, then you have to drop this whole "What about me.....me....me....? Look at me....me....me. You are the one who were bad to me.....me.....me". She has gone one week after the real breakup with OM, and no contact? After four to six weeks of OM zero contact, let know about how she's doing. If you have been emotionally demanding on her, it won't work. One reason she turned to OM was to escape her reality. Think about it. You want to pressure her about your inner child? Your inner child needs to wait or go to a therapist, not his W at this particular time. She is not strong enough to deal with your inner child. She wants a grown man to step up and be the leader here.

This may sound as unfair to the LBS's as anything I have ever said. Your goal and focus has to appear strong. I am not referring with some weight lifter, but the guy who can handle his problems....and HER PROBLEMS, TOO! If he needs to go to therapy, then fine, but don't drag her along to it, or even discuss what was said in the sessions.

It has been one week since the breakup with OM. She is very.....VERY fragile. You could run her away forever by pulling that old card of What about me? I'm not saying your pain is not important. I'm saying that your W cannot handle it right now.

[isittoolate]

^^^^ good morning Sandi2 fab post!



One thing I used to do pre BD was run every decision past W before doing it. I thought I was being democratic in decision making - now I know it just makes me look weak and gave her 'power' to veto stuff. Now I make a decision and just do it.

[JGuy]

JGuy, getting caught up on your sitch.

I'm feeling for you. My need for emotional connection from my W is at an all-time high, and her need for me is at an all-time low.

Lots of parrallels with me - my wife had PA, 2 years later had EA, and I had a porn addiction throughout the 15 year marriage. I'm getting IC for the addiction, and over 6 weeks have come to realize I was using it to replace the emotional/physical affection my wife can't/won't/didn't give. She replaced her anger with me with another man...

So, I'm struggling with now having no coping mechanism for having a wife who is emotionally cold/distant, and we have had no sex for 3 years. She considers it 'icky' and something she might not ever do again - she says she just doesn't need it.

I come from a Christian background, but I don't expect everyone to do what I'm trying to do... save the marriage, even if I will never have the emotional and physical needs met.

What do you want to do? Does she feel the same way?

Hey Trumpet,

My W is saying similar things about not being sure if she will ever want me sexually. I could not stay in a sexless marriage as it would be miserable and empty of one of the most joyful expressions of love. I cannot live the rest of my life that way. For now, I am just keeping in mind "believe none of what she says right now, and only 50% of what she does". I am thinking that I would probably end the M myself if she still doesn't want me in 10-12 months. I recall that somewhere in DR, MWD said to expect about 1 month of recovery time for each year of the marriage. I really want to give it a fair chance.

[JGuy]

I am thinking that I would probably end the M myself if she still doesn't want me in 10-12 months. I recall that somewhere in DR, MWD said to expect about 1 month of recovery time for each year of the marriage. I really want to give it a fair chance.

I should clarify: I meant that I would probably start takings the first steps to end the M myself if I have seen no progress at all in 10-12 months. I don't expect for things to be full recovered in that time. I just want to see some signs that things are really moving in a positive direction.

[Rain75]

JGuy....i feel your pain and your fear through your words. It has to be hard to not get any affection from the woman you love and desire.

Maybe if you counter each negative with a positive it can help you feel more balanced. I.e. she won't hug me (negative) and she is still in the house (positive:).

I feel like one of the best things about this bb is that we are all at different stages and you can see how many others would love to have a W/H that is willing to stay in the house and willing to go to counseling. In that aspect you are in a good place..a better place than most, even though I know her lack of desire hurts you.

We are all in pain. Some days it's hard just to get out of bed...but if we look hard enough we can find some good.

Thank you for your advice on my post. I will take it to heart as much as I can.

Rain

[JGuy]

I do not know what happened,and don't need to know about your childhood. Neither do I want to sound insensitive. I can only tell you about the wayward wife. You get whatever help you need from the professionals, but do not look to your WW to be the mother for your inner child. She is going through her own issues with a pain that is different from yours....but nevertheless, very real for her.

She cannot be an emotional nursemaid to your inner child. She just won't be able to handle it. Talk to someone else about your hurts and needs, but stop being this little insecure boy who is wanting his wife to mother him. She even doubts she ever was attracted to you. Know why? B/c a woman is not sexually attracted to her son! If you have acted the role of her child who is always needy, wanting her attention, wanting her to fix his emotional hurts..........then it killed the attraction.

Everyone has needs. And as an adult partner in a MR, we should be able to have normal emotional needs filled. We want to look to our spouse for sexual needs, love, emotional connection, etc. Obviously, everyone doesn't get those needs filled, and problems arise. If the emotional fallout from a traumatic childhood becomes more than the W can handle, or she wears too thin b/c of the constant draining effect, it can be a serious threat factor to the MR.

I think most everyone has something left over from bad things that happened during their childhood. Some people have traumatic experiences that scar them emotionally. I believe a loving spouse would hope their love would help to heal the spouse with emotional scars. In the beginning of the R, the spouse who is more emotional stable/secure may give & give to the spouse with the issues. However, after years of giving & giving........and maybe not feeling they get their own EN met........it could cause resentment.

In some relationships I have seen, the stronger, stable spouse becomes like the emotional caregiver to the weaker spouse. We see wives who act more like the H's mamma than his W. Eventually, she starts talking to him and treating him as just one more kid for her to raise. Now, some women may learn to accept that type of MR, but the other women will slowly start resenting him. And I am not trying to take a jab at you when I say this...........it does affect the level of male attraction if the H needs these reassurances all the time. If he is scared, hurt, lonely, fears being abandoned, etc., thereby becoming more attached......more clingy......more needy. The more & more he needs something from her, it's like there an emotional tax that drains her dry.

That wife not only resents his constant draining effect, she also notices her sex attraction is bombing out. She is loosing the feelings she had when she fell in love with him. She begins daydreaming of what it would be like to have a "real man" come rescue her and ride off into the sunset.

Now please listen. I am not discounting your problems in the past or present. I am, however, tying to get you to understand that if you want to really get her back....and keep her, then you have to drop this whole "What about me.....me....me....? Look at me....me....me. You are the one who were bad to me.....me.....me". She has gone one week after the real breakup with OM, and no contact? After four to six weeks of OM zero contact, let know about how she's doing. If you have been emotionally demanding on her, it won't work. One reason she turned to OM was to escape her reality. Think about it. You want to pressure her about your inner child? Your inner child needs to wait or go to a therapist, not his W at this particular time. She is not strong enough to deal with your inner child. She wants a grown man to step up and be the leader here.

This may sound as unfair to the LBS's as anything I have ever said. Your goal and focus has to appear strong. I am not referring with some weight lifter, but the guy who can handle his problems....and HER PROBLEMS, TOO! If he needs to go to therapy, then fine, but don't drag her along to it, or even discuss what was said in the sessions.

It has been one week since the breakup with OM. She is very.....VERY fragile. You could run her away forever by pulling that old card of What about me? I'm not saying your pain is not important. I'm saying that your W cannot handle it right now.

Thanks Sandi,

I'm in complete agreement. I don't think I ever really saw my issues in full clarity until now. Now that I can see them, it's obvious how inappropriate it is to seek for these inner child needs to be met from my W.

To be clear, what I'm describing here in recent posts is how I'm feeling, but it's not how I'm behaving. I'm doing a decent job of not pursuing and being the strong one. It feels really hard because while doing that, I have to privately manage all these inner child feelings which are screaming at me louder than ever. It's really, really hard! But I think it's getting easier gradually as my emotional muscle memory adjusts to the new reality.

To clarify, it has been about 3 weeks since my W ended contact with the OM. I don't believe her 100% but I do lean toward believing her. The fact that I am seeing her make a genuine effort to work on the M is what makes it convincing for me. She is doing IC which is getting uncomfortable for her. She tells me that the IC is gently showing her how she needs to grow up in many ways she never did. It's hard for her to hear this but she is not giving up. I have noticed that my W is more respectful in communication with me and is going out of her way to thank me for small things etc. Sometimes I can tell she doesn't really feel it but is forcing herself to. I think these are probably things the IC told her she should try to work on. Also, she told me that the IC is asking her to set long and short term goals. That's good, as it's also what DR emphasizes.

The thing Sandi said that sticks with me the most right now is the part about me needing to be the stronger one. Overall, I have always been the stronger one in many ways. I just have this one weakness and being cheated on is like being stabbed right at my weakest point, so it is bringing out the weakest parts of me. The least I can do now is just not respond to these feelings by being desperate and begging. I can at least say I'm doing a good job of holding back that urge, and the urge is gradually dissipating.

[trumpet]

JGuy,

Sandi's post was spot on, and I have to admit, could have been posted on my thread.

Are you the emotional one, JGuy? My wife has always had issues expressing herself in a deep sense - while I always have been the one to want to have deep, meaningful conversations. She was always 'lets go out and get a few in us and see what happens!'.
I was the homebody who wanted to snuggle and talk about life.

Have you started any new hobbies? Do you exercise?

[JulieH]

Hi JGUY

I would like to start keeping up with your situation because I too (at least I think so) might be moving torwards piecing. Husband recently indicated he would want to give reconciliation a try through counseling and expressed interest in Retrovaille and suggested we go on dates to reconnect. He continues to state that there has been no infidelity or woman. Says he has been lonely and miserable and very depressed. But we remain at odds mostly about finances and his leaving (I feel abandoned he says I pushed him out). I don't have much trust right now. As of now he has made no other effort, has not asked me on dates and can barely look at me when we exchange kids but I also just took him to court for child support...

As the person left behind, I relate to your way of thinking. They left us, in your case (possibly mine too) cheated. They have hurt us in the most horrific of ways. My whole family and friends sees how he left and thinks I should move on. I don't know if He is capable of making changes that I need. I don't want to have to be down this road again in a couple of years older and saying "fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me". Their commitment and character is flawed. I don't want to spend my life pushing my own needs and feelings aside and having to be the bigger person because they might leave again.

They have behaved like children and They should be the one begging for our forgiveness and proving to us they are committed. Right? Yes we are, but Probably not gonna happen because right now they feel justified.

My DB coach once said " the least interested person has the power".

Really though, I think we have to take a wait and see approach. Patience. I am letting him initiate because if I am the one that has to push for this, i will never trust it. I am going to be friendly and open and work on validation but I feel he needs to want it enough to take lead. If he doesn't want me enough, the marriage is not going to work out for me in the long run and I am better off knowing now.

In the meantime I am doing things that make me feel good and trying to not focus too much on the small things right now cause I know it can go either way and I will only make my self crazy doing so

they have to be interested again, and will not be if they feel too secure about us.

Good luck.