She Wants me to leave...no way! 3

[isittoolate]

Some of my logic back at the Oct BD was a bit skewed by my panic and spinning from what I thought was a SSM with almost all other aspects of my MR being either good or ok.

That was then, we are where we are now. Analysis of then isn't now.

I thought - solve the sex problem and everything would get back on track.

I am no sex therapist but I love my nookie. Sex and more of it doesn't see to be the problem. To me it looks like you may not have given yourself permission to be sexy for yourself. Each of us is responsible for our own desires and getting our fulflment of them.


I agree especially after reading NMMNG and Hold on to your NUTS. The essence of NUTS is meet your own needs first - take responsibility.

After reading Sandi2 WW threads and reading NMMNG and hold on to your NUTS, and other threads, and looking into my memory of the last 3 years since reconciliation in 2012, I've concluded that W never really switched back onto me at that reconciliation. I fixed me , but we didn't fix US.

It s not my thought on it. W is responsible for W, you are responsible for you. It strikes me that you didn't switch back on to you, that is your job, to lift your side to do your part of US. You can only resolve your part of US. So why if we are being brassy and very forthright did you not switch you on? W (in fact any significant other) will be attracted if you find you attractive,and I don't mean in the mirror! I mean inside your body and mind.

I never read any more books like NMMNG etc and never recognised this problem I had. I read 5LL and partially applied it knowing that I wasn't giving W the LL she wanted (except in foot rubs - of which she says I am the master!). There is a whole chapter in NUTS about taking control of the romance and Sex Dept - I never. W has always organised the house, food planning, kids activities, kids after school stuff, our social life. I am good with housework, grocery shopping and cooking and paying half the bills plus the man stuff, DIY and gardening. I thought I was doing ok by doing my share but I wasn't doing the important stuff, seduction, flirting,dates, sex.
I did gifts, flowers and WOA.

The Reconciliation took 6 months of hard DBing by me, and I turned myself around from a miserable sod to a good guy, who supported and listened to W and was good with WOA, and gift buying.

That is part and now that's sorted. Next.

The bit we didn't solve was the sex.

There is no we in this. It is your responsibilty not "we". Yours to own, this one isn't joint. Agreed - as above

We tried, she tried for about 18 months.

I really hate that word try, it's an excuse set up for failure.

She wants spontaneous, passionate, sex, not planned and/or routine. By planned I mean, buy some toys and get them out the draw.

NB when we do have sex it's usually good,

You lucky pair!

it's just the getting started.

Now you have the issue identfed, just like anything else we need goals and actions. A plan to tackle procrastination, embarrassment or shame. Which is it? Where is the barrier?


i was working on a plan after reading some assertiveness books but it was too late - aka BD. Since then I have read NUTS and seen the problem
At the end she would usually say, we need to do it more often.

The Nike principle!

She started to put up more and more barriers and I reverted to Nice Guy tactics, and buried my head in the sand.

Describe the barriers? What worked, what didn't? Did you keep a Darcy, did you journal? If this was an important job project what would you do?

Also we never went on enough dates with just the two of us.

So where is the action plan?

Only to the movies, occasional meals and a yearly trip to London for her birthday.

And? and? And?

At the same time as the barriers to sex and making time and putting preconditions on where sex would take place - she would start to do more social stuff with her friends and less with me.

I don't blame her! She wants GAL, tired of waiting, no dates with her H, it's up to you.

She thinks to herself, he's a good H (supportive, WOA,gifts etc) , but I don't love him, and don't want sex with him. She slowly withdraw with no complaints, ......then I complain and it's a BD.

Mind reading. That is for W to know. If complaining doesn't work, why do it? Why not plan, have goals, suggest stuff instead?

She wants us to separate after Xmas, me to leave the family home, because she is the primary carer especially as I work away a fair bit. D has been touched upon, but not really mentioned.

So you have the gift of time?

I can't give her physical touch.

Why not? Start wth tiny things.

She started to massage her own foot two days ago so I offered a foot rub and she said 'no it would be weird'.

Why ask? Just say I am going to do that for you. Its worth a try for sure. and if she rejects back off?

Shoulder rub is a possibility.

Its a starter for 10. Remember that this will be an issue for you in any R. Then for your sake tackle this. Excuse the pun.....


Usually I can also pull my fingers through her long hair - she likes that.

OK, let's have a list of that which is doable and a plan to do it. OK shoulder rub, foot rub as a starter for 10

But she will get our boys to brush her hair - they like to do it.

Sounds good so far.......shoulder rub and hair pull come as one package . in the past I have offered to brush her hair but been knocked back ' i like the S11 to do it'

I can do WOA , her 2nd LL, ,you look good in that dress, gym gear, your hair is great etc.

More tomorrow, it's late. Thanks for looking in.

[Vanilla]

Could you finish answering my questions please so I can think a little more.

Dig deeper.....

V

[isittoolate]

She started to put up more and more barriers and I reverted to Nice Guy tactics, and buried my head in the sand.

Describe the barriers? What worked, what didn't? Did you keep a Darcy, did you journal? If this was an important job project what would you do?

The barriers were time (lack of) and place. W gets up for work at 6:00am every day and sleep is precious to her (woe betide anyone who wakes her early) so no chance in the morning M-F. Sat and Sun am she goes to the gym. Friday night and/or Sat night she would go out and then sleeps in until it time to get up and go to the gym or for me to go on my GAL activity (cycling). Also she made it plain - no sex in bed on Sat/Sun morning - its boring. In the evening after kids were put to bed, she changes into a Onesie (a Dalmation!) - the biggest passionkiller ever invented - but apparently its comfortable.

Lack of connection, chemistry, passion, spontaneity-->lack of desire ->barriers and my response.... well at least everything else in the MR is ok. I am supportive, we communicate well, WOA, gifts, we dont fight etc. If I keep my head in this sandpit and dont rock the boat everything will be ok?


Also we never went on enough dates with just the two of us.

So where is the action plan? There was none

[isittoolate]

Vanilla is my favourite ice cream looking forward to some more.

Yesterday W and I were both at home for the majority of the day. W was working from home then heading off to a chalet in a Forest for a girls weekend. 5 girls inc her sister and chief bridesmaid. They are hiring Segways, having beauty treatments, etc. she is back Sunday afternoon.

She took her wedding ring, so that's good. It seems she only had both rings off on
Monday and Tuesday.

Again I kept out of her way, she worked on laptop in kitchen, I was in office. We did have nice convos , just small talk and then a bit more when her chief bridesmaid called. It's always a bit weird talking to her best friends as I don't know how much they know about the sitch.

One interesting snippet: the arrangements for s11 to go to scouts in the evening got a bit complicated as a friends moms car had broken down. I fixed the arrangements by making a few texts. W tried to help but I said I could sort it. She then said ' don't push me away when I try to help'

I'm trying to arrange a a drink out tonight with a friend and also a GAL activity next Sat in London. I've got a free ticket to a cycling expo worth £40.

I'll review my goals tomorrow. The W goals need working on. Some of my personal goals have been achieved so I will archive them.

[isittoolate]

A footnote from yesterday:

W was preparing food to take with her on her weekend away with the girls. Each girl was taking a dish each.

She came into the office to enthuse about the taste of her dish - it's one of our favourite curries .

She then said she would have to make it again in a couple of weeks - for us.

No expectations but a positive sign - baby steps

[isittoolate]

Review of Goals. NB W goals are a work-in-progress. I have archived the goals I have achieved.

With W:

1. When W uses her nickname for me (affectionate nickname) more frequently either written or vocally. This will mean she is thinking of me more positively.

2. When W says she would like Us/her to see an IC/MC. An ultimate goal?

3. When W asks for a shoulder rub or foot massage or if I initiate a shoulder rub or foot massage and she accepts

4. When W compliments me on a positive change I have made since BD i.e. 'Your such a good father to the kids'
5. When W wears her wedding band again. THIS IS PARTIALLY ACHIEVED
6. When W is 'happy' to go out with me at a function without the kids - even as 'friends'. SHE SAID YES TO THE MOVIES

(NB I need to flesh out the action points below)

Action for W goals:

To work towards being a more confident, self assured individual, and eliminating any remaining Nice Guy tendencies. To be more lighthearted and flirty, chatty with the opposite sex, Someone who W will respect and find attractive.

How: Taking more responsibility for organising childcare, being involved with my kids after school activities, volunteering for the scouts, loving and playing with my children more and Continue with my fitness and GAL regime.

Kids:
6. I will show love to our boys each and every day through word and deed...4
7. I will bring fun and laughter into the house and lighten the mood...3
8. I will do more to organise childcare...4
9. I will ring the kids before bed every night I am working away...5
10. I will kiss the kids goodnight and hug them and say ILY when I am at home...5

GAL:
11. I will reignite my passion for running and enter a few races ...4
12. I will start salsa dancing lessons – one or two per week...5
13. I will contact old friends and meet up with them – one every two weeks....3

Personal

19. I will do spontaneous act of kindness to friend, neighbour or stranger as opportunities arise....3
20. I will assert myself physically through open body language, stand tall, eye contact, face W, listen, don't interrupt, validate....3
21. NEW GOAL I will chat more to strangers to become more extrovert, engaging, and friendly



ACHIEVED GOALS!

14. I will take care of myself with regard to sleep and reduce my sleeping pills...5 (NB I havent used sleeping pills for 8 days)
15. I will maintain my present weight and not lose anymore....5
16. I will shave each and every day ...5
17. I might get some Botox? (If W can have it so can I!)..5
21. I will look to update my wardrobe...5
22. I will read NMMNG, and Hold on to your NUTS...5

[Ancaire]

Wow. Impressive. Why didn't you invite me for the Botox day? I would have went with you!!! What do you think? Is it helping?

Your goals are totally inspiring me. Really, really good. I like the way you've archived the ones you completed.

[isittoolate]

Hi Ancaire - Botox was a bit of a luxury but it does make me look a bit younger. I trust the nurse who did it. She is very experienced and also does my W botox. Its not over the top, just subtle.

I had a shorter haircut and with the two W said 'your face looks different, somehow tidier' LOL!

W likes the luxuries in life, so I dont feel guilty for treating myself. i.e. she is off for a Spa weekend with the girls which probably costs the same as the botox.

PS New Goal: To read Hold on to your NUTS again

[Vanilla]

[So where are the goals for YOU to use W five love languages?

A sample from a simple search of it! //preengaged.com/how-to-love-your-physical-touch-partner-love-language-practical-tips-part-2/

------------------
Your 'goals' with W are measurements of achievement not the goals and actions themselves.

Goals are things you do, not things W does.

So

1. My goal is xxxxxxx and I know I have achieved it when W uses her nickname for me (affectionate nickname) 3 times a week? either written or vocally.

This will mean she is thinking of me more positively. mind reading leave out

2. My goal is to behave xyz five times a day for the next 4 weeks so that W says she will agree to see an IC/MC when I suggest it. Then I book it.

3. I softly initiate a shoulder rub or foot massage every two or three days initially for 5 mins and she accepts

4. I do xyz so that I encourage W to compliment me on a positive change I have made since BD i.e. 'Your such a good father to the kids'


5. When W wears her wedding band again. THIS IS PARTIALLY ACHIEVED
This is W behaviour it might be something you notice or measure

6. I suggest a different activity every week and plan for it, the movies skating, walking on a beach and I make this enjoyable. I insist on a small treat every time and I behave without expectation.

When W is 'happy' to go out with me at a function without the kids - even as 'friends'. Mind reading her feelings

SHE SAID YES TO THE MOVIES!


Include;

I help W with her coat, shopping, touching her hand arm or back lightly as I smile. I pass her glasses of wine with lingering touch. Help her make the beds. I spontaneously do a funny dance. I say let me do that, and comb her hair. I open doors and use every opportunity to 'accidentally' connect.

I initiate 2 conversations a day about things important to W by leaning forward to ask about her day, how her sick gran is etc. I listen intently without interrupting or solving her problems. I nod agreement.

I validate correctly and I project my strength to her.
____________________________
In your case it is better to ask for forgiveness rather than permission.

There is a video of Tony Robbins on the Oprah showcase that I would like you to watch. It includes body language and acting and behaving as if.

://www.oprah.com/oprahs-lifeclass/Tony-Robbins-Helps-Jacob-Overcome-His-Fears-Video add http

Can you redo these goals? These are your most important ones.

After this we can set some for initiation of sex and planning to be spontaneous!

V isn't going to allow excuses to become reasons. However if you want to tell me back off I will and without offence. Posters here do say V another time, it's ok.

V

[isittoolate]

Sweet Vanilla - So sorry to read about your troubles on yr thread, It must be horrible to be frightened in yr own village

So where are the goals for YOU to use W five love languages?

I will work on it tomorrow, going out tonight

I wanted to see what suggestions you had, and then formulate goals and actions around them alongside my own.

Thanks for the links as well.

Doing some of these physical touches would be seen as typical pursuing - but I'm willing to see if it works.

W is back tomorrow afternoon and I have invited a family friend (lonely grandmother whose close family have emigrated to the East!) around for dinner.

vanilla - don't back off - I need outside help/encouragement/advice as I have spoken to no one about this.