Re: LBH w/ a WW trying to save my M (3)

[gs9]

Hey gs9,

I think sandi2 has a thread on the WW and what to do and rules to follow if you are going to piece your R together. Its is very to the point and applies to you with the PA. you may have to read through a lot of posts on that thread to get to it.

Good luck.

thanks Vice, I've read a ton of Sandi's stuff. I believe I've read through the WW rules. She is reaching out to me and showing she's scared to lose me but not yet ready to commit. I think I need to keep the GALing more responsible.

[gs9]

Did you read DB or DR?

I'm most of the way through the DB book. I've also hired a coach who I've had 2 sessions with.

Since you cheated on her, trust is the biggest problem for her. And with you running off and doing whatever you want, you've shown that you can't be trusted.

Very true. I'll be more responsible with this.

In what ways have you tried to rebuild trust with her?

I started with books "Winning your wife back before it's too late", "Worthy of her trust", "Defiled", etc....
I began telling her everywhere I went. when I arrived at work, when I left work, where I was going, who I was with full reports all day long. Checking in on a regular basis. I continually reassured her. I gave her full access to my email, back accounts, phone...everything. I did this for 10+ months which isn't a very long time but it was until about a month after her first A. Then I stopped.

[otw]

i understand your thinking because i have those thoughts as well. In the midst of you doing all of this what have you done to show her you are someone only a fool would leave?

Unfortunately I pushed the GALing too far. No need to be out to the wee hours of the morning. That is not someone only a fool would leave. Time to slightly alter course

i think you are right, but be careful and not go to kissing her behind and chasing her around. that is not what you should be doing. Make your list of things you can be doing to improve yourself for you and your children. What can you be doing to be the man you know you are meant to be, not for her but for you and your kids.

[MrBond]

"I did this for 10+ months which isn't a very long time but it was until about a month after her first A. Then I stopped."

Why? You just re-enforced the idea that you were only doing those things to get her back and that you hadn't really changed. You just showed that your changes weren't real.

[gs9]

i understand your thinking because i have those thoughts as well. In the midst of you doing all of this what have you done to show her you are someone only a fool would leave?

Unfortunately I pushed the GALing too far. No need to be out to the wee hours of the morning. That is not someone only a fool would leave. Time to slightly alter course

i think you are right, but be careful and not go to kissing her behind and chasing her around. that is not what you should be doing. Make your list of things you can be doing to improve yourself for you and your children. What can you be doing to be the man you know you are meant to be, not for her but for you and your kids.

Yeah, I'll be getting home at a reasonable hour

[gs9]

"I did this for 10+ months which isn't a very long time but it was until about a month after her first A. Then I stopped."

Why? You just re-enforced the idea that you were only doing those things to get her back and that you hadn't really changed. You just showed that your changes weren't real.

I stopped because she started having an A and refused to stop contact with him. She told me she never checked on where I was going, she wasn't checking my emails and I could have been doing anything I wanted. She didn't know if she could trust me because she wasn't checking. She said my check in text messages were annoying. I also saw it as pursuing someone who no longer was honoring our M.

Do you think I should have kept doing these things even though she had left our M?

[MrBond]

"I stopped because she started having an A and refused to stop contact with him."

Why?

"She told me she never checked on where I was going, she wasn't checking my emails and I could have been doing anything I wanted. She didn't know if she could trust me because she wasn't checking. She said my check in text messages were annoying."

You don't have to make them seem like you're checking in. And besides, her recent texts to you prove the opposite of what she told you. I thought you read DB? Remember the believe none of what they say and half of what they do rule?

"I also saw it as pursuing someone who no longer was honoring our M.

Do you think I should have kept doing these things even though she had left our M?"

Why not? She did it to you when you weren't honoring your M.

Funny how now that she's going after someone who she feels respects her after you didn't, that you feel that SHE is wrong and are trying to punish her for it.

Just goes to show how badly your A hurt her.

So you have a choice. Show that you can be trusted (doesn't have to be checking in) by doing things that show you are trustworthy or continue to look down on her even though you did it to her.

[sandi2]

I've made the boundary of this is where I'll be sleeping but she brought up that when I come home late she would like to sleep in there because the garage door wakes her up.

She thought she had you on the MBR/garage door. Yep! You can bet your bottom dollar she's controlling.

will you be at the house this weekend? If so please make sure the cat has food, please clean the litter. I've done most of the housework, but please dust everything and clean pictures w windex, and please clean the marital bathroom" I know this is her being very controlling telling me what to do around the house. I did not respond.

OMG! She could have had half of those jobs completed by the time it took to write it out. I can just see me leaving a list of jobs for my H and telling him to dust everything & clean the pictures with windex! Good, you didn't respond.

She must think if she keeps you tied up all weekend, you won't have time to do something fun.

2 hours later she sent another txt " Don't bring a woman into my house. That would be a mistake" I didn't respond.

Now it comes out. Great job of not responding!

Saturday evening she sent a text that said " I'm missing you not being here" I didn't respond. 2 hours later she sent a text that said " Ha! Well, at least I tried! I'm sure you've moved on" I didn't respond

I love it, love it, love it!!! See how she's desperately trying to get a reaction out of you?

Sunday- I asked her to have the kids call me. 2 hours later she said " I asked D4 to call....she ran outside to play w the boys. We will be home by 6." I didn't respond.

Just before 6 she called me 3-4 times and I didn't answer. She then sent a text that said " I'm having a friend and his daughter over for dinner. DO NOT COME by here." I didn't respond. I believe she was lying. she was mad bc I didn't respond to her telling me she missed me and I wasn't there when they got home.

Exactly. She's tried pushing several different buttons and nothing worked. She saved the "I've missed you" for last. Excellent job at not falling for it and responding.

90 minutes later she sent a txt "Have you seen the remote"
I responded " I haven't. I understand your frustration w the garage door waking you up. I've been clear about where I'll be sleeping and why. If you'll leave the chain off the front door I'll park outside the garage and use the front door or you can sleep in the basement."
She responded " Stay out of my room" "tell your girlfriend that you keep trying to sleep with me" "Don't wake up D4 and I bc you are selfish and inconsiderate" I didn't respond.

Just more buttons she's pushing. Good job. Keep it up!

She said she would be honest with me if I would be honest with her. I said Ok, are you still talking with the 2 guys you've had an affair with? She said she still talks to the first one 2-3/wk and it could have been considered a physical, emotional and mental affair but the second guy hasn't done anything inappropriate and she hasn't talked to him since September because he won't talk to her until the divorce is final.

No, she won't. She just wants to be assured that you have no girlfriend.

I said " so nothing inappropriate?"
She said "no".
I said " I know you're not being honest. You expect me to be honest with you but you're not being honest with me"
She said " yes I am, he is just a good friend"
I said " W, I've read your text messages. I know you're not being honest. I know you've told him you love him, you're looking forward to a future with him, you've spent the night with him and he has told you he loves you too." She then admitted to these things.

Well, you should not have told her you've read her messages.

I then told her everything....

I told her that I understand and I would be happy to stop playing if she would stop talking to the other guy. She said it's not even a bargaining chip because she has no connection to this guy. I think she's just making an excuse to keep talking to him but I said "fine, I'll just stop playing because I understand it to be a obstacle if we're going to reconcile so I'll just stop"

Why???????

I told her I love her, I want her, I do not want a divorce, I want our m just not like the one we had.

She said our marriage ended last year and this part is just the paperwork. That if we're going to be M we would have a new proposal, ceremony and rings.

I noticed she said nothing about reconciling. She wants a wedding with new rings and the works.

We did hug some on the bed on top of the covers before we went to our separate rooms.

Oh yeah? And who slept in the MBR?

The H is telling me to be open and honest with her. To not withhold from her. That she is coming around. To be an open book. I'm doubtful

You poor sap! You were doing fantastic until you decided to be open and tell her everything without holding back. THIS WAS NOT THE RIGHT TIME! She was spinning. She was pursuing. She was jealous. She was frustrated she couldn't manipulate you......and you turned around and just screwed it.

[gs9]

"I stopped because she started having an A and refused to stop contact with him."

Why?

"She told me she never checked on where I was going, she wasn't checking my emails and I could have been doing anything I wanted. She didn't know if she could trust me because she wasn't checking. She said my check in text messages were annoying."

You don't have to make them seem like you're checking in. And besides, her recent texts to you prove the opposite of what she told you. I thought you read DB? Remember the believe none of what they say and half of what they do rule?

First off....thank you so much for chatting with me today. I am really struggling today.
When I stopped I hadn't been to this site or the DB book yet. I started using tough love and stopped pursuing her bc it felt like I wasn't getting anywhere by pursuing her. She continued to verbally abuse, running me down and rubbing the other guy in my face on a regular basis.
So you do think I should have continued letting her know where I was going and what I was doing even though she is WW?

"I also saw it as pursuing someone who no longer was honoring our M.

Do you think I should have kept doing these things even though she had left our M?"

Why not? She did it to you when you weren't honoring your M.

I'm sorry I'm confused about this part. She did what to me when I was not honoring our M?

Funny how now that she's going after someone who she feels respects her after you didn't, that you feel that SHE is wrong and are trying to punish her for it.

Help me understand how I'm punishing her bc I definitely don't want to do that. I feel the difference here (not that what she is doing is worse than what I did) is my unfaithfulness was once, no sex and I immediately confessed, repented, showed remorse, asked for forgiveness and began trying to earn her trust and reconcile our M. She has slept with at least one guy, has had at least 2 A and it's been ongoing for 5 months. She shows no remorse, no apology, no repentance and continues communication with at least one other man to this date. How do I help her get to where I immediately went to? Remorse, reconciliation, repentance

Just goes to show how badly your A hurt her.

It destroyed her. I know. I have recently taken every opportunity to validate those feelings when she expresses them. She's given me this opportunity twice in the last week.

So you have a choice. Show that you can be trusted (doesn't have to be checking in) by doing things that show you are trustworthy or continue to look down on her even though you did it to her.

You're right. I do have a choice. I took the GALing too far. I wanted her to wonder what I was doing and where I was going. I'm not surprised that her imagination would immediately go to "I must be with OW" bc jealousy has been a big issue for her. But I thought we want a WW to wonder and worry about losing us? If she doesn't worry about losing me won't she continue down the same path.
Give it to me straight. If I'm screwing up tell me. I appreciate constructive criticism.

[MrBond]

"She continued to verbally abuse, running me down and rubbing the other guy in my face on a regular basis.
So you do think I should have continued letting her know where I was going and what I was doing even though she is WW?"

Not necessarily. You can show your trustworthiness in other ways. For example, if you say you're going to do something, do it. If you're going to the store, tell her and just ask if she needs something. etc.

"I feel the difference here (not that what she is doing is worse than what I did) is my unfaithfulness was once, no sex and I immediately confessed, repented, showed remorse, asked for forgiveness and began trying to earn her trust and reconcile our M."

Ask any woman on here if what you did was devastating, even though there was no physical sex. To them an EA is much worse than a PA.

And just to be clear, I don't condone what your W is doing. There's something inside her that needs validating. She's doing what she's doing because she wants to FEEL like she's worth it. She has low self-esteem and feels like she needs other men to fill that emptiness in her. It could have been triggered by your A, it could have been something from her past, whatever.

Just concentrate on what YOU can do. It's tough as heck to not think of your W with another guy, trust me, I know, but the sooner you start concentrating on your actions and not hers, the quicker you will get through this.

It already seems like she's waffling because of her text about you possibly seeing other women. Don't tell her you are or are not. She will start reflecting her own insecurities onto you so you'll see more paranoia on her part. Shows that she doesn't want to fully give you up yet. Use that to your advantage.