I only have a minute and I'm just lurking today, but I felt that I MUST write something here for you. I'm glad RodeoWidow is still luring around too. Her sitch was really similar to what you are describing. I agree with RW...your H doesn't know what you think and what you want and you are doing a great job with your "as if" attitude. I believe that you need to express to him in NO UNCERTAIN terms that you do not want a D. I had a great "as if" attitude and I never resisted any of the D plans that my H was making, but I ALWAYS told him in no uncertain terms that this was NOT what I wanted. I always managed to sneak in a comment about how I was hoping that we could work things out and then I would just act "as if". So, even though I was acting "as if" wonderfully, he always knew where I stood.
As for the "friends" issue, I had to deal with that too. I really think that this is your hook. My H said that same thing about being better as friends than as marriage partners. I believe what this really means is "I Love you more than you can imagine and I cannot comprehend my life without you." Trust me, Carrie, on this one. These feelings are feelings of love. It was because of these feelings that my H decided to stay with me. He woke up one morning and said, "what the he11 am I doing?"
When I was talking to Ellen Kreidman (author of "Light His Fire"), she advised me not to reassure my H that we would still be friends afterwards. She said that I should leave that as mysterious or flat out say "NO". I opted to be vague and that drove my H nuts. I never reassured him that we could still be friends and I think that frightened him. Dr. Kreidman said that I could make friends anywhere and that I should expect my H to be a H, not just a friend. So that is indeed the attitude that I took in my interactions with my H. I don't think that I ever came out and said that to him, but I think that it showed in my attitude.
As for the do-it-yourself D papers, remember when my H went to the internet site to do the papers online? You were there for me to calm me down when I was panic-ing. It's just a piece of paper, Carrie. What I decided was that I would not sign any quick D papers. I did not agree with the D and I did not want a D so, therefore, I could not in good conscience sign my name to a D. My H would have to go to a judge and he is a procrastinator too which I was hoping would be to my advantage.
These are just all ideas to throw around, but I think that I've said to you before that you must let H know that you don't want D. You don't have to get into any heavy R discussions, just throw it out there every once in awhile and go back to "as if". For example, when H was asking you where you were going to live, you could say in an upbeat tone something like, "Well, all along I was hoping that we could work things out and we could buy another house over in... (insert neighborhood that you both have been thinking about living). Beyond that I haven't really thought about it." Then you don't wait or look for a reaction. You just continue with being happy and acting "as if" and move on to something else.
I'll check in with you later. Enjoy your visit with your family.
Christine
I am the master of creating positive energy and love in my own environment. I am the source of love in my life. It starts with me! This energy radiates from me! It gives me strength, courage, wisdom and grace!
Quote: you must let H know that you don't want D. You don't have to get into any heavy R discussions, just throw it out there every once in awhile and go back to "as if". For example, when H was asking you where you were going to live, you could say in an upbeat tone something like, "Well, all along I was hoping that we could work things out and we could buy another house over in... ...Beyond that I haven't really thought about it." Then you don't wait or look for a reaction. You just continue with being happy and acting "as if" and move on to something else.
Christine, you are amazing. You're cheering ME up too.
Hang in there, Carrie, we're behind you all the way.
hey girl! hope you're having good trip! Think the casual approach works best, it has for me. Like stay cool and be friendly talk to H for now. Share exciting stuff you're doing, and new ppl you've met.. Like ignoring the lame "papers" until he mentions. And if/when H brings up the papers subject again, validate and slip it in at the end your feelings following the vibe that is there. Think it is true that WAS's will speak in absolute "decisive" terms on the surface, but really doubt underneath. Big thing may be due to his own feelings of inadeaquacy about himself. Like if he starts getting too insistent about the process starting or something, then maybe slip in your feelings in a non-confrontational way- like maybe even as putting it off- you're not really sure, Ive got to give it some time, not my preference kind of thing.
Master the self-fulfilling prophecy.. Act 'as if' it's going to happen and make it be!!
I think it's effective to get the message across about him "losing" you, and that you don't want a D, but words may not always be the most effective medium, it really depends on your individual sitch. Find what works for you through experimenting. Say it here and there, but doing more may be required.. Mine came through more when he got scared seeing me with possible health crisis,and me calling him for help- rather than any of our convos about our R. Heck, when I mentioned me moving across country he was happy about me doing it! He told me all the reasons why I should in a friendly, enthused way! Major macho front, perhaps even him being in "control" of this- he can't make me happy or he just knows it didn't feel right anymore, so he's gonna decide what I should or we should do. So, words were not the medium in that case....
It's gonna happen good for you, I know it though, girl!! Just a matter of finding what works, so keep trying to find your angle!
Last edited by rj2; 03/25/0412:36 AM.
Master the self-fulfilling prophecy.. Act 'as if' it's going to happen and make it be!!
Hey All- You guys are so great, and I hope that one day I can return the favor to all of you. I just got back from my trip last night, but while I was gone I lurked on my thread and was blown away by all the support and great ideas. You guys gave me so much to think about, and I really appreciate that.
My trip was awesome. Nothing like a brand new baby nephew to take my mind off my sitch. I was so engrossed in that little guy that I barely thought about H or the silly D papers he gave me. I was pretty unavailable while I was gone- wasn't on the computer for e-mails or IM, but the few times I was, he always IM'd as soon as I signed on and we chatted a bit. He called a few times and the interactions were as usual: up, down, up, down. The last day of my trip we got an offer on the house, and we got those papers all signed late last night. So it looks like the house is sold again. First thing this morning I had an interview with my new job prospect, which I think went really well. All in all things have been so crazy the last week and I'm starting to feel a little worn out!
I've read over all of your comments many times, and overwhelmingly it appears that I need to be clear with H that I don't want a D. I think that you're all right about this, but it is sooooo scary to think about how I will do it. I think I am just scared of rejection. I am thinking back on post-bomb, pre-DB days when I was begging for no D and H was adamant about a D. I guess for me just not mentioning the D and going about my life as-if has felt really good, and now to think about re-stating my position feels scary. But, I know you all are right because my thinking has been: of course he knows I don't want a D, I told him a million times in the beginning that I didn't. This is obviously very silly thinking because he can't read my mind, so how would he know I haven't changed my mind unless I tell him. I've changed so many other things, why would he assume this has stayed the same? So, still trying to work out how I will do this, but realize now it must be done.
As well, many of you said I should be more dark, more mysterious, and I think I probably should be. This is such a tough one for me, as I'm sure it is for many of you, because we want the contact with them so much. So it feels weird to pull back from that. But, I think that he is too comfortable with having me as his best friend whenever he wants, and also living it up on his own. So, still trying to work out how to do this as well.
I've thought a lot about my interactions with H. The good, the bad, and the indifferent, and I realized that I deal with three distinctly different H personalities: the drunk H, the depressed H, and the over-confident H. None of these are much fun! The drunk H is very chatty and calls a lot late at night. He can get a little sappy and likes to initate R talk. These R talks are all about us being great friends and apologetic about things not turning out the way we had hoped they would so many years ago. The depressed H is indifferent. He's short on the phone and in person so tough to have a conversation with. He's totally engrossed in himself. He is feeling sorry for himself and seeing the bad in everything. The depressed H doesn't bring up R talk, but does talk a lot about how miserable his life is and how it's not at all like how he wants it to be. But, the over-confident H is the worst. This one is so certain of his D decisions and how perfect things will be in his life once these decisions are followed through. This is the H that delivered the bomb and delivered the psuedo-D papers. This H is so damn happy because he thinks a great life is just moments away...
So, don't know if all this analyzing got me anywhere, but it was pretty interesting once I thought it out!!
Okay, will probably post more later. I am off to pick up the dog from H. I have so much catching up to do with all you guys!! Hope you're all well. Although I wasn't on your threads, you were all in my thoughts!!
You know, I just realized in thinking more about the H personalities, that I left out the most important one of all: the old H. This is the least seen H, but the most highly anticipated. This is the H that I know and love, and the H that I'm hoping will permanently emerge any day now. I see this H every now and then, and this H lets me know that all will be okay eventually. How could I have forgotten this one!?
HI CARRIE!!!! Glad to see you back and glad your trip went well!! I totally feel you with the H and emotions...I totally see my H the same way!!! Exactly!!!...although he never drinks - maybe he should every now and then?!??!
I know you will make the best approach possible when you talk to your H about not wanting the D and still wanting to save your M. Yes, eventually they will come back and hopefully in one piece so then we can bop them over the head!!!
Bye for now...look forward to talking with you soon!!
XO TO
Me 28 H 30
Together 11 Years
Married 7
Seperated 11/2004
Divorced 4/2005
Carrie--I find it interesting that the differences between Drunk H and Depressed H are exactly like Mr. Not-So (Wonderful, that is). It drives me insane!
I think back as to why I never felt really loved... Mr. W. would be really romantic and gushy when he was drinking and very clipped and stoic when he wasn't. I can't remember the last time he told me he loved me when he was stone cold sober. That isn't a very nice feeling...
Anyway, I'm glad you returned with some resolve and a plan. As they said in the 90s... YOU GO, GIRL!
TTYL,
Betsey
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
I really like how you've identified his moods and or personas. Now you will know what to expect when you are seeing tendancies with these personas. Yes, the REAL him is buried in there somewhere.
As far as ILY goes, hasn't it been said before that the most basic needs and feelings come out of the influence? Those darn walls again.
