My lizard and her tunnel ...

[CaliGuy]

I've discovered that NC is difficult here. It's hard on me and we still need to communicate about the kids. (Mainly D12, rest is between her and my boys.) She told me today that S16 won't respond to her and that it is my fault. I told her I stopped getting involved in their relationship some time ago and any issues they have are between them.

I read this yesterday but was on my way out ... and could not reply the way I like to ... ya know .. long winded ... from the phone.

Late ... NC with kids is just impossible, no getting around that. What I did was just went NC when it came to anything but S .... W figured this out over time and would use this as a hidden door to communicate .... ie pic of S, to which I would reply every now n then "cute pic ...TY" and she would fire back something nice n sweet just to make sure I was still on the hook. Took some time to wiggle off that hook for me.
S8 and W too had issues ... Like you .. I opt'd for the "The R between you and S is just that .. .between you and S" this worked for some time till W was convinced I was plotting S against her, which led to a truth dart that it was not me who kissed OM in front of S then labeling OM just a "friend" ... kids do understand a lie when they hear one. This was towards the end of the A.

We are speaking a bit again. So far nothing serious. Not sure how rock firm I can be on this. Situation is painful when I am involved, painful when I am not involved. Simply working on a lot of space at the moment and gearing myself up to telling her she can't move back home yet. (Assuming she's going to try once she loses the apartment they share.)

You read it correctly, AJ. And yes, she absolutely knows how to keep me hooked. The signals have been very mixed. All over the board. Goes from get out of my life to I want to come home often.

This is the tough part ... they want you where they left you, they will expect to cake eat ... keep you as option #2 as long as they can. Almost like training wheels ... afraid to ride without them or the LBS having a hold of that bike fearing they will crash. Amazing what seems to happen when the LBS is able to drop the rope from a place of strength.

Absolutely listen to AJ, dude is not only wise, he will ask you a question that sits in your craw for a few days ... forcing you to soul search before you can truly answer. Do not have that door open for her right now, nor the light on. Makes me think of Forest Gump when Jenny would just come and go as she wanted and that poor stupid man just went along with it.

On your identity part, I agree with you, I think that is part of the problem for many LBSs, myself included. A large part of me was her, I'm still working on finding me without her. I think the healthier option is to already know who you are before your marriage goes down the tubes, not to be so co-dependent. I wasn't there and while I can't say I didn't see this coming, she was unhappy before she left. I thought we were much closer to working it out than we were obviously.

You offer wise advise, as always. I will be doing my best to go slow.

I think its just nearly impossible to expect a LBS who is still dazed and confused from BD to detach after 20 years with someone. I had no idea who I was without my W, which was part of the problem .... I slowly and surely stopped being me, and to be honest it was not like I could go back 20 years and dig out the old me and say .. here I am .. now Love me. This is why I think the reinvention portion of this is so vital .... seems more so for the LBH as our confidence/self esteem seems so tightly bound to how we are perceived as attractive... which is rough as that's exactly what takes the biggest hit with the BD, A and OM in the situation.

So when she was 22, she was diagnosed with major depression. She was told she would need to take anti-depressants for the rest of her life. She stuck with those for a while, a couple of years. She had an on again off again relationship with them. When she was taking them, I could always see a major difference. Well, she has been off of them for the past five years or so. Been drinking more. She's at the point now where she's drunk 3-5 nights per week. This is the most depressed I have ever seen her. She did talk to me about seeing a therapist, which I think is an excellent idea.

Point being, the depression makes me spin even more. I ask myself sometimes, is this W talking or the depression? I worry that one day she starts to wake up and realizes everything that she has done. Everything she has lost. I am worried that she won't survive that day. She's tried to hurt herself before and it does concern me. I feel like during this awakening process, she'll need to make amends with me. (Perhaps I am being conceited here) I feel like if that ship has sailed, she may check out for good. While I can get behind it is her life and they are her choices, she should have to face the consequences, it is harder for me to take that approach when the consequences could literally be life or death.

Please, club away. I'm sure I have earned it.

No Clubs ... as AJ said .. you already self inflict plenty ... but even then in this case I do not see anything club-worthy.

The meds, depression, and drinking are tough. My W has had bouts with the depression ... like you I was/am scared about her facing what she has done and really flipping out about it. Seems currently we are in a "Don't ask/Don't Tell" policy ... but I see her crack here n there.
Thing is ... what I learned the hard way. You can not fix her depression, you can not talk her through it, during the crisis I had to force myself from trying to 'help'. I would protect S and do what I could there ... but W needed to figure it all out without me. Was like tough love parents at times have to do with their own kids ... in a "We Love you but can no longer watch you do this to yourself" approach. W during a dark moment begged me not to leave, knowing OM was in the picture Also knowing he was not there to take care of her .... and reading here to let the OM fill ALL her needs .. I told her I could no longer be that guy ... she cried and said "But you are my Rock" ... I reached into the water feature we had bought years ago .. placed a rock in her hand and told her "Here is your new rock, I can no longer be a part of this life you are leading" and out the door I went ..... cringing the entire time mind you as I realized I just handed my hot-blooded W a very hard projectile.

I am not saying ditch her late ... but she fired you, for the time being let OM fill ALL her needs... sounds like this is not going to happen, which is good.... she needs some alone time to sort out the mess, figure out what she wants ... all while you are creating a better version of yourself.