Zelda - Baby One More Time

[Zelda09]

A hard dream. H was in hospital again, I was 3 mo pregnant. We were a team again, working with his doctors, like in a large hotel suite. There was still the throwing things, feelings of being devalued when they weren't around...I posted about it on FB (the horror!) - the comments came in, good to get it in the open but you always say what happened, how do you feel?

I woke up relieved that if done no such thing and sad that we were not in fact a team anymore, even if it meant wrestling with some of this.

I feel sad so much of the time. Devastated at how and what happened that week.
Angry that he set me up during piecing when it was using.
Angry he demonized me, pushed me away, M really meant nothing
Disgusted that his top priority was getting under someone to get over me
Lost, confused over the past
Regretting the times I didn't leave for good
Hopeful still of his great awakening, that I can keep the good parts of him I loved
Scared about the future
Anxious about my upcoming gearing, dread seeing him

The overwhelming feeling is still disbelief and horror. None of it adds up or seems possible.

[asitis]

It sounds like it really, really hurts. I'm sorry.

Again, please don't beat yourself up on top of the abuse you took for not leaving sooner. You left. That took great courage and great love for yourself. Focus on that accomplishment. The sad reality is that most abuse victims stay and stay and stay. There are many, many reasons for this, including socialization, stigmatization, loss of self-esteem as part of the abuse, lack of options, fear that they will never be wanted again, etc. These are normal. These are not the victims fault. It is part of the abuse. Read that again: it is part of the abuse. As in, not the victim's fault. Society at large doesn't understand this, but those who have been abused and get help and those who help them do understand this.

Is there a women's support group for abuse survivors in your area? I think it would be very valuable to you in addition to the IC to be involved and get the support of other women who can understand and sympathize and help you through this. It is also very valuable to be able to turn your suffering into the basis of helping others in the same position. A lot of healing can come from that mutual supporting and nurturing. You IC can help you find one or at least point you in the right direction to look.

A divorce support group can be a mixed bag and is not really a substitute, as you want women-only at this point (yes there are supportive men, but you won't be able to open up if there is a man in the group the way you can if there isn't, no matter how supportive he is - and there is the whole unhealthy attraction/relationships in that setting that you want to avoid at this point - a nurturing, caring man right now would be too tempting right now & you aren't ready). You also may find both men & women in those groups who don't understand why you didn't leave, which you don't need right now. And, it just won't have the same potential for mutual nurture and support and healing that an abuse survivor group has.

Unfortunately, you're going to have more dreams like this for a while, but they will become fewer and far between, and have less power over you. There still may be a doozy that grabs you even after long time. This is normal too. Just get in the habit after one of having a ritual or routine that gives you some extra care. It is a good sign that you reached out here to share, as that shows you have some good natural instincts to care for yourself. Just come up with something that allows you to take care of the pain when it comes up. Something that allows you to give comfort to yourself and that hurt part of yourself.

I'm also going to recommend two books for you. They aren't on abuse, I'll leave that to your IC. The first is Kristen Neff's book Self-Compassion. She is the leading researcher on how building self-compassion is a healthier thing to build compared to trying to build self-esteem. Self-esteem will grow out of self-compassion, but self-esteem can lead to us being harder on ourselves. She has solid evidence and explains it in an accessible way, but goes beyond to talk about how actually to go about building self-compassion.

The second book may be for a bit down the road, but it is titled Too Good for Her Own Good, by Bepko & Krestan. It is an excellent discussion based on years of clinical practice with women of how most women are socialized in ways that don't allow them to see how they are making themselves or allowing themselves to be miserable. I'd hold off a little bit until you've had some time to get situated in your healing process (maybe a few months), but it will both help you understand why what happened is not your fault and how to make sure that you are addressing some of the social-cultural causes that lead women into treating themselves unfairly and allowing themselves to live a life that doesn't attend to their needs and happiness.

In the meantime, I hope your pain subsides a bit today and you can find something beautiful and wonderful about life and yourself to enjoy!

[Vanilla]

Zelda

Abuse is tough and especially if you are still addicted. Very difficult to break free.
Every day is a struggle to just get up and go, some days are better than others.this whole thing has aged me, I am tired. I struggle to pay the bills, credit cards, debts, I am really having a rough time. I eat far too much, exercise too little and work too much. I am losing my hair and sleep is better. I had boils and sores. My body is unhappy and my soul is hurt. It is worse than before we S, much worse and I have no idea why.

I will not give in, nor let this awfulness destroy me. These sitches need extra help, everything you can throw at it. It makes no sense alternating between beating yourself up and then wanting to scream with it. But I accept that is how it is.

Know this there is nothing wrong with you, you didn't deserve this, you didn't select it, you were targeted by an abuser.

You got free, that is not the norm, my abuse counsellor told me only the minority of abused women break free of their own accord. Many get hoovered back in again. Already you are beating the odds. I will not go back to that abusive sitch, no matter what. I played my MP3 yesterday, just to remind me.

There are days I can get on and days I just get by. Today was one of those days. No reason just was.

I am sure you understand the dynamic, and truly targets need ICs who understand the abuse dynamic. That made a big difference, plus the Freedom Program. My Gamanon also makes a difference too.

I think a change of IC may assist you and a group which assists targets may also help too. Z this is part of the process, sometimes I feel like an alien in this world, like I no longer fit any more. Invisible. It's just thoughts and it goes again.

The abuse was severe and PTSI doesn't do it justice that defines a single trauma whereas this is continual cycling. Trauma requires deep healing. It will heal. I refuse to be disordered with it.

We say it all the time, detach, detach, detach. It will ease, of course it will, in time, it will take time. Take extraordinary care of your health.

Peace, kindness and love to you

V

[asitis]

Wow V, you really are having a rough (rough doesn't seem to cut it) time.

Parts of the brain get wired in ways that make normal experiences of pleasure, ability to connect & relate to others, and trust difficult. And we know that there is a intimate link to the rest of the body now. So (& I suspect w/ your therapy you know this, but it might help Z & others to bring it up), your experiences are unfortunately not uncommon w/ severe trauma from abuse.

Have you read The Body Keeps Score by van der Kolk? One of the more common treatments for PTSD, especially abuse victims, has been yoga. I know it sounds strange, but its technique of focusing deeply on different parts of the body through movement has been shown to be very helpful in many cases.

Back to Z, I want to underscore both her warning about the draw of returning, the need for all the help you can surround yourself with, & that you are a minority & need to appreciate that you therefore need to not see yourself as bad or responsible but as strong and courageous for this accomplishment in the midst of an abusive situation. In abusive relationships there is a kind of brain washing that goes on. It really does rewire your brain in order to allow the abuse relationship continue. This is one of the big differences between relationships where there is mild and occasional abusive behavior and a really abusive relationship. There are all sorts of behaviors that abusers get really good at deploying to allow them to continue their abuse with their victim. Since you've read V's great abuse thread, you are seeing the range of behaviors that are deployed. They aren't just changing your behavior, they are changing your brain wiring.

Now, before you panic that your are permanently screwed up because of this, the brain is incredibly plastic and can be rewired in healthy ways. Good therapy helps. Meditation & mindfulness training can help (I still think without some of the psychological insights of Buddhism they are missing their full impact, but even the secular versions that have been derived from Buddhism still are good). Yoga and other body movement therapy can help.

Keep strong.

[Vanilla]

Z and asitis

I want my wonderful insightful brave Z to know, that which she is feeling is absolutely typical and on cue. In addition I decided to be absolutely open about this, it isn't helping anyone if this is seen as easy or smooth as if there is one easy magic answer to healing. Others read these posts are lurking sometimes, and to make the journey look easy or smooth would be truly inauthentic and create expectations that can't be met.

It's raw and it's real. The nightmares are tanggible and also part of healing, if I remember them I will describe. Each sitch is different but the abuse trauma is damaging, and the separation from self is fractured and hurtful. Like pendulum effect it varies daily.

It makes us fragile and human with our frailties and strengths. Today was a better day even though the sun shone only briefly.

Today I coped much better, you can expect some days like these but tomorrow is tomorrow.

Thank you for the support, I have ordered the book you mentioned. Z, I am not intending to hijack and I want to share that everything that you feel and think is valid for you. The pain is real and the cut deep, but it's ok, your spirit is helping you grow and learn. Let each day come as it will, just one day at a time.

V

[Bob723]

Dearest Zelda,

Please hang in there. I will devote a prayer to you now.

Bob

[AnotherStander]

I do not believe my husband is MLC, I strongly believehe has borderline mental health issues, on top of pain medication.

This was always a toxic and abusive marriage, but because he was so gentle and deep and caring at times, I excused a lot.

I'm so sorry to hear this! Mental health issues are extremely difficult to deal with in a WAS, the DB'ing techniques are based on a WAS that has left due to very real issues in the M that eventually drove them away and DB'ing teaches the LBS how to change those issues and go through self-improvement to try and attract the WAS back again. But when you're dealing with an abusive mentally ill person it's more about protecting yourself then trying to bring them back. Your H would need a lot of counseling before he could ever hope to have a solid, meaningful relationship again with you or anyone else. But if he's like most abusers he probably shuns counseling, is that the case? Most of the time they think everyone around them is at fault, they have a lot of difficulty accepting responsibility. My dad is an extremely abusive narcissist and at his age now (80) I've just resigned myself to the fact that he'll go to the grave that way. Anyway I wish you the best and hope these forums are helping you through what is no doubt a very difficult time in your life!

[Zelda09]

Hello everyone, thank you for the support.

V, I am thinking with you, the body thrives on stress to do what has to be done. It knows when it can relax, and sometimes these are the times we suddenly become ill with the cold we've been pushing off. I think our situations are like this. The body is finally de-stressing deeply and that stress has been holding you pinned together I believe. Flushing toxins. You'll be ok. My IC gave me a chart of what grief often looks like, at first there is a trauma - sharp down. And then there is the honeymoon period, when we are lifted by our communities, the great big swell of support, up and up we go, the courage, the energy...and then it is a long way down when there is nothing new to say and we must just deal with it. Very slowly the ups start coming, two up, one down, three up, 1/2 down, four up, one down, no rhyme or reason. I believe you're probably very good at letting life flow through you and you will process it as quickly as it is possible I think.

Asitis, are you a psychologist? No sarcasm, but you seem to write from a place of practice. Thank you for your helpful words.

Bob, thanks for the prayer. I am in fact doing a bit better.

Today I made a different kind of list. I noticed that in my journaling I was writing to myself, not as myself. A lot of "you." I decided to write a different kind of list, as "I." As in, "I want to be divorced, because..." So much of my mental energy had been on trying to figure out him, why he didn't want to address his stuff, why I wasn't good enough any more...why I should be at peace, blah blah blah.

But first, I had a revelation.

The struggle in trying to make sense of it all has been in trying to understand if he is systematic or if the abuse came from what I am more and more certain is borderline personality disorder. Here is another piece of the puzzle. A while ago V had written about our 'parts' different parts of us...well, I think what I've realized goes beyond normal?

I mapped out his different voices, the usual one - kindly, gentle, inquiring, loving. Him in his most authentic, relaxed and non-threatened state. Mostly would come out around others, me in the beginning.

The full of bravado phone voice used for waitresses, making positive impressions on people, mostly strangers, like Wolf of Wall St. Full of confidence, round, fake laughter.

The voice that was father knows best which really crawled up my skin, he used it with me when talking down to me, or psychoanalyzing, directing the conversation when he thought he was in control and I was too worn out to care any longer. The manipulator couched in the father voice, it was twisty, lots of intelligent sounding things that really made no sense. Or spoke as though he was the only one with a handle on the truth patiently explaining to a little kid.

The creep voice. This was the voice where I think his darkest sides came out, and was also most honest. That family reunion, when he played videos about bipoloar, and other such disorders and I asked him what he was watching, the creep voice said, "I'm just trying to figure out who I am, baby." This was days after he told me to F other men if I wanted to have kids. He never really called me baby ever, either, that stood out. The creep voice also said, "I'm not trying to divorce you Just Yet," back when he blocked phone calls. The creep voice came out while we were waiting for our first MC appointment, and he remarked upon a student I had who had stabbed people, "Z, what do you expect when people don't get the help they need? These things happen." Or when he came home to piece, the creep voice said, after I expressed something, "You know, I was just thinking about a guillotine I could make myself, my little head laying in a little cloth lined basket, wouldn't that be cute?" The eye contact was intense and it was snarling, nasal-y.

The child's voice - it was the one constantly on about needing people, not having needs met. Gentle and sad and helpless. It would most often say, "I don't know. I can't." It was the self defeating voice. Wounded, it would talk about suicide whenever I brought up my needs. Lots of crying.

I heard them all that day in the cafe, over that period we talked. He shifted constantly. I couldn't keep up.

So back to the journal today, why I want to be divorced.

-If he didn't cheat, it wasn't for lack of trying. I have that proof.

-Violence, mental and emotional abuses, whether reactive/systematic, none of it half way normal or how I want to live out my years

-He doesn't want to be here, why do I want to chase someone like this, especially if he doesn't value me? I don't. I am worth so much more.

-He's not interested in change. Told me several times he wasn't interested in looking at anything or reflecting about us. Fine.

-Obviously we don't have the same values or goals.

-What if he is getting counseling and lives his life happily ever after? All I have to do is think about how he actually spent his time in the sessions I attended. Was childlike, non assertive, avoidant and preferred to talk about Yankees. If pressed, went into the "I...don't...know?" Lot of 'uptalk' to his therapist. Therapist never heard father knows best or the creep. Therapist heard the wondering child, sad and clueless.

-There were good times, but it's not my job to rescue the man that gave me the good times. If that man is still in there, he needs to figure his own life out. If he comes back, he can build the bridge and then we can cross it. But, I have to have enough self respect not to lay out the red carpet for him after what he's done.

-Realistically, I want a divorce because trust is destroyed. I would be on pins and needles for months if not years waiting for the other shoe to drop if he were to come back to me - and in all likelihood, it would drop.


I have made a good effort today to sit with reality and my anger over the lies and deceits. I have not given as much thought to if he really wants to be divorced or if he is hurting or blah blah blah.

[Vanilla]

That is an important insight Z.

I noticed when I wanted to analyse WH, I referred to myself as V. v thought, WH did this to V. Distancing, disbelieving, rationalising, as I analysed my writing I noticed this and I saw myself in the first person.

I learned the first second and third position stance. I have taught myself this and to move between them, at first I had to have two chairs, hard objects to sit on and I sat in them to do this, moving from chair to chair to standing by a wall or behind curtains peeping out.

There is me (position 1/ armchair) then the other (position 2/ dining chair) then position 3 (fly on the wall). I even had position 4 (spider watching fly on the wall).

So I am me in my armchair, if I want to see how the other is reacting I go sit in the dining chair, then if I want an impartial view I go to the fly on the wall by the curtains.

All three positions are important I think. I was detached but in position 3, and I referred to myself as V, position 1 was very painful to occupy. Position 2 almost impossible. The useful thing about this is that from position 1 you are not analysing position 2 or 3. By going to the others position and the observer fly, you are being them. If that makes sense?

Now I do this in my mind, it's more useful than endlessly looping.

Can I give you an example?

Today a member of my staff said that they needed my help but I seemed to help clients but not her. It was a personal matter for her not a business issue.

From my perspective 1, she had not analysed her expenses and the data wasn't there for her form and I had said so. From her perspective 2 she felt I could tell her how to do it and set up her spreadsheet, which was confusing her. From the fly on the wall 3, I could see that it was quickest to apologise (me) for being unavailable to her, validate her frustration, find a client spreadsheet she could cut and paste and save to her directory. Fill out the bits in pencil with her and show her where the other figures came from. Took 15 mins.

I can do the positions now very quickly. Did not take long to learn it.

If you would like to try then practice this on the board, for example there is position 1 say Newbie1 then position 2 Newbie1 WH, and then there is position 3, Wonderful Wonka, Clever Cadet, Smashing Starsky, Sensitive Sandi, etc. then even position 4, MrBond giving Starsky post a thumbs up.

I think that you are sitting in position 1 Z analysing position 2 WH (most of the time this means too much assumptions) rather than knowing position 1 (your own). I am not suggesting you sit in position 2 WH seat for long in an abuse sitch, but position 3 might be handy.

Sorry this sounds a little Farscape, somewhat rainbow tummy projecting! You will think I am a batty English woman when I tell you I have advisers and support positions around the chairs too. Even angels and Devilettes. I see Jims WW PF as standing behind position 2 chair! The mind is running riot sometimes.

V

[Zelda09]

I don't think I have the energy or organization for chairs, V!

I think I've been trying to climb into his chair, and see what he saw, far too long. And then journaling, writing letters to myself as a fly on the wall/higher power version of myself. I haven't been seeing this through my eyes nearly enough.

But yes, as soon as I allowed myself to not just observe feelings but to feel them first person - I've given a lot less thought to what the hell is wrong with him. Doesn't matter, I don't care. The bull is not longer running through my China shop, and that's the important thing.

Thank you for absolutely everything, V.