Thanks again. I am trying to use the steps (definitely working on myself, being cheerful & strong, not being needy or desperate, putting myself first.) but I'm finding it difficult in other areas because I feel that we have been making progress over the last 6 weeks or so. We are having fun together, we are laughing more, we are doing date nights (recommended by our counsellor). I worry that if I start to do things like distance myself or keep conversations short etc. it might be like taking 2 steps back. The one place we are truly struggling is in the bedroom (as previously mentioned). She just can't bring herself to be intimate. I'm still trying to understand which of the 37 steps apply at this point, all of them or only a few?? (LisaB, I know you said to stick to them all & maybe adjust a few....but can you see why I'm struggling with how to go about this?) Again, I can understand not being needy, clingy etc. (I was guilty of that over the past few months) but I don't know if coming across as uninterested is my best approach.
A couple things -
1) don't confuse "niceness" with "progress". Just because she is being nice to you doesn't mean her feelings have changed any. It may just mean that she doesn't want to hurt you further and is kind of "biding time". Not saying that's for sure - but her feelings aren't going to change with only time - you need to actually IMPLEMENT personal growth and change...and that doesn't happen overnight.
2) there's a difference between uninterested and detached. There are a ton of threads out there on it, but read read read them. You can't "NICE" your way back in to this. The rules are not for you to win her back - they are so you can live healthily. Read through them again with a Beginner's mind. Try not to frame them in YOUR specific relationship as you understand the purpose of each one.
Starsky has a truth dart that use to hit me so hard when I showed up on the board as a WW. "All cheaters lie".
As much as you want to believe what she says, you would do well to remember that truth dart. There have been many WW's who would deny the hard evidence staring her in the face.
And my quote would be "How do you know they are lying? Their lips are moving!"
What were some of the issues you had in your M. And I'm not talking about the ones that you thought were her fault, but what were problems that you contributed to?
We had a great marriage, always enjoyed each other, rarely if ever fought. I guess that would be my one big issue. I always caved, gave her what she wanted. Always thought it was better to give what she wanted & avoid conflict. I guess I'm still having that issue, I never want to hurt anyone, would rather be the one that takes the punishment!
That teaches people how to treat you. I too made that mistake, it tells people you are a door mat and have self esteem issues.
This was the death knell for my marriage, over the years, they become more and more emboldened to walk al over you - Affairs, entitlement, criicisms, emotional abuse etc...
I'm trying to figure out which of the 37 rules I should try & which ones I'm ok to steer clear of!?!
Are there particular ones you have questions about, or do you mean overall?
I guess that's where I'm struggling, am I that clueless to the whole situation? What you've said " IMO, the main reason a WW has no sexual desire for her H is b/c she has another guy in her head (if not her bed) Plus what others are saying has me so confused. It seems like I'm an idiot for wanting to believe that she made a mistake & is done with it!?! She even went so far as to write a letter to her family explaining what a horrible mistake she made! Like I said I feel guilty for back tracking on the progress we appear to have made. But, I'm also starting to realize that perhaps by me continuing to do what I've been doing may just lead us back to a spot where she gets comfortable & I stay stuck in that "just friends" area. So to answer your question Sandi2, I guess I'm struggling "overall"
Yesterday I did attempt to distance myself, I didn't chase or dote over her. I let her initiate any hugs, kisses, contact etc. At one point she asked if I was "ok" because I seemed distant. I reply that I was good & I was happy. I went out & she seemed a little more affectionate prior to me leaving & again when I got home, she really wanted to snuggle. This A.M. she gave me a nice long kiss goodbye before work, told me she loved me! So again I struggle because I can see that perhaps the distancing is the reason for her added attempts, but my mind keeps telling me that I don't want to seem uninterested because I fear that will cause her to pull away, stop trying!?!? I just don't know!
Actually seems like distancing is working, not that you are backtracking on progress. If her initiating more affection is a goal, then that seems to be working. She will need to keep it up of course. She also is likely reacting and testing to see if she still has you where she wants you (maybe consciously, maybe not). If you change course and start pursuing, you can pretty much guarantee that she will back off and start distancing again. That is not what you want.
If she truly has changed, time and her actions will tell. As everyone here will keep reminding you, patience, and if it is showing signs of achieving your baby step goals, don't mess with it. If you stick to the distancing and she stops the increased initiation of affection then you know that either it wasn't genuine or the distancing may not have been what was making a difference. You can re-evaluate then. The one thing I have had to learn about distancing--and it has been a hard lesson--moving to more distance and individuation seems like it is a short-run step and that once things improve you go back to closeness. Likely you were too enmeshed and not individuated enough to be healthy in a relationship, and you need to get used to being more of an individual to be good to yourself, be good in a relationship, and to be attractive to your W. That takes time and adjustment. It doesn't mean that closeness and bonding and affection can't come, but it is only from that healthier place that the distancing allows you to build that it can come in a healthy, loving way. Again, a hard lesson to learn, and one that doesn't come with any guarantees for improvement in the R. It will start feeling better, and you will feel better about yourself in the not too distant future sticking to your guns. If not, you can always reverse gears after really giving it a try with no loss (so don't respond to fear that you'll make things worse, a couple weeks won't matter in the long haul of saving your M).
Good luck!
Me: 50 W:43 S6, S3 M: 12 yrs. T: 17 M is bad & Not happy Bomb Mar '14 S 5 Feb '15 D Bomb 13 Apr '15 (but "no hurry") DB Coach May '15 Wants proceed on D Aug '15 Starting 1-on-1 negotiations Sept '15
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Hi Christy, Perhaps a dumb question, but is it a conflict of interest to speak to you or another coach if my wife & I are currently seeing a couples counsellor?
