To start in this (it's getting old) sorry tale

[25yearsmlc]

I don't know how I missed that email, (Sorry) but I don't think it helped him.

My 3 gut reactions and thoughts reading it, were !) "wow he is so angry and self righteous, he takes zero responsibility for needing to work on himself" (So the marriage will NOT be any better or different if I return to it)

AND 2) "he is so NOT detached."

AND 3) you condemn the affair while also giving her permission to keep it going.

It Just didn't strike me as strong, but at least she hasn't filed yet. IF something is working, imo, it wasn't the letter.


I will try to read your thread more thoroughly b/c I missed the letter the first go round but Huddy, the general rule around here is to POST THE LETTER FIRST

so you can get feedback.

The other point I wanted to make is this:

No Walk Away Spouse Returns to a marriage they left.........unless

they believe the marriage can be better/different than before.

Just or not, the reality is that it's the LBSers job to demonstrate that it can be.

I would urge anyone writing a letter to ask themselves IF/HOW it helps show this.

[NDY]

HI folks

Thanks for the feedback. I'm at work right now but will post in more detail later.

[NDY]

Not lecturing you. She was probably happy about this email and information. It might have actually smoothed the transition back into the house for you. If you had told her then you maybe still hoped to reconcile she'd have been even nastier because the last thing she want is to feel guilty every time she looks at you.

^ the conflicting message again. I was advised this would demonstrate detachment. Thanks for the 4x2.

I've only breezed through your thread. You are way down the road from my experience being able to help you much. I certainly don't think the letter I posted and going dark is going to help you one bit at all. Your choices remain either detach and keep your distance and wait for the affair to die it's natural death (while I can't stand limbo you HAVE seen a little progress...every day she's nicer to you, she's seeing you spend time and develop your relationship with your son and just being around you restores a connection to you) or attack and try to undermine the affair. You said you could bother OM and he'd maybe slither away then consider doing it. Marriages can't recover while there is an active affair so being nice to her isn't going to move up the timeline. OM might be beside himself right now that you've moved back in and she is seemingly dragging her feet on filing for a divorce and moving anything forward towards being with him. It might be the perfect opportunity to strike. It'll make her FURIOUS. No addict likes it when you mess with their crackpipe. Her rage will know no bounds but getting the OM to dump your wife and move on to less complicated women is certainly a strategy for saving your marriage. It matters not HOW it ends...only THAT it ends.

How, but within the law?

Personally, I see you are almost a year into this. Changing your strategy drastically at this point is risky. Maybe not messing with OM but just being nice to her and interfering with the affair by simply being a little more cocksure and confident about yourself (and the fact that you are her true soulmate) could not only be attractive but also drive OM a bit bonkers. He's surely got to be suspicious. He KNOWS all about your wife's ability to lie because he saw her lie to you for so long. Surely she'd lie to him as well about why you've moved back home and what that means to their relationship. If you could do this in an detached manner without expectations it might help but realize (just as you realized when you moved back in) that you are presuming the risk that this won't all work out at all and it'll just add up to wasted time that you could have used getting on with your own life. Most of the men I've helped have been ok with this risk. The satisfaction of knowing they did all they could to save their family was worth it. But you've already spent nearly a year....so maybe set a deadline up front where the finish line FOR YOU is. First day of Autumn (equinox), Guy Fawkes Day, Christmas, the New Year at which time if things having changed that perhaps YOU would consider filing and commencing the divorce process yourself.

This. I like this idea. But yes. I need a deadline. I'll need to think about what that is.

Rarely do affairs last more than 2 years. You're already a year into this. Keep detaching and db'ing. If you are kind to her it's not because you are desperate. It's because you know a secret she doesn't know. That you are better than OM. That her relationship with OM is doomed. That's she's coming back whether she wants to or not because you're the catch and you're God's perfect gift for her.

Although I like this, I'm struggling with it big time.

In the alternative, can you fight for and win primary custody in the UK? Seems you'd be the more fit parent for S9. IF she ends up filing on you....consider seeking primary custody. Seeking the undertaking alone sometimes snaps them to attention a bit. Then again, maybe Bob's your uncle and he can do a thing or two about OM or winning primary custody.

It doesn't work like that here. The law is quite straightforward. it'll be 50/50.

Sorry I don't have more. Can't follow multiple situations here. Just don't have the time. Today was an odd day where I was stuck watching over things with nothing to do but this.

I know, you are spread thin but thank you for your time.

[NDY]

There is one other thing I forgot to add to my reply to GB. My WW has stated from day 1 (and repeats at any opportunity) there there will be or reconciliation. Nada. Won't happen.

Oh, and she doesn't do R talks either.

[Georgia Bulldogs]

Only got a minute here.

The idea of detachment isn't to demonstrate/show your wife that you are detached, it is to actually be/become detached. That message you wrote wasn't authentic. You were lying because you truly DO love her and want to reconcile. You didn't have to tell her that. I'm not saying you HAD to tell her your true intent and feelings. I'm not suggesting full transparency either. Unlike Defacto's wife (as far as we can tell), your wife is in full on active affair mode. SHE is detached from you.

There is one other thing I forgot to add to my reply to GB. My WW has stated from day 1 (and repeats at any opportunity) there there will be or reconciliation. Nada. Won't happen.

Oh, and she doesn't do R talks either.

She completely wayward. So this is obvious. My wife had NO want or willingness to reconcile. Gross.

Women (in general) only romantically love one man at a time and it's not you. The mere idea of reconciliation is disgusting/repulsive to her.

Once her affair ends....then she may or may not figure out what a idiot she's been/being.

It funny 25 years talks about a WAW only comes back to the marriage if it's going to be better as if:

1. The betrayed spouse wants something less than better
2. The wayward spouses's feelings are more important than protecting yourself emotionally from their abuse

A wayward spouse doesn't come back to a marriage ONLY if it's got the prospects of being better. I think a more accurate statement might be "She (talking wayward wives) typically comes back to the marriage when her affair ends and THEN you can try to make it better and BOTH spouse's should only bother if it sounds like things will be better in the recovering/recovering marriage".


Again...I don't think you should use anything like that letter I posted to Defacto. You are living together. The notion of an intermediary is pointless. She won't care in the least if you don't speak to her or FEEL emotionally abused by her. She is way to far into her affair right now.

[Huddy]

That must be on page 1 of the script!

[NDY]

That must be on page 1 of the script!

Yea, but. Looking at GB and 25's posts it looks like I've set myself back quite a bit. So I really need to think about what to do next.

This bit

interfering with the affair by simply being a little more cocksure and confident about yourself (and the fact that you are her true soulmate) could not only be attractive but also drive OM a bit bonkers.

This is the bit that (albeit tentatively) works. This is where my conflict came in. Just about everywhere you see posts on going dark always say don't be overly friendly, don't start conversations and if they do start don't go overboard with info. And that's the bit that didn't sit well with me because that's the exact opposite of my personality. It makes me come across as huffy.

On the two (yes, only two) occasions when I've slipped back into the old LDT (yes, I know self improvement blah blah) she responded well.

This is the thing I was getting at on Defacto's thread. The LDT that she left isn't me. I was the one that had changed and not for the better. Go back a little further and she wasn't unhappy with me, make sense?

[NDY]

Only got a minute here.

The idea of detachment isn't to demonstrate/show your wife that you are detached, it is to actually be/become detached. That message you wrote wasn't authentic. You were lying because you truly DO love her and want to reconcile. You didn't have to tell her that. I'm not saying you HAD to tell her your true intent and feelings. I'm not suggesting full transparency either. Unlike Defacto's wife (as far as we can tell), your wife is in full on active affair mode. SHE is detached from you.

There is one other thing I forgot to add to my reply to GB. My WW has stated from day 1 (and repeats at any opportunity) there there will be or reconciliation. Nada. Won't happen.

Oh, and she doesn't do R talks either.

She completely wayward. So this is obvious. My wife had NO want or willingness to reconcile. Gross.

Women (in general) only romantically love one man at a time and it's not you. The mere idea of reconciliation is disgusting/repulsive to her.

Once her affair ends....then she may or may not figure out what a idiot she's been/being.

It funny 25 years talks about a WAW only comes back to the marriage if it's going to be better as if:

1. The betrayed spouse wants something less than better
2. The wayward spouses's feelings are more important than protecting yourself emotionally from their abuse

A wayward spouse doesn't come back to a marriage ONLY if it's got the prospects of being better. I think a more accurate statement might be "She (talking wayward wives) typically comes back to the marriage when her affair ends and THEN you can try to make it better and BOTH spouse's should only bother if it sounds like things will be better in the recovering/recovering marriage".


Again...I don't think you should use anything like that letter I posted to Defacto. You are living together. The notion of an intermediary is pointless. She won't care in the least if you don't speak to her or FEEL emotionally abused by her. She is way to far into her affair right now.

Ouch.

Although I know this already it's difficult to read.

[Huddy]

That's a kicker. Not good in print.

[NDY]

That's a kicker. Not good in print.

No, It's not nice to read is it?

So what to do? I don't know. They say detach, not act as if you are detached. But how to detach? Reading the detached thread isn't much help.