I'm also realizing that her trauma is tied in directly to why she feels such a strong hate toward me currently. Just as the person who had abused her as a child betrayed her trust. I, through my depression and distance and through the brief EA I had (after 2 plus years of no sex: see above for explanation on that)also betrayed her trust.
For someone who struggles tremendously with issues of trust, be it emotionally or physically, it is going to be a major uphill battle for me to get her to trust me again.
She puts up walls to protect herself under the very best of circumstances. Always has. Well these are the worst of circumstances.
Again, I'm not blameshifting. But, I thought it might be time to disclose that information about my W because I do believe it to be pertinent to not only how we got to this point but also to how to I successfully DB.
BEC, I was just reading through some of your posts. I can see myself a few months ago in some of your posts. One thing I did notice is you seem to put alot of blame on yourself. I think it is good to look at our roll in the problems in our marriage and work to fix ourselves. That is alot of what DB is about. But you suffering from depression is not your fault. It is a disease. That has nothing to do with her trust of you. It seems you are taking all the blame.
I did not find the whole story about who "HE" is. But if you 2 are separated and she is having another M over, that would make me start to rethink my approach on DBing. Read through Sandi' s thread on the difference between a WW and a WAW. Just my 2 cents! Hang tough!
Me:44 EXW 44 Wonderful Children M11, T14 BD 6/14 OM Confirmed Divorce Final 2/25/16 "It works if you work it!"
She's not wayward. Trust me. If you read about her history of sexual abuse and her issues with intimacy and sex: she means it when she says she doesn't want to be with anyone.
And you're right: I know I'm not 100% to blame. I was a great husband (not perfect) for almost 9 years.
I put up with more BS from my W than you could possibly imagine. She has never fully faced or dealt with her childhood trauma. I tried like hell in the early years of our marriage to address this with her many many times. Tried to get her help: therapy. Counseling. Nothing stuck.
Ive educated myself a lot through the years about the topic because I love her and wanted to help. The coping mechanisms that childhood sex abuse victims develop become very detrimental for adult relationships.
Trust issues, didassociative disorders, disinterest, avoidance and even fear of sex. Some symptoms even mimic those of a narcissist: controlling, cold, verbally abusive, emotionally abusive, manipulative. It also can mimic like living with a manic depressive: a few weeks of the sweet person who is the real person followed by extended periods of time of a cold and controlling individual who is just flat out mean.
I was put through the ringer for a long time. There are many people close to the situation who have said "she beat the s&$t out of you for years and you snapped. And now she is holding that against you".
I'm not justifying my behaviors but depression is a disease as is my panic disorder. Not once during that time did she ever reach out to me in a living and compassionate way. Never attended any sessions with me. Never contacted my nurse practitioner to see how I was progressing. Never educated herself on what I was experiencing.
I once gave her the analogy of "if I had cancer would you have deemed me an unavailable father and husband?" She said "I see the analogy you are making but it is a stretch".
Additionally, the EA that I had, which literally lasted a week and I met with her twice, happened after my w had not had sex with me for 2.5 years. 2.5 years!!!!! And believe me, it wasn't from a lack of me expressing interest or showing affection.
When she found out about it, not once did she say that her behaviors may have contributed to it. My actions are my own and I'm accountable for them. What I did was wrong. But I will tell you this. If it hadn't been for the fact that my wife was witholding sexual intimacy from me for a period of time that was extremely excessive I never never never in a million years would have done what I did. And I didn't even "do the deed". I stopped it before it went to far.
She made me tell my parents what I did. And do you know what they said? "Is she really surprised? She hasn't slept with you in over 2 years."
And the last 6 months. Her treatment of me is despicable.
I am venting right now. None of this means I am not aware of my part. I am fully accountable and am working on correcting it. But she has zero accountability.
I can count on one hand, in 15 years, the number of times my wife has said "I'm sorry" to me. For anything.
Again, I'm not blame shifting: but what I am writing here is the truth.
But I have no idea how to handle this. I left her completely alone the first four months of the sep. Maybe talked about us once a month. Than she turned that around on me and used it as an example of me not being there. Now I'm trying to be proactive and suddenly she's done. It's over. I'm smothering her. Etc....
I can't win. No matter what I've done. Our entire marriage. I can't win.
She has no concept of compromise. No concept of making sacrifices to meet the needs of your partner. And this current situation is no different.
I honestly do not know what to do because I'm telling you guys. I love her. But she has some serious serious issues and always has.
Part of me right now want to just say F it. Pack up my stuff and go home. Tell her the truth. The full truth. Not just about me. But about her as well. And then just tell her do whatever you want. I'm done trying.
As someone who survived childhood sexual abuse and sexual assault later as an adult, I would urge you to stop defining your wife by what happened to her. She is so much more than what happened to her. Yes, she has baggage. Yes it's been an issue within your marriage. But she is not, and should not be defined by that. Have you ever thought that maybe her actions as an adult stem from more than her childhood abuse? I imagine not, because you're too busy defining her. For her.
Prime example: myself. I'm a hardass, emotionally unavailable, cold, sarcastic, demanding, controlling, etc. a lot of the things you describe in your life. And I can tell you for a fact that being sexually abused didn't make me into the person I am today. It contributed to it, yes, but it does not define me. Sometimes I'm a bitch because, well, I'm a bitch. Try to separate your wife from her past.
And honestly? I know you're venting and you're angry etc etc. But you, yourself are making yourself as much as a victim as you are your wife. Blaming your wife for your EA because you hadn't been intimate with her for 2.5 years - and your upset because she didn't see your blaming of her? What did you want her to do? Fall all over herself and say, "H, I'm a childhood victim of sexual assault and my coping mechanisms have been detrimental to our marriage and why should I be surprised because I haven't had sex with you in 2.5 years?"
Yeah no.
Here's the thing. I could be your wife. I have been your wife. There have been dry spells in my marriage and throughout our relatiosnhip for various different reasons. I would probably have the same reaction your W did if my H had an EA. because in my mind, we may not be having sex, but that doesn't mean to go out and get your needs met emotionally and physically.
I'm going to cut it to you straight. You need to work on yourself and your resentment and your habit of defining your wife by her past and your anger. Because until you get to a place where you can stop being blindingly angry about your W's lack of support for you, and other issues, this thing is going to blow up. More than it already has. You honestly don't have anything encouraging or nice to say about your wife. So my honest question is this: if you feel so poorly about her and believe she won't change (know you haven't said that - but that's how it's reading), is that enough for you? Or will you have to move on?
Your W can only fix herself. And maybe she will, and maybe she won't. You are the same way. I would encourage you to google the term wound mates - I see some of that dynamic in your relationship.
The last thing I will say is this: people are going to disappoint you. People are going to do things differently than you think they should. I understand the frustration, believe me I do. I went through it with my H and his parents. H went through it with me. I go through it with other people in my life. But I would encourage you to remember that just because someone doesn't react the way that YOU think they should, doesn't mean they aren't doing the best they can. Or what they feel is right for the situation. There is no right or wrong viewpoint when it comes to life.
I'm sorry tonight has been tough. I hope you find peace in the upcoming days and can figure out the path forward.
M:32,H 32 T:10, M5 BD/H Move Out: 9/2014 - extreme anger H Mental Illness Diagnosis: 4/15 Served D Papers: 10/15 Divorced: 11/15
Here is the thing. It does not matter what the label is, she is in crisis, and she needs to fix herself, you did not cause her childhood wounds and YOU can not FIX them.
Yes you were not perfect. You are not to blame for causing HER crisis.
So pick yourself up dust yourself off and be the best you can be.
Be a great DAD.
Your children are half you, and your wife, two broken people, lead them forward and show them how to have a great life!
As someone who survived childhood sexual abuse and sexual assault later as an adult, I would urge you to stop defining your wife by what happened to her. She is so much more than what happened to her. Yes, she has baggage. Yes it's been an issue within your marriage. But she is not, and should not be defined by that. Have you ever thought that maybe her actions as an adult stem from more than her childhood abuse? I imagine not, because you're too busy defining her. For her.
Prime example: myself. I'm a hardass, emotionally unavailable, cold, sarcastic, demanding, controlling, etc. a lot of the things you describe in your life. And I can tell you for a fact that being sexually abused didn't make me into the person I am today. It contributed to it, yes, but it does not define me. Sometimes I'm a bitch because, well, I'm a bitch. Try to separate your wife from her past.
And honestly? I know you're venting and you're angry etc etc. But you, yourself are making yourself as much as a victim as you are your wife. Blaming your wife for your EA because you hadn't been intimate with her for 2.5 years - and your upset because she didn't see your blaming of her? What did you want her to do? Fall all over herself and say, "H, I'm a childhood victim of sexual assault and my coping mechanisms have been detrimental to our marriage and why should I be surprised because I haven't had sex with you in 2.5 years?"
Yeah no.
Here's the thing. I could be your wife. I have been your wife. There have been dry spells in my marriage and throughout our relatiosnhip for various different reasons. I would probably have the same reaction your W did if my H had an EA. because in my mind, we may not be having sex, but that doesn't mean to go out and get your needs met emotionally and physically.
I'm going to cut it to you straight. You need to work on yourself and your resentment and your habit of defining your wife by her past and your anger. Because until you get to a place where you can stop being blindingly angry about your W's lack of support for you, and other issues, this thing is going to blow up. More than it already has. You honestly don't have anything encouraging or nice to say about your wife. So my honest question is this: if you feel so poorly about her and believe she won't change (know you haven't said that - but that's how it's reading), is that enough for you? Or will you have to move on?
Your W can only fix herself. And maybe she will, and maybe she won't. You are the same way. I would encourage you to google the term wound mates - I see some of that dynamic in your relationship.
The last thing I will say is this: people are going to disappoint you. People are going to do things differently than you think they should. I understand the frustration, believe me I do. I went through it with my H and his parents. H went through it with me. I go through it with other people in my life. But I would encourage you to remember that just because someone doesn't react the way that YOU think they should, doesn't mean they aren't doing the best they can. Or what they feel is right for the situation. There is no right or wrong viewpoint when it comes to life.
I'm sorry tonight has been tough. I hope you find peace in the upcoming days and can figure out the path forward.
Calibri. You are right. I do have a lot of resentment still at how I was treated by her. Please believe me when I say that I do not blame my wife for my EA. I made that choice and that is on me.
I am trying to grow and to move past my anger. But it's frustrating that she is blaming me fully for us being where we are. If I am working toward not defining her, I wish she could do the same toward me.
Because doesn't the reverse hold true? Should she be defining me by my depression? Or by a single mistake I made (EA)?
The only reason I vented last night was because someone had pointed out to me that I shouldn't be blaming myself 100% for this. So I felt that in response, I should disclose the history of my wife's role in all of this.
You're probably correct that not all of her actions throughout the years stem from her trauma. But some of them certainly do.
But the truth is that she didn't treat me very well for a long time before I sort of fell apart. Should she not be accountable for her role just as I am struggling to focus on and be accountable for mine?
I guess my comments on this would be that you seem to be holding on to (and trying to control?) the outcome of her also being accountable for part of what happened.
But, how and if she comes to own her part in this is not something you can control. The only bits you can look at are your own. And I think it is important to be clear and honest with yourself about what you do and don't own. There may be things you don't own and that is fine. But that does not mean that she will own them.
It's coming back to the fact that the only person you can control and work on is yourself. She will do what she will and in her own time and way.
By holding on to the fact that she 'should' own certain things, you may be holding yourself back from helpful introspection and progress.
T 13 M 7 Me 48 H 46 SS 15 BD 7.14 PA D final 5.16 (H filed)
We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
But the truth is that she didn't treat me very well for a long time before I sort of fell apart. Should she not be accountable for her role just as I am struggling to focus on and be accountable for mine?
Yes - If you two are to ever have a NEW marriage/relationship.
What TOOTS said above is also true, right now it is not in your CONTROL.
You have been fired as a husband, she can not fire you as her children's father. You can not let her do that!
It is quite attractive and a boundary!
You working on your half is showing her the way forward. She may follow you or she may not.
