hold on! - 9

[Vanilla]

Jb

You would be very welcome. 12 steps really help too. We can sit in the sun with a cup of tea and some English biscuits.

V

[JellyB]

Oooooo which buscuits V? I lived in the UK from Dec 2004 to Dec 2006. I lived in a little town called Grays in Essex, heading out to South End on the overland train. I would love a trip back to the UK. Maybe I could bring some Kiwi goodies with me!!

You are in my thoughts V, I saw your post this morning about H You have all our love, mine included!!! XXX

[JellyB]

It's Sunday evening here in NZ U. Another weekend over! Hope yours turned out to be goodie!! JB XXX

[Vanilla]

Jb

You have a choice, Nice Buscuits, custard creams, fig rolls and ginger biscuits.

I could even do Eccles cakes or Bath buns. Served with malt loaf and blue cheeeese.

A big pot of breakfast tea served with milk and extra water.

We can sip dandelion and burdock together with homemade ginger beer and scrumpy.

The UK is great for visitors, I know of Grays as I have a client near there. In Maldon.

I am seeing this latest episode with H as like a slow train coming and I am on it. All weekend H plays golf whilst we move offices? Then criticises and goes off in the evening misbehaving too?

I do not mind hard work Jb, but this is horrible behaviour.


V

[JellyB]

Oh Lovely Lady V I do love a fig roll and a ginger biscuit. I am an English Breakfast Tea girl too. Ooooo Scumpy I haven't had that in years Mmmmm. All sounds ideal, and your lovely company to boot. Maybe I could do some mini pavlova's with cream or a lammington, kiwi favs here in NZ.

Yes V, H has behaved quite poorly. V you are testament to hard work.

As my mother said when the day came between my mother and my father that their marriage came to an end, she said this "finale was played by god and was out of my hands". She always said in the end she did very little to bring the marriage to an end, she felt that god played his hand, there was no force on her behalf, that in fact she did nothing, the end unfolded without her assistance. Maybe this is the case for you and H.

I have been thinking about you cleaning. It is strangely symbolic to me that on a weekend where you have cleaned and are moving for new beginnings for your business, endings have occurred with your H. It's almost like the cleaning need to be done. The higher power at work.

Have your peace V. We are all sending you the most loving of thoughts.

Love to you V

[u-turn]

Woah - I missed the party here.

I have no idea what some of these things are that you are talking about - but I am willing to try. I am more doughnuts and black coffee. But hey those other things sound pretty fancy and fun to try. (thought I saw the word beer up there too)

Jelly-thank you for the support. Almost through the weekend with plenty of doing, and also sour thoughts that I am trying to avoid.

I have actually trusted too easily in my life, not always the best judge of character, have been taken advantage of more than once in business. W was always the person I looked to to when making a decision of working with questionable people. Maybe that is my problem all along.

V-thank you so much for your opinion about needs - this makes complete sense to me, you are full of wisdom - you make it seem so easy!!!

New update on it's way - not really a quiet weekend

[Vanilla]

U turn you can join our summer tea fest, taking until late evening

I will also do an English delicacy suitable for your tastes, Cucumber and pink pepper sandwiches with Devon butter and crusty bread. Cut into V shaped pieces and served with ham off the bone with homemade English mustard and fresh onion pickles.

That OK? If you like beer then a real malt ale, served room temperature and flat.

Am going to trip over to your thread to catch up.

v

[Vanilla]

So catching up.

Thought I would talk about forgiveness. I think as long as we can forgive ourselves and our higher power forgives us, then as the prayers say we can forgive those who need forgiveness as they have harmed us.

The Lords prayer uses the word 'trespass' and I think that is in true Al Turtle fashion a breach of our boundaries. So when our boundaries are breached, we recognise anger and that is a key to enforce but that those who try to breach need to be forgiven. We can forgive but not forget.

V

[JellyB]

Sorry U-Turn, I kinda hijacked your thread with talk of tea and goodies and the good 12 Steps !

I'm looking forward to your update, I am thinking that there must be away out of the impass that you seem to be in with wife. I find that in those moments it is a good idea to go back to basics, revisted DR books maybe. I am no expert here. I am in Nomanland's of NC and with ex moving onto love, rainbows and good times. (Gosh does sound at all like resentment? LOL).

Lifting you PMA is likely to help, but I don't you know well enough to make suggestions that might work. What has worked in the past? I am calling on things that I know worked in my 20's. Now that's a long way back.

This is probably going to sound completely crass but I wondering how you get your, in Justin Timberlake terms "Get your sexy back"?

As for trust, this will be the slow road for the short term. All yardsticks are broken for the time being. I do however encourage you to come here and we will hold you through what we can. That's my committment to you anyway!

XXJB

[u-turn]

V-I am further astounded that the things you talk about is actually food just kidding - I really love trying new food (almost always pick something on the menu that I have never had - or cannot make myself). Still would be ok with the warm flat ale. I've done quite well (by circumstance) developing my cooking skills (perhaps I can treat you to my now "acclaimed" smoked ribs, chicken shish kabobs, and sweet potato feast - will be served with Chianti and dark ale (root beer for the kids) - It's not a meal for the meek.

I have done very well with forgiveness in my life - and I do believe without talking about it with W, I have forgiven for this. I will not carry a grudge (but don't know how I will forget). A wish of mine has been W, I forgive you for what you have done, but stop hurting me. (it seems that this forgiveness has given her reason to continue).

Jelly, no apology needed - I enjoyed the talk (I love to learn) and don't know if I have ever witnessed a conversation about tea before.

I don't know exactly how this is going to end this weekend, but W & I have had some conversations (she has walked out of every one). Basically she has acknowledged that it is "over" between us and we need to figure out how to move forward. She has offered nothing new.

----She is still in favor of waiting 3 years until D15 has graduated HS.

I told her that I couldn't live like this - faking happy family for 3 years - it is not what's best for me or the kids.

----Then, she still is in favor of the "bird nest" idea of S/D. She knows that I am opposed of it.

She asked, what do you think that I will do - run around every night and bring men back? I said that I am not in control of that.

----She says she wants to impact the kids as little as possible. I told her I want to do the best thing for the kids. this will impact the kids regardless.

She said that I am "all or nothing" when it comes to deciding. (maybe I am) and yes, now this is just my decision.

So I told her that if we are separating/divorcing, I do not want to hide. Yes, we will separate everything, assets, insurance, everything - we will co-parent (to me this means 50/50 time split - to her I think this means we will still live together).

She is frustrated that I would choose normal separation/divorce over easing into it - and faking it, and hiding it (and still giving W everything she wants).

I said that is what happens. That is what divorce is.

Two stomp away's later.

She comes back to say that she will look for a place and let me know what it will cost.

I'm sure more is to come tonight. (I'll be back later) -

I am considering giving her a letter that I had written a while ago -

You made the decision to end our marriage in the most brutal way that I can imagine. Not by saying that you are no longer happy and want to end it, not by walking away or even asking me to, but by turning to another person and deceiving me.

I am sorry to say, but you were the person that I trusted the most in this world. I would have given you anything.

Maybe ending our marriage was not your intention, but those are the consequences to your actions. I am not blaming you for all of our marital difficulties as I KNOW that I have had not been a perfect husband.

If I didn't know all about of this and I was blind to it, maybe your decision to want to come back, forget and move on would be easy for me. But since I do know about how you've been all along and the countless lies that you have told me, it is not so easy for me to move forward any more.

I can only see this as more lies because that is what has been consistent.

Your expectations of me to carry on as if we are a happy couple in front of everyone while our turmoil continues in private demeans me and our family (and whether you see it or not this is turmoil). Your expectations of me to carry your secrets, cover for you, and protect your image while I am judged and criticized for not keeping myself together further demeans me.

None of the circumstances have changed. You still are able to engage in an affair in plain sight at work (I know) and you still live in your phone when you are here. How can I re-build my trust in anything? Because you say it is different this time? Because you don't address it - so maybe my feelings will just go away - or don't matter? I have tried to fix this in so many ways over the last year plus with my efforts being ignored.
This is not about forgiveness; We have not talked about that in a long time. This is not something that can be changed by just being nice to each other. I don't want to pretend we are a happy family. I don't want to have just a friendship with you. I am not sure if we will be friends.

If this is to change, we need complete openness and honesty right now. That is the only thing that will allow me to move forward.

You have decided to not re-build trust in any way that I can see or what works for me. I have asked for a way. Since I will not get this, I have my answer.
I will blamed for this destruction - I know.


Probably too judgmental - maybe just venting - but it is how I feel