Does anyone here have any advice on how to approach this FB thing?
If I want to go dark, and have him on FB, what do I do. Feels like I can't stop posting there because I have many contacts there due to my dog breeding and if I go amiss there I think it would spark all kinds of speculations and not be very good.
And I have many friends there who is doing the half marathon with me and we post stuff now in preparation for that.
But it kind of makes this "going dark" business tricky because unless he or I de-friend one another (and I really don't want to do that) he is still gonna see parts of my life..
So, any advice for you more experienced DB?
All my best from a bed in Sweden, where it's very early, but heartbreak doesn't seem to care about what time to fret.. Ok, yes, you're so right.. I am in a very "sorry for myself" mood at the moment. I'll try and snap out of it..
Hugs!
M: 44 H: 43 ILYBNILWY: 7/4-15 Decided to try to reconnect. "This doesn't work, I have no feelings": 20/4-15 Scheduled "talk" :9/5-15 It's over: 9/5
you still feel it's impossible for me to make any kind of option for him to want to try it some more? Or am I just shooting myself in the foot?
Feels like my foot is pretty much all blown anyway, so it doesn't matter at this point..
Do you think it's any possibility what so ever for me to EVER get him back? Or is any hope for that at this moment just self deception? I feel like I want to focus on what love is and for me it's giving, but at the moment I'm into the not getting the chance to even try part so maybe I'm just so out of wack that it's not even funny.
DB is counterintuitive. There is a push/pull dynamic going on. Read the passion trap, or just google it and read the amazon reviews even. Bottom line, there is a debate going on in his heart. He's weighing out both sides of the debate. He's not sure which side to believe. But then you come in and start explaining all of the reasons to stay. All the "pros". So then, for him to feel like he has truly weighed the issue, he has to reply with all of the "cons". The problem is YOU JUST FORCED HIM TO THINK OF ALL OF THE REASONS TO LEAVE.
Crazy, isn't it? But it's true. I am a 15 year sales professional and have trained hundreds of sales people in my day. What I've learned is to NEVER try to "sell" someone on a solution...what I typically do is talk through the pros and cons with them so they can feel both sides were represented. Then if it makes sense they do business. If not they won't. Doesn't sound like a super slick sales guy...until you realize that most people lose a TON of sales by trying to pressure people that would've bought on their own terms. Better to allow the people that need your service to move forward, part as friends with those that don't, and reinvest that energy into finding new prospects that might be a better fit.
OK, I got carried away. But it's the same principal. You can't do anything to sell him.
Will he ever come back? I don't have a crystal ball. What I can tell you is that you can't do anything to make him come back. You can only do things to keep him from coming back.
One thing is that people don't come back to M's unless they believe they can be different. My rule is you can't TELL him anything, you can't even SHOW him. You have to let him discover it on his own. So if you change, he'll have to notice it subtly in his own time. If you try to make sure he sees the changes, he'll think it's an act or manipulation.
Do I think he's got another woman? He very well might. Many men do. But he might not. It does and it doesn't matter. If you find out he has an OW then it does matter because once HE KNOWS that YOU KNOW, you have to quickly adjust your behavior to enforce some boundaries. But as long as it's uncertain, you are free to operate as if he doesn't, and it really doesn't matter much. Here's why-
OW seems like a super betrayal, but honestly leaving is the real betrayal. How soon he rebounds, whether he starts drinking, working out, buying a sports car, hanging out at bars, etc, etc...he'll be spinning, medicating, and making poor choices. I know OW seems very personal, especially when he's talking to her about you and she's "comforting" him about the way you treated him...but really it's no different than if he started drinking too much. It's just a shallow medication, you should feel sorry that the man you love is struggling with that type of temptation, that he was depressed enough to grab at a quick fix over a healthy M.
I wish I could tell you more right now, but this is already too long. For now:
1. Don't worry about OW. Cross that bridge if you come to it. 2. Forget about convincing your H to return. You can't do ANYTHING to change his mind directly with words or short term actions. 3. REREAD THE 37 RULES DAILY ***AND*** BEFORE ANY INTERACTION WITH H. DO NOT BREAK THEM NO MATTER WHAT YOUR FEELINGS TELL YOU. 4. Refocus on yourself. Read DR again. Set some PERSONAL goals (i.e., goals YOU control the outcome of, such as your behavior, how YOU will react to situations differently). Plan some GAL. 5. Have faith. Truly. Faith that it will be ok. 6. Spend some time being appreciative each day for what you have. If you tell God you can't be happy without your H you're basically saying "I don't care that you gave me life, family, beautiful days to enjoy, gifts to share with the world, food to eat, friends that care about me, and many years of adventure ahead...I want my R back with my husband right now and I don't get it none of this is any good and I don't want it and I think you stink". When you look at it it's pretty childish. No, I didn't want to lose my M. But I always felt if I couldn't be appreciative with what God had given me without my M, having my STBX wouldn't change anything anyway because I've established myself as an ungrateful brat that will find a way to be dissatisfied no matter how miraculous my life is.
I can't tell you you'll get him back. I can't tell you you won't suffer. I can't tell you there isn't a lot of pain in the world, and unfathomable losses. But I can tell you that the universe is all good. Take care and find a moment of peace today.
Me:38 XW:38 T:11 years M:8 years Kids: S14, D11, D7 BD/Move out day: 6/17/14, D final Dec 15
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Your H or W is giving you a GIFT. THE GIFT OF TIME. USE it wisely.
Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
Hey you, I don't know if you know but I guess that even though the best intentions it seems that I have not had the best success and he has now asked for us to meet and "talk" tomorrow. We still haven't said "it's over" but he has says he has no feelings for me and that he doesn't miss me when we have had less contact now these last few weeks.
What I would like to ask you is this, and all because my new DB book that I ordered like a lifetime ago hasn't arrived yet, I guess due to national holidays in Sweden, and I so need anything to cling to at the moment.. The "don't believe half of what he says" thing.. Why is that? He seems pretty darn sure that he doesn't want this and how can I not believe it then?
The gift of time.. Guess I didn't use it as wisely as I could have even though I tried. And I also guess that all these answers are in the book, that just refuses to show up, but do you mean that when he said that we'd think about it he gave me the gift of time and now when he's wanting to talk (I know he's going to call it quits) the gift of time is gone?
So sorry for what I think might be obvious questions, I just think my mind is such a blur now nothing is obvious to me..
All my best, Cadet, and hugs to you from Sweden!
M: 44 H: 43 ILYBNILWY: 7/4-15 Decided to try to reconnect. "This doesn't work, I have no feelings": 20/4-15 Scheduled "talk" :9/5-15 It's over: 9/5
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Your H or W is giving you a GIFT. THE GIFT OF TIME. USE it wisely.
Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
Hey you, I don't know if you know but I guess that even though the best intentions it seems that I have not had the best success and he has now asked for us to meet and "talk" tomorrow. We still haven't said "it's over" but he has says he has no feelings for me and that he doesn't miss me when we have had less contact now these last few weeks.
What I would like to ask you is this, and all because my new DB book that I ordered like a lifetime ago hasn't arrived yet, I guess due to national holidays in Sweden, and I so need anything to cling to at the moment.. The "don't believe half of what he says" thing.. Why is that? He seems pretty darn sure that he doesn't want this and how can I not believe it then?
Don't believe anything he says!, not half. They lie, how do you know they are lying - their lips are moving.
The rest of the quote is to believe half of their actions.
WHY? - because they are ruled by emotions and not logic. Their emotions just like us, cycle up and down and you get different things out of them depending on where the wind is blowing today, until it changes direction tomorrow.
Zeus, I can't thank you enough for your reply, and I do appreciate the sales comparison, because I think the brain works like you say. I have felt it. The more someone tries to sell me something, the more I start to pull back.
I bought the DR many years ago, and had it up until a few weeks back when I accentually gave it away to a charity book thing I use to donate too. The jacket had come off and I thought it was another book, and gave it away. Go figure just 2-3 days later this happens.. Could the book have been giving me a hard time because I gave it away by accident..
But I have ordered a new one, that ought to have been here a long time ago, but still haven't made it so can't read it at the moment. As soon as it arrives I'll dig in and not stop until I'm finished with it. I need any little thing that can help me with these feelings of desperation I'm feeling now.
I actually don't believe he has got OW, feels like it would be very unlike him and the fact that he himself has been the victim of infidelity makes me think he wouldn't do that to someone else. He has said it a numerous times too. It's just that it feels like I would have understood all of this better, if he had found someone who he was in love with more than me. Now it's just me, who doesn't cut the mustard.
I've been reading your tread and it seems you have come a very long way indeed! So pleased for you! I have started to read many others too but with all the abbreviations it takes me a good long while to get through it.
Tomorrow I will try to just listen to what he has to say, I'm not gonna be the one who says it's over, and I'll try to make him feel like I really listen to him and his needs. But when he says "he's got no more feelings and doesn't know why, stuff like that just happens" what would be your reply? So as not to make it worse..?
All my best!! And again THANK YOU for your time!! It's very much appreciated!!
M: 44 H: 43 ILYBNILWY: 7/4-15 Decided to try to reconnect. "This doesn't work, I have no feelings": 20/4-15 Scheduled "talk" :9/5-15 It's over: 9/5
"he's got no more feelings and doesn't know why, stuff like that just happens"
Funny, we know the answer, it's just so hard. You SO WANT to say "well, I get that you feel that way, but I have another model in which feelings follow the interactions, how we treat each other...and if we aren't happy with our feelings, we can learn a new dance together in which we can find ways for those feelings to come back...and if you don't believe I'll ever be able to dance differently, trust me, I'm ready to try, and it's so worth it..."
But while DB has saved many M's, I guarantee you that the speech above isn't responsible for ANY of them!
Instead, all you can do is validate. He KNOWS you don't feel the same. No words from you about what you think. Just validate.
If you are reading my original thread you'll see I pasted a copy of the letter I wrote my STBX shortly after BD. I hand wrote it, at the advice of my DB coach. It was a "mission statement" if you will. DB coach told me to make sure all my behavior matched that perspective going forward. I think it has for the most part.
But frankly I don't think you're in a spot to express that without getting hooked in. I'd just STFU and listen. Nod. "I can see how difficult that has been. I don't pretend to know how that felt but I do know for you to be here you've felt too awful for too long. I understand you don't believe it can be any different, and why then you'd need to go a different direction".
Honestly if you can STFU you'd be amazed at how little you'll need to say. He's not really looking to hear you talk.
Look- on a 1-10 scale how much do you want to express your feelings? And how excited are you about hearing his? Were the answers, 10, 1? He feels the same. He wants to express his feelings, and not be distracted or guilted by yours. UNDERSTANDING IS A GIFT. Don't try to force him to understand you. Just try for a moment to understand him. So let him do 99% of the talking. Just sit there, nod, and allow him to feel heard. Don't even worry about making sure he knows you don't agree. He knows. Just STFU. Seriously. No talking. If he questions you just be slow, short answers, need to think, "sorting through a lot, just wanted to hear how you're doing and wish you well..."
Me:38 XW:38 T:11 years M:8 years Kids: S14, D11, D7 BD/Move out day: 6/17/14, D final Dec 15
Can't help but to laugh, because you are sooooooo spot on!
But I would say the ratio is more like 10/5 because I do want to hear what his saying, I just wish I heard something else. But I do care how he feels and understand that it must have been/and still is very hard for him.
I'm gonna do my very best to STFU (a thing that doesn't come naturally to me) and listen to him. Validate and just wish him good luck. I'll try not to cry, gonna be hard, but I'm gonna do my best to read as much as I can before, so that I have the rules fresh and hope that it'll give me the strength I need.
I don't think I've seen your letter.. Have to try find it. Was so many pages, I might have missed one.. Sorry about that! Started reading Wonka too, but he had so many pages and treads that I kind of got lost. He seemed like he had lots of experience too and had come a long way.
Thank you so much Zeus, please keep your fingers crossed for me! I keep hoping for a miracle, that I know ain't coming but I can't help but to wish it anyway..
All my best!!
M: 44 H: 43 ILYBNILWY: 7/4-15 Decided to try to reconnect. "This doesn't work, I have no feelings": 20/4-15 Scheduled "talk" :9/5-15 It's over: 9/5
Started reading Wonka too, but he had so many pages and treads that I kind of got lost. He seemed like he had lots of experience too and had come a long way.
OMG, sorry about that! Must have been the early hour here and lack of sleep that made me got that confused.. I thought she wrote of Mrs Wonka someplace so I thought the roll was reversed.. None the less, liked her posts.
M: 44 H: 43 ILYBNILWY: 7/4-15 Decided to try to reconnect. "This doesn't work, I have no feelings": 20/4-15 Scheduled "talk" :9/5-15 It's over: 9/5
Must have been the early hour here and lack of sleep that made me got that confused..