It's a nightmare. Wake me up.

[MrBond]

"I do recognise my part and I take full responsibility. But the A was her decision."

Yes it was.

"I can even understand her "falling in love". But should I just give up and say: "It is all my fault, that you fell in love"?"

No one said you need to give up.

"Is it not enough to blame myself for my part of this mess?"

Stop "blaming" yourself. That's all fine and good for a pity party but what you really need to do is to take action and change. Blaming doesn't do anyone any good.

"Should I also take the responsibility for the A?"

Of course not.

"We talk about 20yrs of living together and most of the yrs were good."

Again, that is a matter of opinion. You think that while your W may think otherwise. Don't mindread her. Just say that's how YOU felt.

"Am I so wrong when I think, that this should be dealt with more respect toward the partner?"

In an ideal world yes. But you need to understand WHY she's reading books like the ones she is. She's working through sheer emotion. That has no basis in logic.

"I am convinced, that the A is her main reason for breaking up."

I thought you said you read the books? The A was a result of all the built up resentment and issues from before. The A was just her lifeline to move on without risk.

"It was the wrong man at the wrong moment, meeting her needs for affection and romance."

Again, that's YOUR opinion which really doesn't matter right now. All that matter's is HER reasons for doing what she's doing. Do they make logical sense? Maybe not. But nonetheless that's what SHE believes. You can either continue to deny it and not get to know this new person or get a D and start over with someone else.

[koalada]

Mr. Bond, I have no idea what you want from me. Would you mind to be less straight with your approach? I am in a situation where I need someone who picks me up where I am and not where I should be. I am reading those books, but that does not mean that I can apply everything over night. Especially if different books offer different advice. I am a novice in this and do my best. I am not a professional, dealing with stuff like this for a long time. When I read your posts, I am afraid of asking any questions.
I really want to understand what is going on in her and do my part to save this marriage. That's why I am here. I am reading everyday the threads of others, read books and really want to understand.

[MrBond]

"Mr. Bond, I have no idea what you want from me."

There's nothing I "want" from you. I'm just going over points about your situation that you seem to be missing.

"Would you mind to be less straight with your approach? I am in a situation where I need someone who picks me up where I am and not where I should be."

You'll find lots of friends and family that will help sympathize with your situation. While they're intentions are great and will make you feel better, it won't help your situation. That's what we're here for.

We ALL sympathize with you. We've ALL been in your shoes. And I understand the pain and frustration you're going through. I went through it for almost 5 years. So I get it. And it comes down to this. Do you want sympathy or solutions?

"I am reading those books, but that does not mean that I can apply everything over night. Especially if different books offer different advice."

And that's where I was trying to clarify things. You're confusing yourself with all the different plans and tactics from different sources. Stick with DB and create a plan from that. Right now you're just confusing yourself and it's making you paranoid. We've all been there.

"I am a novice in this and do my best. I am not a professional, dealing with stuff like this for a long time. When I read your posts, I am afraid of asking any questions."

That's all on you. There's no right or wrong answer. But you have to get rid of this fear you have of doing the "right" thing. You're afraid of pushing your W away. That's what you have to get over to come up on top.

"I really want to understand what is going on in her and do my part to save this marriage."

See that's what you don't get. You can't change her. You can only change yourself. And with those changes, only change what you WANT to change and what you NEED to change. Don't change based on her whims. You'll find out that once you think you've "changed" what she criticized about you, she'll turn it around and criticize you for something else. You'll be running around in circles based on what she says.

Learn to listen to the important nuggets she says and change those issues.

"That's why I am here. I am reading everyday the threads of others, read books and really want to understand."

Every situation is different. You can see patterns in people's threads, but don't think they're all universal and can be applied to yours.

[koalada]

You'll find out that once you think you've "changed" what she criticized about you, she'll turn it around and criticize you for something else. You'll be running around in circles based on what she says.

Learn to listen to the important nuggets she says and change those issues.

Dear Mr Bond. English is not my mother tongue. So I guess I am sometimes lost in translation. Especially when I am tired. Sorry for being rude.

How can I distinguish between the nuggets and the fake gold? Without getting paranoid about every word she says and every move she makes? Isn't there the danger of reading something into it that isn't there? I mean, I am not a mind reader.

I really struggle with this. On one hand, don't change based upon on her whims, on the other hand change based upon the stuff she is really saying. And on the third hand the change is about me and not her.

And you are totally right about me being afraid of pushing her further away. While reading your post I hear : don't try to do it right, do it right. Again, this might be due to translation.

Thanks for your patience. I really appreciate it.

[koalada]

Do you have the game "hitting the pot" in your country? This is exactly how I feel. I am a toddler with a spoon in my hand, waiting for the noise of the pot. I am hitting on plenty of things, waiting for the right noise inside of my mind, so that I can finally say : "alright, now I understand."

[25yearsmlc]

koalada

it's important to CHOOSE AN approach to your situation and really give it a chance

before you mix it with other approaches that are really different. Mixing them up isn't fair to either approach.

So if you want to try this Div Busting approach, give it a real shot. Make sense?

You are trying to understand all her reasons, but you probably won't. I wasted a year trying to get into my husband's head and it was a year I'll never get back.

What you NEED to understand is that I don't know any mothers in long marriages who have affairs AND want to leave their families, who had strong marriages meeting their needs.

HER Marriage to you was not meeting her needs and the fact that it seems as if it was meeting your needs is not relevant. No offense, okay? You need to grasp this concept.

You seem to want to blame her OR yourself and then think that fixes something.

It doesn't fix anything. It's one thing to learn from the past, but it's another to stay stuck in the rear view mirror, looking backwards & pointing fingers.

In my marriage vows, the most useful words were probably "from this day forward."

So I (eventually) chose to stop asking why, and began to work on MYSELF to become a woman only a fool would leave. I stopped looking behind us and began to take it "From this day forward" which meant letting go of h's errors and NOT holding it over his head or throwing it in his face...

can you do that?

There is a lot that went into that^^ change in me,l and I can be more specific later. But does this clarify anything for you?

Work on becoming the best Koalada YOU Can become and turn the marriage over to God (or the universe or whatever your belief system is) for now

and figure out how to counter the negative images your wife has of you - with new improved positives, that are authentic change in you that YOU want to make...regardless of what she does.

That way, no matter what, you will be a better, happier, more loving and more fulfilled man.

Make sense?

[25yearsmlc]

Do you have the game "hitting the pot" in your country? This is exactly how I feel. I am a toddler with a spoon in my hand, waiting for the noise of the pot. I am hitting on plenty of things, waiting for the right noise inside of my mind, so that I can finally say : "alright, now I understand."

What is it you MUST understand? She was not happy enough to stay faithful. There.

Now, what can YOU DO about your situation? Banging on pots won't help and neither will the futile effort to find a "good answer" to your pain.

Work on being a partner that only a fool would leave but no, that does not mean to pursue her.

Did you answer the question of what your wife would say about you and the marriage if she were here? B/c that's a great place to start.

Time to Dig deep. The real journey in life is in inward one.

[25yearsmlc]

I have read your earlier posts and I wonder about the emotional issues you both have had.

Are you still seeing an IC for your depression? How's that going? You also admitted being "very terrible" to her and the family and that you withdrew from them. When she said her needs were not being met, you basically felt unable to meet them so instead of trying, you withdrew more. I mean, that's how I read your post.

You said you have a lot of financial problems. Are you both now, not working?
How do you get by? How do you see any improvement in the situation happening?

are you seeking employment?

And finally, I am glad you went to the birthday for your son b/c no matter what you think will help- your marriage, or "make w" feel or think again,

your kids must come first. They must know both parents love them. This is key.

Many women stay with men who are good fathers, solely BECAUSE they are good fathers so being the best dad you can be now is far superior to you backing off dad duties. Do not withdraw even more from the kids

The more absent you from their lives now, the more she'll see that there won't be much difference with a divorce. Plus, btw, it's lousy & Unfair for the kids to lose you.


Maybe I misunderstood something you wrote but did you say a colleague of yours "helps men who don't want to pay for their children"?

I mean, actually I think you did write that, but what does that mean?

FYI - Most wives surveyed said what they value most in their husband's is:

Security (financial and physical) and fidelity. Sounds as if your wife did not feel secure with you b/c of the emotional issues and intimacy problems.

Feeling that making love is "a chore" is hard to hide from a wife; And it sure does kill her feelings of being beautiful or desired.

Perhaps you can see how you must have appeared unavailable to her emotionally and physically. (Can you see why she felt she was reenacting her childhood?)

Anyway, in HER MIND the OM is not an affair (yet) so I think your anger about that won't really hit her the way it would if she had physically acted on it.

Don't expect to be able to TALK HER OUT of anything with words. Actions speak so much louder.

[25yearsmlc]

PS

read your first post if you are mystified by what was lacking in the marriage. There were several deep needs not being met. She felt unsupported in some important ways, she felt undesired by her h, she felt financially insecure, and unsupported b/c she was the bread winner (but she lost her job or quit? I"m not clear on the source of the financial problems and who does what, although it sounds as if you work part time and help0 with the houses)



It is very easy to blame an affair or an OM, but the fact is, YOU wanted out of the marriage not so long ago - and you hid money in a secret bank account.

Is part of why you are so upset, b/c you feel she pulled the trigger first, (& therefore she "wins")

or b/c you truly want to save THIS marriage?

Sometimes wounded egos are confused with healthy self respect, and there is a fine, shifting line between them...

[koalada]

25yearsmic, MR. Bond, thank you for investing your time and experience. I have to go to work now and tonight S10 will be here for a night. We are going to eat pizza, while watching paddington the bear. I am looking forward to this. So I might not post for a day.

Again, thank you so much. The DB concept really helped me and W warmed up a little. Then I discovered the "tough love" approach and I got confused. Then I read in two different other books, other things and it got worse. Well, the LRT worked and I mixed it up with other approaches.