Hi Pyrite, I can truly understand your frustration. I've felt that way too. But the best thing is to get the anger out in a safe way - running, punch bag chop wood....and so on. Then work towards acceptance of the situation as best you can.
You feel it is so unfair - but of course shaking her, telling her the rules, and that she 'owes' you, or sets a bad example. None of these will work. That's the hard thing. In fact they will drive your W further away.
The place to aim towards is one where you respect and accept the decisions she is making. Of course you don't like them, but she has her reasons, and to her they are good ones. You can't change her mind right now - but you can work on saving yourself, and possibly your M. Focus on what you can control....
T :-)
T 13 M 7 Me 48 H 46 SS 15 BD 7.14 PA D final 5.16 (H filed)
We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
This freakin' cycling is killing me. I have been so angry just now. Unpacking the groceries sparked it. I just want to shake her, "You can't do this XXXX!!!! The rules are that you have to give me a warning first, we have to try and fix the M together!! You DO owe me this much. IS that what you want to teach our daughters commitment is?"
This freakin' cycling is killing me. I have been so angry just now. Unpacking the groceries sparked it. I just want to shake her, "You can't do this XXXX!!!! The rules are that you have to give me a warning first, we have to try and fix the M together!! You DO owe me this much. IS that what you want to teach our daughters commitment is?"
That is guaranteed to fail!
Detach
the sad thing is I agree with both of you.
Me M51 WW F46 T 17 yrs M 16 yrs 9 children D29 D27 D26 S24 S24 S19 S19 niece18 S17 8 grandchildren ILYBINILWY: 12/15/14 I discover PA 12/31/14 She files D: 1/9/15 She moves out 3/2/15 D papers served 3/18/15
I say "owes" only because she repeatedly says she doesn't owe me anything. Further away? I dont how she could get any further away short of remarry. There is not the slightest hint of possible reconciliation on her part.
Accept I can deal with. Hitler though he had good reason too. Does he deserve the same gracious respect? I probably won't be able to change her mind ever, and I am not certain I want to. Focus and refocus. Its hard. OK personally it might be worth it, and I will better be able to assess whether I even want the M. But saving my marriage will always be out of my control.
M: 6 T: 12 Kids: 2,4 BD: Jan 2015 S: Feb 2015 EA/PA confirmed: Feb2015/Mar2015
I wish detaching was that easy Cadet. When I get there though why would I want the M? Why not remain detached, from everything? We are born to suffer, to eliminate suffering .....
M: 6 T: 12 Kids: 2,4 BD: Jan 2015 S: Feb 2015 EA/PA confirmed: Feb2015/Mar2015
I wish detaching was that easy Cadet. When I get there though why would I want the M? Why not remain detached, from everything? We are born to suffer, to eliminate suffering .....
Detach has nothing to do with wanting or not wanting your marriage.
But shaking her and yelling at her will not wake her up nor save your marriage.
agreed. i do want to shake her, but I am not really thinking of doing it.
I have made a commitment to detach. surprisingly I already feel better.
i have left comments about detaching else where on the forum which I should gather. I have some questions which I know people here could definitely help with. can't now though, change over with the girls imminent. have to get things ready, and then will have them for the next week - so might be posting out of sync with US? time, completely
M: 6 T: 12 Kids: 2,4 BD: Jan 2015 S: Feb 2015 EA/PA confirmed: Feb2015/Mar2015
"Other people reminded me that it is unlikely that I was 100% to blame. “What did you do?” I treated her badly. “Why?” “But you didn't used to be such a prick, what happened”. I have discussed this already but can repeat if you wish. I wish I had’ve reacted differently, but that’s where I was at the time."
Other people's opinions don't matter because they aren't in the relationship. Just you and your W. Plus they only hear your side of things and not from your W, so all of the OPINIONS of others are just rubbish.
"I did push my own agenda to some degree, but really no more than anyone does."
Again minimizing your issues and making them seem "natural" rather than taking responsibility.
"Paranoiacally though I wonder if I started the R with her because I could control her (being young and naaive),"
Probably.
"BUT one thing that came out in aftermath of BD was how I pushed her to increase her command of English and awareness of current affairs etc. I witnessed many times in our early years people taking advantage of her naivety and I just wanted her to stand up for herself."
You're her husband not her father.
"She was not stupid, and it wasn't being fair on herself to let people form that opinion. And they did, I know this for a fact. Now look what i’ve done, I’ve created a monster. Thats what i meant by mentor, and actually she used the term, not me."
Which is why it's worse. The fact that through your actions you acted like a teacher and father to her more than a husband.
"She was a pig, she’ll admit that."
She may admit that but how would she appreciate you telling others that she's a pig? I have NEVER called my W a "pig". It's demeaning and AGAIN shows the lack of respect you have of her.
"She was a young 20. I was an old 30. In no way was it a fault. An incompatibility perhaps."
Seriously? An "incompatibility"? You said she was a pig. That's just disrespectful. And the fact that you state it as a "matter of fact" shows that you really don't see how that is a reflection of how you really see her.
"All of those faults were trivial anyway in comparison. The real pain started when she admitted that I wasn’t a high priority for her."
From what you described, it was easy to see why she felt that way.
"Several years ago while I was immersed in my PhD, she wanted to leave me. She went away for a week, I made a big effort, and we were OK again. I felt we were back there, and just recently she admitted we were."
You put in "effort" to get her back without any lasting changes. So when things went back to normal, you reverted back to how you were before and she left again.
"It certainly comes across that way ATM. And there are elements of that in my bad treatment of her in recent times, and now. I have no patience with her."
That's evident.
"After the last three months I would bet my life that you cant hurt my feelings. I wish I could talk to my wife about what she thinks. In aftermath of BD she asked me why I love her. "
It's not the intention of the posters here to "hurt" your feelings. It's to make you look at yourself objectively and to see where you REALLY need to make lifelong changes. Some people don't like what they see in the mirror and end up getting defensive, saying we're wrong, etc. Believe me, there's very little we haven't seen on these boards.
"I asked her the same and among responses was that I had always listened to her and acted on any of her concerns. I admit that I lost that."
Again, that's fairly evident. But you have to get rid of your ego for good and then you won't lose that.
M-43 W-40 2D - 9 and 5
Emotion, yet peace. Ignorance, yet knowledge. Passion, yet serenity. Chaos, yet harmony. Death, yet a new life.
A lot to think about. I already know there is a degree of truth to many of your criticisms. Although you predicted it would be my response (which isn't an indication of inherent truth behind your criticisms) it is a little unrealistic. She may very well be criticising characteristics of my personality. Does this make her wrong or disrespectful? I think it is unrealistic that two people live together and dont comment on the fact that one of them never does any housework. If she were to post the truths "well i never once cleaned the toilet or did the floors etc", would she deserve criticism. I suspect you would end up calling her selfish, or self centered. So is this something she should change as well? I wish, I have and is basically a condition of ever getting back together. There are more examples of her self centred-ness aside from housework. The point was her self centredness towards housework was trival.
No - I am not her father, her father was absent in most respects. Does that mean a partner should not suggest ways the other might improve their chances at job interviews, presentations, etc.
Lack of respect I have for her?? Thats rich. She's f**ing another guy and posting pictures of him and my girls on the web as her family.
yes yes yes i know this is about me. truth is she may be incredibly flawed, but we are still talking about me. if her flaws are that serious, i can just let her keep walking. still my flaws will remain.
HOWEVER, I GET ALL YOUR POINTS ALTRUISTICALLY, and there is truth to them. My ego is a problem. I have been reading Zeus' thread a bit, which has helped me see the origins of some same personality traits, and importantly how they bled into my R.
I will think about this more, although I already could write for a day about most of the things. Although the last few years have been terrible, we did enjoy a great relationship at one stage. At any rate, she was my best friend, and we talked about everyting, including these personal realisations and introspections. It is very tempting to talk to her now. Infant it is my instinct. I can rationalise it as catching her before its too late. But *rationally* I suspect this is probably not a good idea. 1: its already too late 2: she is not receptive to anything I say 3. i am not really better, i just have some more clarity about why i was an arse
M: 6 T: 12 Kids: 2,4 BD: Jan 2015 S: Feb 2015 EA/PA confirmed: Feb2015/Mar2015
I'm glad you're reading my thread. There's much more to it then x happened, then y happened.
I really waffled back and forth between seeing what I was doing wrong, defending it because I didn't feel I had an alternative, and trying to figure out why it was so tough for me. Some of my posts are long, but there are a handful of breakthroughs that when pieced together form the solution to a puzzle. The trap I was in for many years.
Still have a long way to go, but I'm feeling more whole than I did before. I wish you the same.
Me:38 XW:38 T:11 years M:8 years Kids: S14, D11, D7 BD/Move out day: 6/17/14, D final Dec 15
