I know you think that we are ALL stating the same thing. Guess what, my wife never "nagged". My wife never talked about anything through most of our marriage. I tried to talk to her. She wouldn't talk about anything. In all our years together, we had one conversation where she said she wasn't happy. And I sat down and LISTENED. I told her I was sorry. I did not realize I had upset her. I told her I will work on these things. My wife and I both grew up in families that don't talk much about our feelings (unless we have had a few drinks). She was worse than I was. I wanted to talk things out. Ironically the one conversation we had when she was not happy in the relationship was when D graduated. Than we have problems when her other S graduates. I started to wonder if I was being used to help raise her kids!! So our first conversation was 2 years before her S graduated. I did change in those 2 years and she has told me that I did.
Just for future reference, I came to this forum for help with my marriage. And hopefully some others to talk to because it is very hard going through all this alone. I came here for support and I also thought I would get some help from people who have been through this. I came here to learn about myself and to get advice from people that know. Some of us might be a little slower than others. Yes, I ask alot of questions. I want to learn. I want to do the right thing. It does not help when there are replies that make me dumb for bringing up a topic. Or that I was stupid because I never noticed problems in my marriage. Sometimes the replies I get make me not want to post or ask questions. Maybe I am being misunderstood in what I am saying.
Me:44 EXW 44 Wonderful Children M11, T14 BD 6/14 OM Confirmed Divorce Final 2/25/16 "It works if you work it!"
See this is where the Divorce Busting gets confusing!! Wives send their husbands signals that they don't understand. After sending these signals for a long time, the wife finds another man. Than we come here and are told to avoid contact with them. Don't text, call, write or try to talk to them. So now the wife has more ammunition to say " I'm glad I left". Or we help push them out the door by doing all these things. I am suppose to validate my wife's feelings, but I can't because we are not suppose to talk about relationship things. Or I am suppose to DETACH. I wonder if this is really Divorce Busting or Divorce prepping??? I feel like the things I have been doing lately are pushing my wife out the door. I get the feeling she is stock piling money and spring cleaning so she is ready to leave.
Me:44 EXW 44 Wonderful Children M11, T14 BD 6/14 OM Confirmed Divorce Final 2/25/16 "It works if you work it!"
Joe- you're making the faulty assumption that there is a "winning play" you can make that will bring your W back, and quickly at that. So by that rationale anything that doesn't immediately get her to come back to you isn't working.
Bad news. You can't control her. There is nothing on ANY forum that can change her mind. That is up to her.
That's a hard reality. Many people try DBing as a form of control, trying to do anything and everything to try to keep control of their relationship. That doesn't work. It just keeps them from detaching as they interpret every mood of their WAS as a sign of working or not working.
But while there isn't a magic bullet that will guarantee your WAS will return, there are things proven to destroy those chances. Sandi is sharing some of those things in this thread and with the rules condensed from DB/DR. And while these don't guarantee a WAS will return, it will help you grow stronger as a person, lead a better life, and be the best person you can be. Ultimately that's all you can do to set yourself up for a healthy R in the future.
For it to get your WAS back she has to notice, believe those changes, AND be willing to do some work herself. Sadly that is up to her. But that IS the best thing you can do for yourself and your R.
Me:38 XW:38 T:11 years M:8 years Kids: S14, D11, D7 BD/Move out day: 6/17/14, D final Dec 15
Understood Zues. Thank you. I think I just get myself in trouble when I ask questions. I have problems reading things sometimes. I think I should read some posts a couple times before I post. This is why I struggled in school so much. I also get confused real easy.
Me:44 EXW 44 Wonderful Children M11, T14 BD 6/14 OM Confirmed Divorce Final 2/25/16 "It works if you work it!"
Sandi, I was reading through Ben2010's posts and I saw something you posted there.
Quote:
Originally Posted By: sandi2 If it helps, I was very torn and confused. I changed my mind a thousand times a day. Now what may seem odd is that it was not my LBH that talked me into staying in the M. Remember, he could do nothing right, in my eyes. It was, however, total strangers who got my attention and told me the truth of what was happening to me.....and what was needed to get through the mess I was in.
If you don't mind me asking what total strangers? Here from the board?
Miman2, yes, the strangers were those board members who talked really straight to me. Thankfully, I had some wise people coaching me. I will forever be grateful they came to the rescue of a WW.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
I believe what triggered my wife to start acting this way was when her youngest son from her first marriage graduated
Triggered is a good word, b/c I doubt that her son's graduation was the cause of her waywardness. My personal experience would take too long to give much details b/c it had been building for years. However, I will try to briefly give you a picture.
We had had bedroom problems for a long time due to my lack of atgraction for my H.......which was caused by others issues outside the bedroom. I prayed for years that God would help me have sexual desire for my H. I would talk to my H about my needs until I was blue in the face. He never got it. I felt the reason we didn't have enough sex was my fault. Anyway, at some point, I felt my prayers were being answered, or else b/c I was applying more effort. The ironic part was just as I was enjoying sex and looking forward to being intimate with my H (instead of dreading it), he suddenly pulls back. He gets this idea that I am just doing it for him........or something. He would never really tell me. I knew in the past he felt rejected many times, but here I was finally able to be the sexual partner he had always wanted....and he stops cold turkey. So then my pride really kicked in. We stubbornly waited on the other one to initiate. Both egos were beaten down.
In the meantime, we had gone through extremely tough times with our grown D. I can't go into all of it b/c it's too long. She had a serious disease, was divorce and had a child. We were struggling to pay our bills and my H wasn't working like I thought he should. What seem to be my trigger was when our D was in an accident that would takes weeks to recover. She and her teenage son had to stay with us, in a very cramped little house. The stress was working overtime on me, and to escape for a few hours every night. I would go online to play games. You know those games where another person can be your opponent, and on yeah.......you can instant message while you play. At first whenever someone would say anything flirty I would shut it down immediately. Anyway, there was this one man who was really nice and didn't do any of the flirting, etc. He was very funny and I would enjoy spending that time with him b/c he made me laugh and forget my problems for a while.
What I did not realize was that I was developing an emotional attacment to him. He made me feel good. Anyway, long story shorter, it ended abruptly and I found myself searching for someone else that could make me feel better. I won't go into the sorted detailed b/c it is embarrassing. Let's just say that for the first time in my life, I was being the bad girl, and found it exciting. I eventually ended up on a dating site. I had become addicted to the thrill. That is how I met another man and that led to having an Internet A. And that is why I could see what was happening to your W, Joe.
You see, for years I tried to hold down the resentment in my heart. It started right after we were M and my H would not make me priority over his family, especially his mother. He would stand up for me, and that really affected my desire for him.......which led to other problems. I also lost respect for him, and that led to even more issues. Neither of us were getting our needs met from the other one. Remember, I am talking about decades, b/c our children were grown when I finally crossed the line. So many other things were involved, but there's not enough space or time to tell it. You might say I was being "conditioned" to eventually put my emotions into the driver seat and go wherever they led.
It doesn't take years for all women, of course. That is just my story. We read stories on the board how some couples are M just a couple of years, or less, when an A or wayward behavior Is discovered. Every woman is an individual with a different character.
I would dare say that more was going on with your W than just being depressed over her son graduating. Especially when she still has little children at home. Makes no sense, does it? She withdrew from the entire family, not just you. Maybe you never discovered what else was happening, but I'll bet it was much more complicated than you know.
Listen Joe, my H discovered my Internet activity. He first tried the loving approach. I could not even look at him. I cried my eyes out. Not out of remorse, Joe, but from being caught. I was guilty as sin! He gave me a chance, even though I never apologized or agreed I'd never do it again, he just assumed. I continued with my activity, just much more carefully. The next confrontation was not quite so lovingly. My inner rebellion rose up and I thought, "Just watch me!". So, I continued by taking my A deeper "underground". The third confrontation, all sh't hit the fan! Guess what I did? Took it even deeper.
You cannot sit her down and have a loving discussion to work this out. She is rebellious. She will defy you. Have you ever had to deal with rebellious teenagers or young adults? I mean those who are he11 bent on doing what they want to do and you won't stand in their way? That is exactly how the WW is, only worse. MC won't work right now. You have to take a tough stand, let her go, and move on with your life. You aren't doing it. You are allowing her to stay in her room and continue doing the phone sex. You ignoring her and/or what she's doing doesn't work if you gave a boundary about it. You are trying to find excuses to cover yourself, like saying you like having your own bedroom, etc. That is pure BS! You are scared of the tough love it will take for her to realize you mean what you said.
If you want to live under those conditions, so be it. I am not trying to bully you to do something you don't want to do. Just don't set boundaries and then make excuses to cover your lack of action.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Just for future reference, I came to this forum for help with my marriage. And hopefully some others to talk to because it is very hard going through all this alone. I came here for support and I also thought I would get some help from people who have been through this. I came here to learn about myself and to get advice from people that know. Some of us might be a little slower than others. Yes, I ask alot of questions. I want to learn. I want to do the right thing. It does not help when there are replies that make me dumb for bringing up a topic. Or that I was stupid because I never noticed problems in my marriage. Sometimes the replies I get make me not want to post or ask questions. Maybe I am being misunderstood in what I am saying.
No, don't feel this way about it. All of us get frustrated at some point. I may say something too bluntly or even harshly, but I never intentionally direct it to a person's inability to learn. This stuff is hard, and it's sensitive. It hits you in the most tender area. The LBS comes here in shredded pieces, and I don't know how they grasp anything!
Asking questions is good. As long as you are taking the time to search for the answers. Last night I was the one frustrated b/c I thought I had covered the issues you were questioning. Like I said, we all experience it. Don't feel as though anyone is attacking you, Joe. I truly don't believe that is anyone's intentions. Okay?
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
I guess I am confused on what my choices of action are now. What I do effects our kids. This is why I have been doing alot of thinking. She stated, in our argument after I switched me cell phone, "I am not leaving". So my only other choice is for me to leave. Than I look like I abandoned my kids. My actions lately have been to avoid her as much as I can. I spend alot of time in my room at night. I find other activities to keep busy. I have been getting more involved in things around town. If I tell her she has to leave, this will definitely be more of the same for me. The first years we were together, I would tell her that when we got in major arguments. It was wrong of me. But it was my way of controlling the argument. This is why I have been really considering leaving, but it is very frowned upon here. Plus I know it would give her ammunition. She will tell the kids that I left them. I can't stand to be away from my kids. Don't know what to do:(
Me:44 EXW 44 Wonderful Children M11, T14 BD 6/14 OM Confirmed Divorce Final 2/25/16 "It works if you work it!"
Don't leave your kids behind. Can't you take them with you? You said she was pretty much neglecting them, so they need you more than ever.
In the meantime, conduct yourself as though you have separated emotionally from her and this inappropriate job. Otherwise, it will appear as if you condone it. However, I don't think you should be the one isolated in your room. At times, you may need to go there, to regain control over emotions, or whatever. Spend time with the kids after dinner, helpIng with homework or playing with them. You can be their bright spot of the day.
You can separate the bills so that she is responsible for half. Get your name off any crdit cards or accounts she uses. Also, separating your bank accounts, etc. Some men even have to protect their savings and retirement fund, or their kids'' college fund.
What I am saying, Joe, is if you just cannot take the kids and leave at this time, then do everything possible to show her you are enforcing your boundary of not accepting an open M, if that is what you told her.
Protect your little kids as best you can. Her son may start to ask questions, and you should not have to lie to cover what she's doing. But that is my opinion and some will not agree. That is something you have to decide.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
