Card29 IX - New Year, New Card

[Card29]

I don't know what all I've disclosed. She was not simply an angel poisoned by my porn, though. (although, again, i own my role...I did not provide a healing environment for herr but wtf, I wasn't a psychiatrist. I did my best, as best as I knew how. I was a f'ng kid, really).

And I have mentioned this, but not sure who knows. Her dad cheated on her mom when she was about 12, and left the family with OW. They're still married to this day. Who knows what that did to her, but I believe it is the most impactful event in her life.

Let me state again. I LOVE WAW. I'm crying for her right now because I know she is in so much pain. I know she hates herself. I don't want her to hate herself any more. She has for years. She told me recently she liked me so much when we met, and she thought she had to have sex with me to keep me there. Even though I loved her because she was funny, loving, understanding. I didn't even want the sex at first. She didn't think just herself was good enough for me, even though that's why I was there to begin with. It kills me to know she doesn't feel that love for herself, that she doesn't feel worthy. I don't say any of the "high horse" stuff as a high-nosed judge. I really believe she has major problems that I can't fix. What I meant to say earlier is that I COULD get past the A. I don't know if I can get past the doubt that another would come down the road, or a "simple" divorce after more futile years. I want love and a family for life. I don't know if I can have that with her.

[Calibri]

Card,


To echo maybell's question, did you reveal your W's earlier sexual encounters before tonight? I don't recall reading about it, so with this knowledge it does bring a new light into the perspective.

I find it.....interesting....for a lack of better words (and I'm not being a smart aleck here) the beginning of your R from a sexual standpoint to where you both are now.

Also, you wouldn't like it if your wife masterbated to porn? Could you explain why? I'm just trying to understand more.

This is tough stuff. You do have a right to be angry, and I'm glad that you can see this is where you are tonight.

I'm Sorry if my response upset you, my statement was not to throw it back in your face, but to try and urge you to look at both sides.

And I do still urge you to get an STD screening. Your doctor could do one for you if you don't want to go down to the health department.

I offer virtual hugs and chocolate as an apology. Or beer, I might have some around here somewhere.

[Card29]

uRworthy *bat signal* lol

[Wonka]

Card,

The real crux of this discussion is your self-righteous indignation. Therein lies the problem.

We all get that you're reeling from the news of W's XOM revelation and grappling with a whole host of emotions that are churning inside. This is a DB where many posters have WASes with OM/OW and have successfully reconciled. The most important step in this process is setting aside your pride and bruised ego.

Sex and porn are two vastly different things. I sense that you're trying to gloss over the severity of the porn issue in your M by making so-called comparisons to W having pre-marital and being sexually adventurous in the early stages of your relationship. I am not too sure if you really get how your W was affected by your porn addiction. It seems to me that you're being a bit too defensive about the porn issue and being dismissive of the erosive effects of porn on your W.

Now on to the matter of XOM, what your W said to you about making a long-term R with him is the fogged thought process of a spouse in an A. This is precisely why DB hammers the "believe only half of what they say...." philosophy around here because we all know that people who are in A's don't think rationally because they're high on dopamine.

You could well use some time to step back and regain your center. Your W is still the woman you love. Right now, she is in a withdrawal stage which will be filled with fits and starts as she detoxes the XOM from her system. At this crucial stage, it is the "for better or worse" in your M vows. Your patience will be tested to the limits. This is a crucial time for you to shine by showing your W unconditional love.

Can you step up the plate here, Card?

Your choice.

[Card29]

Calibri, it's okay. I know you didn't mean anything bad towards me. I'm just emotional right now. you rock

Also, you wouldn't like it if your wife masterbated to porn? Could you explain why? I'm just trying to understand more.

I don't like it for the same reason I expected she didn't like if...it's just wrong to get sexual satisfaction from someone other than your spouse. Does that make me a hypocrite for the entirety of my M? Yep! I hated porn while simultaneously viewing it on a regular basis. Every night I thought I could just white-knuckle it and stop. I would last a few days usually. I always had a count of how many days I'd made it in a row. But it always eventually started over.

And now I would be even more disturbed, if we were together, to find out about porn because I now know the damage it does to an M. For years I thought it was simply a jealousy problem. In that case, if she doesn't know about it, she can't be jealous. Problem solved! All that was left was to deal with the shame inside (that didn't work out so well). But I forgot about a thing called intimacy

I probably will get an STD screening. My biggest victory today was not throwing that in her face. A couple of times I angrily typed out a text demanding she pay for an STD screening. That would have been really low. I'm glad I didn't send those

Well, my mind is shutting down. I don't have D2 tomorrow, I don't have work, I'm sore from snowboarding...I'm going to go to bed and hopefully sleep in like a teenager on summer break. I appreciate everyone here. High fives

[gan]

uRworthy *bat signal* lol

Glad to see you can still find your sense of humor, Card.

I'm so sorry for this news. I know we all know that it is highly plausible that there is an OM/OW in the picture but I'm sure no amount of preparing for that news can numb the pain of actually hearing it. I'm still bracing for the possibility…

There's been some tense discussion here and so I don't want to add to it. This should be a safe place for people to outline their thinking as it evolves, and we are all responsible for keeping it that way. I think it is safe to say that porn is a trigger for a lot of women, and I suspect you might be getting a bit of that here. Hopefully some of the posts give you some insight into that. Even if you don't se it as tit for tat, it seems some people might. You have spoken openly about your work to deal with the porn addiction and I sooooo commend you for it. It will stand you well in your future relationships, no matter who that is with.

Just take it day by day, Card, minute by minute if you have to. Your thoughts and feelings are bound to be all over the place at the moment.

Hugs.

[Card29]

Wonka, a couple quick responses before I shut down:

- I don't believe I have glossed over my porn problem or the damage it has done. i have admitted repeatedly to what I did and to the damage it did to her. I just got the sense tonight that people were telling me "you did that, get over yourself for her sleeping with someone else". i responded defensively, for better or worse

- I do need to readjust my thoughts with WAW and her fog. Since I thought she was not in an A this whole time, I figured she had come out of it by now and she just was where she was. I forgot to rethink the fog once she revealed the A. It explains so much about the last 6 months

- and yes, I do love WAW. But at this point it is ILYBNILWY. I want the best for her. I'll never harbor hate for her. But I also want the best for me, and I dont know if that's with her. In my view, our vows are broken. Which is why I don't feel obligated to her. Does that mean I cant choose to enter new vows with her? Of course not. But I feel like she's not even my W anymore, and I need to get to a calm, steady place to make an independent decision. There is also the matter of her not wanting to be M to me, which she told me as recently as 1 week ago (yes, fog, I know)

Thanks for your thoughts, Wonka. I always appreciate them

[Card29]

ganb8te, you can say that again about emotions all over. Today, I have nearly texted or said the worst things I ever would have said to WAW, yet Ive also cried for her several times.

[Wonka]

Please know that I am not trying to attack you or making you feel bad, Card. We all are trying to help you see things from a different perspective.

Hope you'll get some sleep.

uR will most certainly hear your bat call soon.

[gan]

Your thoughts and feelings are bound to be all over the place at the moment.

OK - so immediate step is to stand back and process. Do not engage with W until you've cooled off. You want to keep all options open at the moment until you have some clarity.

But you already knew that!