claire #9

[claire7]

25, would love to hear your thoughts on what GoatGal suggested.

Thank you (and you too, GoatGal! ) very much for stopping by. I appreciate the feedback so much.

[25yearsmlc]

25, you are a tough cookie! And that is why I am here. The only other person who has even attempted to push me hard is my IC... and she hasn't come close to the folks on this forum.

Also, why do you believe HE KNOWS you have changed? Not asking IF you changed but how or why you believe HE noticed at all?

I've thought about this a lot, and spent some time last night looking back through old emails. He has said and written an acknowledgement that I've shown bravery and grace. He's said that he respects me more now (specifically seeing how well I'm handling being a single mom) than he did when we were together. (Let's set aside for a moment the implication that he did not have much respect his W who was dealing with major anxiety and depression, including undiagnosed PPD...)

Unlike some other LBS's here, I don't really get any spew. I get acknowledgement and thanks for being flexible, or kudos for being a great mom.



^^ Not really the kind of changes I was hoping he'd notice. Anything more substantive? It's pretty important b/c I can't see a road home if he thinks he'd be coming home to more or less the marriage he left...

He's made comments when he saw that I had done some cooking (a 180 for me), or noticed when I was driving more confidently (there were a couple of times he was a passenger while I was driving recently).

So who did the cooking and driving before? Him?


The last time we spoke about our R, a few months ago, he said he was happy that I seemed to be doing so well, that I should be proud of my progress, but that he 'didn't see a married future for us.'

But, I have to face it. He is OUT. And if he's not out, he's very far from being ready to tell me he's had second thoughts.

As for finances, that is definitely an area I need to work on. I'm embarrassed to admit that.

Claire, I'm sorry for where you are or feel you are.

From where I sit, you did have some big problems inside and that stinks. But it's also really really harder to stay married to a depressed or moody person (even someone with PPD, especially undiagnosed b/c all he sees is tears and pain in someone who he thinks ought to be pretty darn happy.)

Depression to a spouse feels a lot like a failing of their own. "If they loved me enough they would not always be sad"

AND OR "they are sukking out my will to live... it's draining MY PMA and life energy to try and 'make them happy' when clearly the will not Choose to be..."

I think the impact on a spouse of someone who is depressed, is very under rated.

You did not cook or drive much or handle the money. So, as a wife what did you feel your main "duties" were? Did you work full time? Did he?

I mean, do you feel that it was a lot for him to carry? What if he also had to hope you were not miserable and he worried a lot? I mean, not to slam you too hard on this day, but Let's face it, that's a drag.

I say this but want to let you know that I DO relate to you!

After our 2nd child, I got baby blues pretty badly. I have to confess though, that it came on so suddenly that I was cognitively aware it had to be hormones b/c no one gets that sad that fast...but I did! Fortunately for me, it only lasted a few weeks and rather suddenly, it improved.

Not sure what your situation was or how it could be recognized if you have struggled for years with depression anyhow...but it is draining on a marriage.

I had surgery a year ago (nothing life threatening). Long story but it was a major pain in the butt to heal from, and to do Physical therapy for--b/c the problem with the surgery was/is PAIN CONTROL...

So for MONTHS, I could not walk or stand and therefore h or one of my older kids (who does not live at home), had to do a bunch of shopping, cooking and cleaning for me AND driving me. And moving a TV or pillow or getting ice for my leg, ETC ETC ETC

It sukked for them! (And me--turns out, h is a lousy cook once he uses up his 5 meal repertoire.... ).

And though no one complained, (thank God) I could see that I was a drag... especially when I was in a lot of pain. And yeah, it depressed me after a few months.

Hmmm...

You know, you could pull a real 180 and thank him for the support he DID give you for as long as he did and THANK HIM for waking you up to the need for getting help b/c now that you have, YOU are so much happier (and implicitly, more loving)



What do you think? Can you pull it off? It sure would stand out to him as a 180 would'n't it?

[Jefe]

BTW, Chump Lady is not a place I would like to hang. Full of anger and resentment and little acceptance for owning ANY part of the situation.

Goes against my grain on so many levels.

Sorry, carry on....

[Maybell]

BTW, Chump Lady is not a place I would like to hang. Full of anger and resentment and little acceptance for owning ANY part of the situation.

100% agree. It made me want to gnaw off my own arm.

[GoatGal]

Nope, me either.

Chump Lady is good for a laugh, and I think very good if you've decided it's time to move on and you need some fuel for that fire you need to light under your butt.


Not so good for DBing though.

[claire7]

Depression to a spouse feels a lot like a failing of their own. "If they loved me enough they would not always be sad"

AND OR "they are sukking out my will to live... it's draining MY PMA and life energy to try and 'make them happy' when clearly the will not Choose to be..."

I think the impact on a spouse of someone who is depressed, is very under rated.

You did not cook or drive much or handle the money. So, as a wife what did you feel your main "duties" were? Did you work full time? Did he?

I mean, do you feel that it was a lot for him to carry? What if he also had to hope you were not miserable and he worried a lot? I mean, not to slam you too hard on this day, but Let's face it, that's a drag.

Oh man, you really hit the nail on the head. He felt both of these things. He told me he did not feel like I put as much effort into making him happy as he did for me... and that my sadness affected his mood and outlook.

I was not easy to be with. I was stuck, and anxious, and insecure, and jealous and suspicious and resentful and passive aggressive. I was both a control freak AND couldn't actually accomplish tasks. He carried a lot of the weight in our home. I do work full time, though he earns 5x what I do. He did the cooking, and handled the finances.

So, what did I do? I did most of the childcare. I was home with our D for the first 9 months, BF almost exclusively and since I get home much earlier than he does, even when I went back to work, I did the evening routine nearly every night. He spent very little time alone with our D. I made sure any bills that were not paid on-line got paid, and I am more handy around the house than he is, so I tended to handle that kind of stuff.

But, I often wondered myself-- what value did I bring to the relationship? My family is difficult to be around, I don't have a ton of friends, AND on top of all of that, why would he want to be with someone who was such a burden? Let's just say that THAT feeling did NOT help my depression. Sigh.

You know, you could pull a real 180 and thank him for the support he DID give you for as long as he did and THANK HIM for waking you up to the need for getting help b/c now that you have, YOU are so much happier (and implicitly, more loving)

What do you think? Can you pull it off? It sure would stand out to him as a 180 would'n't it?

Yes. This is amazing advice. Thank you for helping me see this from a new perspective. I am really grateful that you took the time to write all this. I have been stuck in a place of anger the last few days. I haven't seen it enough from his perspective.

[claire7]

Oh, and I totally agree about the chump stuff. It's such an easy place to fall to when you are feeling weak and sad (you know, like on your anniversary...)

I'm not exaggerating when I say that this forum and community have been a major reason I've come this far.

I'm so grateful.. and so sorry... you are all here.

[claire7]

Quick update:

I took a machete to my draft email and sent one that was mostly validating and, like 25 suggested, a thank you. I remembered that I actually did thank him for the opportunity he gave me to work on myself, shortly after BD. I remember telling him that if the best thing to come out of this was that I had the 2nd half of my life to live happily, I would always be grateful to him for that.

But I haven't said that in a while.

So, I opened up and sent a heartfelt note at around 1 am last night.

This morning I get a text: "Good morning. Do you know where we go to vote?"

Me: "no I'm sorry but you can probably look it up online"
H:"google actually has a great feature for that today. Here's our location, by the way..."

A crack in the ice? Who knows. But I'm glad I sent that email and not the one i had originally planned, which was much more self-righteous and accusatory.

Thank you all.

[stacey9]

That sounds really positive Claire, I'm glad.

And for what its worth I think it was a nice text from him on your anniversary. Mine came and went with no contact from H whatsoever.

A few months ago I did sent H a text to say I was sorry things had gone this far between us and that I did not expect things to turn out this way. I shouldn't have sent it, but was feeling very emotional after a talk about finances. He never responded. I was gutted. It would have been a perfect opportunity for him to wish me well, or say sorry, anything.

So I would have been delighted with some sort of acknowledgement on our anniversary after 22 years of marriage.

Take care

[GoatGal]

Claire,

This is what I meant when I said maybe your H needed an opening.


My H is very much an "Acts of Service" and "Words of Affirmation" guy.

So even though we are separated, I am servicing and affirming my butt off...

(With NO EXPECTATIONS, of course! )

I realized that in the past neither of us had spoken the other's Love Language very well. I take the hit on that one.

However, I did ASK my H to help fill my love tank in very specific ways, which he refused to do. On his end, he got resentful that I wasn't able to read his mind.

Although I can blame myself for not understanding this relationship dynamic sooner, I did show my love for him in many other ways, including Acts and Words. I just never realized a man could need so much external validation, because i sure don't!

Still, I don't think that my behavior was grounds to cheat on me and file for divorce.

Anyhow, I'm rambling. I'm glad you sent a note that was heartfelt and positive.
Your H has been through a lot in the M, though that doesn't excuse his behavior, and it probably is a warm fuzzy towards you that you recognize and appreciate that.

And yes--maybe a little crack is appearing. Time will tell!


---(G)GGG