my chance = HIS chance

[makingmagic]

is it just me? or is there something not right with him asking us (DD & I) to join his family for Thanksgiving dinner... and yet, just now tell me to meet him there? this is likely because he is trying to squeeze one more work thing in his day that makes sense to his schedule.... but, the message its sends me & my mom aren't quite right. He invited, he should be taking us. He mentioned that this way if my DD wants to leave early she can, and he will take me back.

Also, my DD prefers that she drive as she does not want to show up as a "happy family" when we are not. She calls us fake. She is really against us being there, if we are not confirmed that we are piecing/working on us.

It would have been preferable that I get to comment to him that we would drive on our own (respecting DD), but it got taken away from me... and now I'm feeling out of sorts.

UGGHHHH.... venting (letting it go)

[sandi2]

I think you said it best, this is not the time to stress over these things. Wait till the PMS is over.

It may be my assumption, but I look at your stitch as you wanting o start over with a new self respect as well as him doing the things to show that he values you, as well. I am wondering if you missed that period of time in your R with him where his actions showed how much he valued you in his life. So when he says or does something that clearly shows that he takes you for granted......or has you way down the list of his priorities, it really stings a lot. So you struggle between wanting him to respect and pursue......and dealing with your attraction to him and wanting back your family life/home.

Instead of trying to manipulate him into doing things the way you want........you either have to accept it as is or refuse it. There is another direction you might take. Simply tell him (without going into a R talk) that you prefer he handles it differently. For example, why not just tell him, "I would prefer you drive me to your folks on Thanksgiving, and to take me home later". That cuts out you guessing about his reasons behind it, and cuts out you doing something out of reaction. If he ask what difference it makes, just tell him it would make you happy if he would show this consideration to you as his guest. Do NOT get off into R talk. Do not start talking about him valuing you etc. do NOT justify your reasons. Leave it there on topic. You want him to take you to his family as his invited guest. Period. A simple yes or no from him is all it takes. If he says he can't, you can still go......just don't play games. You are plainly telling him what you prefer. Try this formula in smaller scaled issues the next few weeks. See how it works for you.

Saying what you want = takes away the guessing games

The men I know do not like games women play. MM, we females are often too complex and men don't get it.......even though we can't understand why they don't. Sometimes we have to spell it out for them. May take some of the romance out of it for us, but we stand a better chance in getting it. And frankly, I think it works much better to deal with these small issues as they come, instead of letting things build and then having a huge R talk where we throw everything into the mix.

Experiment with this one thing and just see how it goes.

[Ggrass]

Sanding, that's a great way of changing things up.

It cuts the whole negotiation stage right out, which is where things used to go par shaped with my h, although he also just wanted it his way as it was very easy.

[AJM]

Wait a tick, Sandi. You're saying that communicating to somebody vs. having them read your mind is hard to understand?

I would say it won't take the romance out of it. It'll be something you communicate and over time, he'll remember.

Complicated? Really? Women are complicated? I hadn't noticed..(but I do hear the same from women about men; makes one pause and wonder about humans )

<shrug> People are people. They want what they want and hear things the way they hear them. Is it up to the communicator or the communicatee to understand the message? One to ponder..

AJ

[makingmagic]

Hi Sandi..

As it turns out, unfortunately I was unable to read your message BEFORE he came to get us. However, I was able to do pretty much what you suggested: I called him & told him that I would prefer that since he asked us to go, that I prefer he come & get us. He expressed he was a little annoyed as he was already running late. I told him that I was already in town & he could meet us at work. He was content with that. He came to get us.

The family Thanksgiving was very nice. Both DD & I were lovingly welcomed by all. However, things between Xbf & I seemed a bit strained. He seemed to be displaced & was pacing before sitting on the couch beside me (the only available spot). When he finally did. He offered some of his beer to me. I spent most of my time interacting with all the other family members. I didn't spend much time focused on him, at all. We barely spoke much. At one point the paparazzi came out & our little family became the focus... (I think he was a bit uncomfy with that, but he smiled & put his arm across the back of the couch). At one point, we seemed to have a moment where everyone else was in a diff room & we were alone briefly. He was viewing some photos on his phone & wanted to show me one. I then showed him a few of mine. I was longing for some affection/attention, and leaned in and kissed him, he responded. We were then called for dinner. To my surprise, I was told that I would be seated at the kids table, with his cousin & the younger group. THIS [censored] (as usual)... no one wants to sit at the kids table. LOL... I didn't make a big deal & enjoyed myself at the kids table. Good convo's.

Looking back, I think its odd that I was seated there. Guess who was seated beside him???.... his mother!

After dessert, I excused myself from the kids table as a few others were mingling in the kitchen. I seated myself at the adult table beside his dad. He wasn't even in the room at this time. His dad and I seemed to connect well again and had lots to say & laugh about. At one point, we were discussing camera/cell phones and his difficulty using them. My Xbf sends him a recent photo of my DD & I.

We seemed to linger on much later than most of the other guests, taking our visit into the basement. His Dad seemed to really be enjoying himself having all the company in his home. I think Xbf was trying to indulge longer for the sake of his parents reconnection too.

At the end of the evening, we said our goodbye's to his Dad and he drove us along with his mother (front seat due to her foot injury) back to our car in town. He offered for us to take some left over pie. He was then going to go check on our business property before heading home.

Once back at my parents he sends a text:

All is well. Hope you both had a good time

I replied: We did. Tx. Hope you did too.

I dunno... I kind of feel he was trying to please my DD & I by inviting us, knowing that we miss his family. Also, that he was trying to please his Mom & Dad, by going. Like I said, we barely spoke & he didn't sit with me at the table.... is it me, or is this odd?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

BANG ON!! ... "It may be my assumption, but I look at your stitch as you wanting to start over with a new self respect as well as him doing the things to show that he values you, as well. I am wondering if you missed that period of time in your R with him where his actions showed how much he valued you in his life not missed it, it was just so long ago and our dynamics changed. So when he says or does something that clearly shows that he takes you for granted......or has you way down the list of his prioritiesthis is what happened, business took over, it really stings a lot. So you struggle between wanting him to respect and pursue......and dealing with your attraction to him and wanting back your family life/home."

As you can see Sandi... I do struggle with him taking me for granted & where he places me in his priorities...... Any ideas as to how I can balance all what I want & get what I need? I don't want to fall back into the same relationship again.

THANKS!!

[sandi2]

THIS [censored] (as usual)... no one wants to sit at the kids table. LOL... I didn't make a big deal & enjoyed myself at the kids table. Good convo's.

Wow, you handled it quite well, I think. I don't know that I could have been as gracious....since you were a guest after all. Although, you might look at it as they did not see you as a "guest" but still part of the family. (Why didn't they put your DD at the kids table?) Oh well, doesn't matter now.

As you can see Sandi... I do struggle with him taking me for granted & where he places me in his priorities...... Any ideas as to how I can balance all what I want & get what I need? I don't want to fall back into the same relationship again.

As much as we women do not want to have to spell it out for our men, I think that is exactly what you will need to do......in order for him to do differently. You asked for what you wanted this time (him carrying you to the dinner) and he did it. I'm glad his attitude wasn't sour about it.

Another thing I think I have learned where the MIL's fall on the priority list (which is usually ahead of us) is that some men look at it as to who will give them less grief over something. So, maybe that is true in other cases with other people involved? IDK, we can ask the guys here. I think for the most part, either gender can take the other one for granted due to laziness, bad habit, inconsideration, etc. I really wonder if it crosses the mind of some H's that they are taking the W or GF for granted in their actions.

That's all I know to do, MM. Take the small stuff as it comes and don't make big issues out of them. I think I can almost guarantee it won't be as big a deal to him as it is you. So, just spell it out, just object lessons or pictures.....you know, whatever it takes to get through to him.

I'm proud of you handling things like you did.

[sandi2]

Just thought of something to add. When or if you do have to spell it out, I think he would be more receptive of you telling him it makes you feel better when he does x,y, and z; rather than making it sound as if he is at fault anywhere. (We will know... )

I know you want him to feel the respect for you, etc., and I think he might after he puts it into action, IDK. I just believe it's important how you present it. Does that make sense? Like you did when you asked him to drive you to the family dinner. You didn't make a big deal out of it, and he did what you wanted.

[makingmagic]

Hi Sandi,

OK... will try that approach.

Fyi, DD sat at the kids table with me and 2 other moms.

How would you deal with this (below) using above approach?

Today, he texted and asked for my help down at the shop. I decided earlier that I was going to take my parents for a country drive & to a market. So to follow through with my plans, I left him frustrated with a project (not at me). I felt guilty but wasn't going to cancel on my parents yet again. I always do that. I mentioned that I would call to check in on him to see if he needed help when I got back. He did not motion to kiss me or to make gestures of acknowledgement...

The country market was closing, so this trip did not prove to be fruitful. When I returned, I called him from McD's asking if he wanted a coffee. He replied "yes, please". We drank the coffee, he brought out his cookies. He had found an old dresser and inside it were interesting brass handles/hardware that he knew I would like. He went back to work on our vehicles, he took a bit more of my help & then it began to rain. He was anxious to take the one vehicle back to his home shop to fix it outside of the rain. He jumped in his van and said "ok, Ive got a, b & c to still do, so I guess this is it?" I said "sure" and he immediately drove away. Again, no kisses or form of touch or affection. I was annoyed because I was wanting "time" more time together or at least for him to want/& ask. So, I called him immediately and asked "was I supposed to follow you back to the house to finish working?" He said "no, I can handle the rest on my own & to carry on" and that we need to figure out our bid for later or tomorrow morning..... so, I may get a text in a little while.

UGGHHHHHHH!! Carry on? Really... what is that? It feels like dismissal and rejection.

Is he suddenly feeling that we are spending too much time together & HE can determine when/how much time we create for ? or is it that he was truly preoccupied and busy with his own agenda? either way... I don't like the dismissal.

I really hope I'm done with PMS soon. I want reassurance & I don't feel I am getting it.

[makingmagic]

and then to add...

I finally caved in and texted him about the work thing/bidding. We were in discussion about what we should bid on our next purchase. I gave him my reasons and he got his back up & then stated "bid what you want"... his last words at 10:14 pm.

I wrote back:

"don't say that"
"bid what you want"
" our last purchase of similar was $X, but I am fine with your bid choice"
"why are you upset all of a sudden? I'm just reviewing our previous bids"

>>>>>>>>> no replies.

I know he will say that he went to bed after his last response. But, thats BS!

This leaves me normally to fret all night about should I bid, or will he? Worried that If I place a bid, then it won't be what he expected & if I don't bid, he will be mad....I am venting here so that I won't fret ALL night.

I don't think I should bid... its not right that he did that to me.

I don't think this is "trying to get along"...

What is a normal dignified response to give tomorrow morning? I am angered that he leaves me hanging. Shouldn't he be concerned that he p!ssed me off now too?

[sandi2]

The country market was closing, so this trip did not prove to be fruitful. When I returned, I called him from McD's asking if he wanted a coffee. He replied "yes, please". We drank the coffee, he brought out his cookies. He had found an old dresser and inside it were interesting brass handles/hardware that he knew I would like. He went back to work on our vehicles, he took a bit more of my help & then it began to rain. He was anxious to take the one vehicle back to his home shop to fix it outside of the rain. He jumped in his van and said "ok, Ive got a, b & c to still do, so I guess this is it?" I said "sure" and he immediately drove away. Again, no kisses or form of touch or affection. I was annoyed because I was wanting "time" more time together or at least for him to want/& ask. So, I called him immediately and asked "was I supposed to follow you back to the house to finish working?" He said "no, I can handle the rest on my own & to carry on" and that we need to figure out our bid for later or tomorrow morning..... so, I may get a text in a little while.

UGGHHHHHHH!! Carry on? Really... what is that? It feels like dismissal and rejection.

To me, "carry on" means to continue what I was doing before interrupted. I personally do not see a rejection or dismissal in his choice of words, but of course I wasn't there to observe the attitude in which it was said.

MM, this time of the month probably has you more sensitive to him, don't you think? Your feelings may tend to get hurt easier, you may feel more vulnerable, and you may have an emotional need for his attention and affection more at this time. So, keep ithat in mind. I won't blame everything on PMS, just saying it may intensify your feelings.

I finally caved in and texted him about the work thing/bidding. We were in discussion about what we should bid on our next purchase. I gave him my reasons and he got his back up & then stated "bid what you want"... his last words at 10:14 pm.

I wrote back:

"don't say that"
"bid what you want"
" our last purchase of similar was $X, but I am fine with your bid choice"
"why are you upset all of a sudden? I'm just reviewing our previous bids"

Maybe you should pick a good time to suggest late hours at the end of the day is not the time to discuss business. To me, it appears he was tired physically......and perhaps worn down mentally. You said earlier he was anxious/frustrated, so the stress of the day could have caught up with him. That could have been what was behind any sound of rudeness or bluntness. Again, not knowing his tone in which he said this, I am speculating. Since he did not reply to your text, it implies to me that he was clearly through talking for the night. I see him as being the type that when he's through.....he's through, and any further discussion from you is "pressure" to him. May be his way of shutting you up....IDK.

B/c of the complexity of this R, it seems to be impossible to separate your business R from your personal R with each other. As I recall, you tried that in the past and it didn't work for you. With that said, you may want to pick a time (not when he is stressed or you have PMS) to approach the topic of ground rules.

Simply tell him that in order to keep a good working R, it would help "you" if you had some ground rules in place. Be honest and tell him that due to the complex situation, you often times have problems distinguishing between his business side and his personal one.

This way, you are not necessarily blaming him, but it is something he can do to help "you". Remember: saying what you want = takes away guessing games. And, you do a lot of guessing about his actions.

I don't think I should bid... its not right that he did that to me.

I don't think this is "trying to get along"...

I really believe this boils down to the differences in the two styles of communication of you and BF. Nevertheless, to prevent it from growing into a monster, I would suggest you deal with it head on. Remember, don't make it sound as if you are pointing out all his faults, but rather, what he can do to help you.

When the time is right this morning, tell him you do not feel comfortable making any bid without his full support. Having his agreement/support is more important to you. This bid is certainly not worth the two of you not "getting along". (See if he offers any comments at that point.). Then approach the subject of how the conversation ended last night by tellin him that you wish you didn't sweat the small stuff.....but you do. He could help you a lot if he would not end calls abruptly. And......I believe I would just tell him that you have a difficult time not taking some business discussions more personally than you should b/c of the personal connection between the two of you. Tell him that abruptly ending calls is like leaving you with no closure to the discussion. Tell him that you would appreciate him telling you that he needs to go in a couplenof minutes to indicate the call is coming to an end. That way, he can give you a few more seconds to wrap up the discussion, and that will help you have closure......and not take things so personal. Ask him if he will do this for you.

Now MM, I am not gifted in this sort of thing. However, I hope you can get the main points and idea here. I believe he may be more receptive if he doesn't feel under attack and that it is you that needs this from him. That way, you can get past it, hopefully get what you want/need, and it won't continue to bother you.