Wife Still in MLC but has now left #3

[Matt165]

OK Everyone, I have a question!
I texted my W today to tell her that I was going to pick up D14 after school and take her home since D14 stayed an extra 2 days at her mom's (and that was 2 weeks ago! I miss having her with me!). First she texted "Why?" like she didn't remember that D14 stayed an extra 2 days. Then she texts back that she wanted to come over on Saturday to "Go thru (her) books". I am certain that there's more to it and I really don't want her here so she can cause trouble trying to take things that don't belong to her or that are still in "dispute"! So I text back to her that I have already packed a large amount of them and that I would be glad to take them to her place when I get D14. So, after about an hour I get back "No, I'd rather do it so I can divide up the ones to go to library and ones to keep". Umm... I suspect she wants to come here for more than books, I don't want her here, I don't trust her. So, I text back "Well,if you have them all there, can't you do that when you unpack them?".

I get back "No would rather go thru them and drop off at library on way home. Much less work and a lot less carrying". There is not either less work OR less carrying! That's stupid! Now, I know there is more to this. I didn't respond for about 40 min. and before I could the phone rings. It's my D14. She says that her mom said that I wanted to pick her up and take her home Friday after school and she doesn't want to have to take all her stuff to school with her that she wants to bring, won't have her dog, etc. I tell my D14 that of course I was planning to take her to hers mothers house to pick up her stuff first. Don't worry about that. She gets quiet and hems and haws and says "Well, mom wants to come to get her books Saturday and I figure I can just go with her".

So, seems that her mother put her up to calling me! So, I decide to just be honest with D14. I say "I just don't want mom wanting to take more than just her books. I have a feeling that she wants to take more than just her books". My D14 says "Yeah, she did say she wanted to get something else. I don't remember what it was....". Aha! I knew it. Why doesn't my W just stop this crap? She seems to have a need to cause trouble. She is so much concerned about "stuff", not so much about her D's! But since my D14 said she'd rather come Saturday I said that my W can come.

I plan on having all her books packed and ready to go when she gets here so she doesn't have a reason to stay. I also plan on being busy as well. I DO NOT want to "talk" to her about money issues like she wanted. I don't want to talk about her father or the D or anything else really. I know that she will want to take things that I don't want her to and that she put on the Final Decree that my lawyer is fighting. If she takes those things then what do I have to bargain with? The court will say I "gave" them to her so she should just keep them. To be honest I don't even want her in my home! (She still says she considers it HER home still as the D isn't final and she has a "right" to come here which isn't true!).

So, any thoughts on how i should handle her when she tries to take more than "her books"? How to just keep things from exploding which she seems to not be able to stop from doing if she hears one thing from me that she doesn't like. I hate this! I wish she would just stay in her sand box!

[Ss06]

Hmmm, I think this is an opportunity to "act as if".

You speculate (and perhaps had it confirmed by D14) that your W wants something else from the house. So, when she comes over and there are boxes of her books and she wants to get into the house to get the "other thing" say, "oh, was there something else you wanted, too?" with ZERO sarcasm. You're asking because you're genuinely asking not because you're being punitive and want to point out she's being rude.

So, acting as if, you expect your wife to be friendly, honest, respectful... so how would you treat someone whom you expect to act that way? You'd meet them in kind, right? So try that!

You might be surprised by the results. And if your W "just wants to go get something" perhaps you can say, "oh what is it? I've moved so much stuff around, maybe I can help you locate it".

WDYT?

[Atsbaby]

Hey Matt,

Sorry the W is trying to play games again. My L told me if there was anything that was in disput that I didn't want Clark to take, to remove it from the house, but disclose to the courts where it is. I keep it safe and still in my possession, but I'm aware that it may be turned over to him anyways.

I feel like the KY and TX laws are very similar, so maybe you can do the same. Take some stuff to a friend or relatives house that W doesn't go to. MAKE SURE TO TELL YOUR L YOU HAVE DONE THIS! No getting in trouble on her account.

And I like the approach Ss suggests. If you have the stuff out, it won't bother you as much, but I totally get the not wanting her in your home. I'm starting to feel the same way with Clark.

[Lifes Twists]

Hi Matt,

on a similar suggestion to AT I would actually suggest if you have a spare room to put a key lock on its door that only you have a key to and put disputed things in it. This way you keep them in the house and you don't involve a friend in the dispute. You can keep the key off property. This way you can tell the court the property in dispute never left the house. If your wife breaks down the door to the room you can then probably get a restraining order to keep her out.

[Matt165]

Thanks Ss, I like that.
That's exactly how I acted when she came with her friend in her friends truck to get some furniture. We had agreed the night before to exactly what she was going to take as I told her that I hadn't had time to do much unloading of and going through the furniture she wanted to take. Of course, she decided once she was there that she was going to take more than what we agreed to and when she started to take something I wanted to keep (the first time I had tried to stop her from taking something SHE wanted other than saying "Oh, are you taking that? OK.", she blew up and went to her lawyer the next day to finalize the D! (I'm still fighting what she put in that "Final Decree" so it's not yet final).

It was like the longer she was there, the more upset and anxious she became. It didn't matter that I was being really nice to her and pretty much letting her be. She knew what we agreed to. It was like she wanted to act like everything was done and we had agreed to everything she was going to take and she felt "entitled" to take anything, like our home was a thrift shop and was looking for the "best" stuff!

Also the fact that last weekend she texted me about how she doesn't think I'm paying "my share" of D's expenses because she took both the girls to the Dr.'s, put $30.00 in her school lunch card and bought some school supplies, tells me that she wants to "talk" about that kind of thing. Knowing how she has been over the last several years, her "talks" consist of her demanding what she wants and getting upset if I don't agree to everything SHE says. Like has been pointed out here and has become crystal clear to me....my W has zero "coping" skills, just like most MLCers. She can't seem to just talk and come to agreements as she will either become very upset if I don't just give in or feels it's OK to just "change her mind" and not stick to anything she says.

I know that she is wanting more than just her books and also that she is feeling over-whelmed, that she is paying more than her share (which isn't true but it's how she "feels. We all know how MLC's and reality go together...like oil and water!) and that means I can expect some unpleasant things come tomorrow!

[Matt165]

OK, so I made the mistake of talking to my boss and someone from work about my sitch. This is what I got....
When my D14 calls to ask to pick her up to take her to school, instead of doing it, I should tell her I'm sorry but I just can't. This way she gets to really see how living with my W feels. See that her mother wants her there but isn't willing to do the same things I am (like make sure she has a ride to school in the AM and in PM). Right now because I am willing to do these kind of things for her even when she's with her mom, she will think that as long as she stays with her mom, she will have the best of both worlds..her dad when she needs me and her mom when she's "willing". When she stays with me her mom won't EVER come and pick her up from school or really have anything to do at all with her. D14 might just think that by staying with her mom, she will be better off. This is starting to make sense to me.

Of course with the last 2 weeks being the start of school for her I feel I was more than right since my D14 was so upset and feeling so lonely and having to walk to the place she really hated going, that was just too much more pressure put on her! But now I will have her for the first time since she is at this new school. She will be able to see how living with me feels as she will have a ride to and from school every day, I will be there to help with homework, hang out with her, spend time with her, etc. Things she doesn't get from her mother.

At the same time what these people are saying makes sense as well. I really wish I hadn't let my W put her into this school. I should have fought harder to put her into a school closer to me and where she would need to step up for her D14. As it stands right now, my W knows that D will call me and I will come to her aid. Of course I didn't know D14 would be walking to school as my W said there was a bus!

Now these guys are telling me that I shouldn't even let my W in the house, that I need to get a "war" state of mind, stop letting her get away with the stuff she is doing. That if I don't "fight" for what I deserve I won't get it, etc. They have no idea about the DB principals or the fact that as we all know, all that attitude will get me is more crazy from my W! They also are saying that my W is probably telling my D14 that if she ever decides to say to the court that she wants to live with me more than her mother that W will just push her out of her life, that she will be so very hurt, etc. At this point I know that my W is taking her cues from her a$$hat father who is an a#1 manipulator and sociopath, so I now wouldn't put ANYTHING past her. Instead of her getting more agreeable since she left, she has become more and more selfish and uncaring about anything at all that I'm going through. She hasn't a single care about what I'm going through, that I know.

What do some of you vets out there think about me needing to show my D14 what being with her mom is really going to be like? If I ever do get a different job I may not have the flexibility to do these things and D14 needs to understand that she can't always count on my being able to take up the slack for her mom when she stays with her. At only 14 can she really see that her mom is being uncaring and selfish towards her? I know how hurt D14 has been over the last few years because her mother wouldn't do anything with her or as a family and I know how badly she has wanted her mothers attention and approval. All she has to do is give her SOME attention and tie that to D14 doing what W wants her too and I can see my D eating it up and doing whatever she needs to keep getting that attention and approval. I had hoped my W wouldn't stoop that low but at this point I can't trust that she hasn't already started doing just this!

[AJM]

A war state of mind? I don't think that's very productive, do you? Your whole family (including her) have enough going on and it's not like anything she is doing is hurting you. You're doing that by not being detached from the outcome or the immediate situation.

What they describe is pure ego. And has nothing to gain for you unless you are that damaged.

I do however agree that you shouldn't let her come and go as she pleases. It's easy enough to say "no. I'll bring the books over and you can do what you want with them." and leave it at that. Unless and until you can do things without worrying about her reaction or whether or not it's the "right" thing to do, you'll be stuck and a prisoner of this situation.

Like many prisons, you have the key to this one.

It's your life too, Matt. You can put your foot down without being mean, angry, "war-like" or any bravado. You're an experienced man. You can be you without fear of reprisal from your W.

What's she going to do? Divorce you? Leave? Say mean things about you?

That's not a free pass to become angry and nasty. You're the type that would not like yourself for doing that and I see no reason to let the choices of your W dictate your future self.

My $0.02 worth.

Oh, and try not to talk it over with friends too much. They want to see you stop hurting and will do anything to reach that goal. Including give you advice you won't like having taken later.

AJ

[Wonka]

Matt,

I am dealing with a lot on my plate at the moment that is very messy like a bad spaghetti with splashed sauce all over it.

However reading your recent post really knocked the wind out of me because I thought to myself...Really??!! Is Matt that dense and/or stupid?

When my D14 calls to ask to pick her up to take her to school, instead of doing it, I should tell her I'm sorry but I just can't. This way she gets to really see how living with my W feels. See that her mother wants her there but isn't willing to do the same things I am (like make sure she has a ride to school in the AM and in PM). Right now because I am willing to do these kind of things for her even when she's with her mom, she will think that as long as she stays with her mom, she will have the best of both worlds..her dad when she needs me and her mom when she's "willing". When she stays with me her mom won't EVER come and pick her up from school or really have anything to do at all with her. D14 might just think that by staying with her mom, she will be better off. This is starting to make sense to me.

What do some of you vets out there think about me needing to show my D14 what being with her mom is really going to be like? If I ever do get a different job I may not have the flexibility to do these things and D14 needs to understand that she can't always count on my being able to take up the slack for her mom when she stays with her. At only 14 can she really see that her mom is being uncaring and selfish towards her?

Slapping you hard on the upside

Matt, Matt....you are not DBing D14!! Your job is to be there to support D14 through this new transition.

Why on Earth would you hurt D14 in this manner by tightening screws on her just show her that Mom is the unreliable parent??!!! What's your point here, really?? Some victory for you---at whose expense??!! D14 already knows this and doesn't need you to put screws into her just because you are very frustrated with your W.

This is strictly between you and W. Don't you ever even entertain notions about just leaving D14 high and try just to teach her a lesson about her Mom. How wacky is that thinking process?

More importantly....why on Earth would your so-called "clear-headed" work colleagues even suggest that ^^?? Stupid, stupid.

At only 14 can she really see that her mom is being uncaring and selfish towards her?

Haven't you been listening to D14 and D19 at all??? They've already told you several times how crazy Mom has been and how unreliable she's been. Good Lord...D14 is already living through this so she doesn't need to "know how's that gonna look like." Jeepers!

Why would you even bring up that question any way, Matt? Was that idea planted by your stupid, stupid work colleagues? What were they thinking??! Must have smoked something at the office.

Come on, Matt. I think you can do better than this. Really.

[Lifes Twists]

Unfortunately Wonka I think Matt has progressed from a 2x4 to a 4x8 on the side of the head.

Matt, you never put the kids in the middle of it. Leave that to your wife. Listening to family, co workers, or friends is a short trip to disaster.

Your daughters are putting 2+2 together. They will figure your wife out. That does not mean they will stop loving her. They will just pick and choose when to involve her in their lives. Take this from someone who was in your place a year ago in regards to daughters and wife. keep being the stable person in their lives who is there for them. You will be rewarded for your efforts soon. Have some patience.

[ForeverYoung]

AJ is correct, what your boss and coworker advised is pure ego driven. Any satisfaction gained would be short lived. You are better than that. I also know you would never knowingly do anything to hurt your girls.

So now that you've spilled the beans with them, here's what you need to do. When they ask you questions about your sitch, you put your best possible spin on it. Leave out or down play any negative stuff.

It goes without saying that you do not initiate any more relationship talks with them.

Keep working on your PMA. If they see you doing well they'll not worry about you... and will not push you to do something stupid.

I hope you have at least one trusted person to confide in.