Thanks for directing me to lovethehub's post. That was fantastic reading and very insightful!
M: 15 years BD: 6/25/14 EA/PA: starts 5/14/14 11/30/14 - A ends 5/15/15 - D is finalized. 11/28/15 - Start of new LTR with a wonderful woman (and still going strong)!
Just got off the phone with the DB coach. Gameplan going forward:
1. Lay off any and all thoughts about talking to her friends/family in order to provide them "my perspective". If I feel they're getting a twisted, one-sided story from my WAW, then so be it. Any attempts to intervene will backfire.
2. Continue 180s and detachment. Much progress has been made here and I need to simply stay on course and minimize any further setbacks.
3. Do not encourage "family time" with the kids. Let her be the one to bring it up. Do not force it on her in any way.
4. Do not even think about dating other women at this point.
5. Let child custody/relocation situation between OM and OMW run its course. Just sit back and be patient. Best case scenario is that things come crashing down on his side of the fence and the affair ends. Do not try to snoop into their relationship (do not contact OMW) or try to intervene in any way.
M: 15 years BD: 6/25/14 EA/PA: starts 5/14/14 11/30/14 - A ends 5/15/15 - D is finalized. 11/28/15 - Start of new LTR with a wonderful woman (and still going strong)!
Just got off the phone with my DB coach. She thinks the situation so far has had some encouraging progress, but some notable setbacks. I have to stop getting myself involved in arguments with her, especially about the affair or our past. I have to control my anger. I have to stop contacting the OMW.
I did not know you were contacting his wife. IT's really telling that you did NOT disclose that here (or did I miss that?) If you did not disclose it here, that should tell you something about your motivation and your "lying by omission".
It's a huge NO NO. I cannot stress that enough. There is no way to see it as anything other than manipulation and control and vindictive punishment from YOU.
And btw, how do you know if you just crushed that guy's wife's ego? Maybe THEY WERE trying to patch things up or maybe she wanted to, but now that you have "outed" her h and your w, it makes it that much harder on her pride to know that it's semi public.
Do not tell 3rd parties this information. It never makes YOU look good. Plus don't make it harder for OM to go back to his wife.
You want to keep the road home paved & smooth for your wife, (AND for OM's and his wife, right?)
Approach pursuit tactics very carefully. If I can get a full week of "good days" (no arguments or conflicts), then I can build on that. I haven't had more than two or three consecutive "good days" since D-day, four weeks ago. well you have to build on that, for sure.
I have to keep my good attitude and detach. Give her the freedom she so desires without stepping over any boundaries that we've both established.
indeed
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
The only time is when I went on business trips or training (rare occasions), with one exception. A few years ago, I went on an overnight trip with my brother and a couple of close friends.
That was it.
My wife has also gone out on business trips which included overnight stays.
So, Who watched the kids when you were out with the whores?
(Oops, I meant "paid escorts", b/c "whore" is what you called your wife for being with a man who treated her with love and kindness...and "paid escorts" is what you called the women who slept with you for money, and to whom you sent love notes and shared fond memories)...
...and to say her affair is worse is b/c it's more important to her than your flings were to you, WOW.
That's really not mature or fair. It's also the exact opposite of how We see this.
IF she really "loves" OM then it makes much MORE sense to me, morally, that she'd have an affair, than someone she PAYS to violate marriage vows with, for her purely physical SELFISH needs, AND OR her fragile ego, prideful ways...etc. Your point really is that her affair is more of a threat to the marriage b/c it matters to her more than the "escorts" mattered to you. But that just says how pathetically shallow your adultery was, not how bad her A is. I mean,
when I read your comments about how her 1 "true love" affair was worse than your multiple sex partners over the years, well Your double standard literally made me laugh out loud. (Beats yelling I guess).
So you were with those women and your wife watched the kids but now if she expects you to do the same, SHE is "selfish"?
This reminds me of how mosquitoes must feel at nudist's colonies; I don't know where to start!
I'll close for now by saying, You lack empathy, (from what I see here)
and if you think "ground rules" are something YOU get to write and she must obey,
Then I suggest you go back to your IC and talk about Control problems and lack of empathy
b/c they are still your biggest issues.
Last edited by 25yearsmlc; 08/01/1410:16 PM.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
That was a bad text to send - you can't shame a wayward and have it work in your favor. All that judgment only comes across as controlling and she will further revolt.
However, nothing you said was untrue, and having sent the text, I don't see where an apology was in order, and that probably further weakened your position.
the apology IS needed for 2 reasons; 1) it's hypocritical as hell for THIS h to complain to his wife about anything she does with OM at this point; as he is a serial cheater;
and 2) for the reasons you cited above! To help his position he cannot come off as a man who has not changed AND OR who has a judgmental attitude, which is exactly how he comes across almost always.
get your focus off W, where you have no control, and get it back on you and your kids, where you do have lots of work to do.
And then there's this^^^....he does not work on himself or HIS issues for more than a day or two before he goes right back to stare at his w or OM
(or worse, involves OM's family). That is a multi-dimensionally bad idea. It cannot possibly help HIS own situation but it may drive OM and mind's wife into each other's arms faster - as it makes it harder for OM to go back to his own family!
What right does Minds have to hurt OM"s family?
AND it makes mind's personality look that much more punitive, hypocritical, controlling/manipulative--which it is, and out of control vindictive. None of which is attractive, to say the least.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Mindsin, this is going to be a GREAT test of whether you can listen with an open-mind and not get defensive. Can you take 25's heat, or will it scare you off b/c it's too hard to face?
I'm looking forward to hearing your response and I hope you wait to think on it for a bit...
(25, if I may interject for a moment-- you are on a roll, so please feel free to hop on over to my thread and have at me!)
Just got off the phone with the DB coach. Gameplan going forward:
1. Lay off any and all thoughts about talking to her friends/family in order to provide them "my perspective". If I feel they're getting a twisted, one-sided story from my WAW, then so be it. Any attempts to intervene will backfire.
2. Continue 180s and detachment. Much progress has been made here and I need to simply stay on course and minimize any further setbacks.
3. Do not encourage "family time" with the kids. Let her be the one to bring it up. Do not force it on her in any way. BUT do not prevent it! You want her to have something to miss, and you pouting or shutting her out, is not what she'd miss.
4. Do not even think about dating other women at this point. ^^^For so many reasons, AMEN.
5. Let child custody/relocation situation between OM and OMW run its course. Just sit back and be patient. Best case scenario is that things come crashing down on his side of the fence and the affair ends. Do not try to snoop into their relationship (do not contact OMW) or try to intervene in any way.
Actually there are a lot of reasons for you to stay out of their sandbox, including how wrong it is for you to do at all.
NO one appointed you judge and jury and executioner and I'm stunned that you never told us before how you interfered with all this. IT's a startling omission and it's a telling one.
I think you do this a lot, "don't mention something" b/c you know we'll disapprove. How much of that "lying by omission" did you do or do you still do, inside the marriage?
Also, the LAST thing you want is for another family to come "Crashing down" on his side of the fence. What next for him and his family, bankruptcy?
I would think the best thing for YOU, (selfishly thinking now) would be for OM to realize the error of his ways and to make things work WITH HIS WIFE and to have his family remain intact. That also happens to be what is best for others...
The only "good" thing to come out, if his family comes crashing down on him is revenge and that's NOT good.
It just appeals to you...which means you have yet more work to do at a deep level.
Are you a spiritual person? How are you with your faith these days?
I know you said shame is not useful and it's not.
But when you bring the A up to your w as you so often do, which is to shame her although you say "it's to make her think" as if there is a difference, (AND of course its another double standard b/c you let yourself do things you condemn her for doing,) = you don't want shame used on YOU but you are willing to try and inflict it upon your w.
So you are using it as a tool of punishment' - and it's only now are you seeing that even when you make her feel like crap,
it's not worth it b/c she does not then run to you; She runs FROM you.
Maybe that's the only way to get you to stop doing it for now and then later on when you evolve and grow, you'll see the other reasons we are pointing out.
Be the best man YOU can become and let that be enough. No more trying to manipulate outcomes or control others. Let God do that.
It's not your job and it never was, and it never worked anyhow. Stay in your sandbox b/c you have enough sand to work with there.
Make sense?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
I stopped bringing up the A to my wife. I try to avoid any and all conversations about the OM/OMW, even though she tries to initiate the discussion at times. It's tempting though.
Regarding the OMW, their situation is almost identical to mine. The OM disclosed to the OMW a month before my wife disclosed to me. My contacts with the OMW have been mostly one-sided (she does most of the talking). My main purpose was mainly for information gathering and to get a deeper look into their relationship and why it failed. The other (bigger) reason is to see what I can say to her to change her approach in an attempt to better her odds at getting her H back. For example, I know that she's been using extremely unhealthy tactics (e.g. showing up at her H's work with the two kids, asking to confront him and my wife). She uses her children against him, putting negative thoughts into their heads regarding the situation and regarding my wife. Children should never be used as weapons in marital conflicts of any type. They're off limits, IMO. Her children are 7 and 4.
To answer your other question -- no, I am not really a spiritual person. I don't align myself with any particular religion. You can call me an agnostic.
M: 15 years BD: 6/25/14 EA/PA: starts 5/14/14 11/30/14 - A ends 5/15/15 - D is finalized. 11/28/15 - Start of new LTR with a wonderful woman (and still going strong)!
