Dealing with WAW Part 2

[pilot]

How do you 'properly' limit progress until OM/A is covered? As I stated before, I really do not think W is ready to work on M.


All ^^^guess work & mind reading on your end, which you do a lot of and it's part of how you got here. Remember? Why would your wife believe YOU wanted to work on the m?

Be honest here...if I were her, and I had hugged you often, reached out repeatedly, complimented you with no return comment b/c you cannot manage a single kind remark on my looks or appearance, including when I've made an effort to look good to/for you, I would think

"he's done. Maybe we can be decent co-parents" (what some folks mean by the word 'friends')...


We have had a lot of progress from where we were a couple of months ago, but for all I know, it is just towards a friendship and nothing more.

Maybe you could keep guessing and not knowing...b/c you think the "rules" are laws that are one size fits all (They are NOT!) and plus, not asking means you take no responsibility for a risk or result...right? See how self serving this can get? I know ---b/c I'm a great rationalizer. As a L, that's what I did professionally, i.e. rationalize for others choices.

And we do it very well when we are in our own marriages with our egos and pride and emotional investments...but it's a dangerous thing when we no longer recognize the difference between a well thought out HONEST approach, based on articulable goals, and a simple justification for doing what is easiest or most appealing to us, or a punitive response we label as "just" or "fair".

If that is the case, then I do not want a friendship while she is still in contact with OM. But the catch 22 is I cannot ask about OM.

Yes you can. There needs to be an R talk of some sort at some point. When there is, however that takes place or whenever (we'll get to that), THEN you have to say how you feel without first waiting to see if she takes the first risk.

Stop making this about who "caves" in first or who puts out the olive branch first. That's a scorecard habit and it's destructive and based on false pride (as opposed to healthy self respect) and not based on love. In my eyes, she has already reached out physically, more than once and you have withheld, knowingly, more than once. I'm mildly surprised she is still hanging in there.



If her intent is to maybe rebuild our M, it would seem she is trying to ignore the 800 lb gorilla in the room which is OM. That also, cannot happen. But, I cannot ask about OM.

You're both ignoring it! And what about your role in things? Remember how long she put up with your "medicated self" and the campaign and the financial problems and the zero pay for all that work? Remember when you admitted she put a lot of deposits in the love bank, for months, and you didn't.... Remember?

Is it now ALL about the EA/PA she had or might have had? (I love that you have no proof an OM still exists at all, but are planning on conditions that need to be met by her, while not discussing any of this....more of the same old poor communications).

So how do you get past this? Wait until she brings it up? What if it is never brought up by her?

Gee, I don't know... maybe you constructively confront it? And maybe that requires a 3rd party who is pro marriage, to facilitate a healthy discussion.

She has to know that you ARE open to working your butt off to save this m b/c you know how good it once was and that's not a small thing...but it would take effort on both parts obviously.

She also has to know that you won't keep rehashing history and throwing the "A" (whatever it was) in her face or hang it over her head like the sword of Damacles.

I'm not sure you can do that b/c you keep bringing up the "she filed behind my back" issue and how it had "nasty" wording in it, WHILE ALSO agreeing that the lawyer was just doing his job.

You keep wanting to punish her for it, even while knowing that it's uncalled for, (mixing business and emotions), but I am more and more of the belief

that this goes back to your inability to forgive, which I think is part of the whole "shebang" here.

Meaning, if you could forgive and you knew it, you'd be a lot quicker to admit flaws in yourself (b/c you'd believe YOU could be forgiven, so it's not such a huge ordeal to admit making mistakes ). You would not be so fearful of communicating openly, b/c you'd know that bumps in the road were not fatal...

Pilot, you are not your father and she is not your mother.


Maybe there is something to that^^^ sentence you need to process??


It would stand to reason she would NOT want to discuss OM regardless of what her intentions were.

Wow, I don't agree at all. You are presuming negatively, again.

If it were me, (and about 22 years ago it almost was) I would think I'd address my "affair", WHY it happened and how we'd guard against finding ourselves there again, and I would think you'd want that too. (If you don't own your part of it, why wouldn't it happen again? That's another reason why I'd think you'd be very motivated to learn from this).

I'd be very open to doing what it takes to regain your trust. But I'd want to know that you are not going to make me climb Mt Everest for years, BEFORE you decide IF you'll do your part in the m, or before you give me a compliment (before I've "really earned it")...you can't mistreat me to 'get even" or make me "prove my love" by aborbing nasty treatment in retaliation --or watch you date or hint about dating...

BTW, why didn't you tell her "it's just a friend" when she asked who you were going with to dinner?

Pilot...I know why. But face that yourself.

In short...I think She needs as many guarantees as you do, maybe more.

How does the subject get broached when you are uncertain if her intentions are just a friendship or possible R?

Suggestions? Thoughts? Winning lotto numbers?

You talk, that's how. Yes that means taking a risk. But it's what healthy adults do, & it sure beats the guessing game.

You are right. She probably has no reason to believe I want to work at our M or R. Some of it was by design, and some of it just fell into place. I suppose I could take a risk and bring it up. I had kind of hoped and maybe somewhat expected she would bring it up.

That is why I am here asking the questions. So people like you who have been down this road can help point me in the right direction.

As always 25, I appreciate your input and insight. You are always welcome to chime in on my thread