Roller coaster and then some

[2BHappy]

I kinda understand how you feel, I guess we all do in a way

The in between is horrible and keeps us in what feels like a hold pattern.

When I mentioned something like this on a post before, I was advised to not look at it like "being on hold" If we just focus on GAL and some 180's and figuring out ourselves it is a lot easier...

I dont know how to put it in words..but I try to pretend like my H is really a room mate, not easy at all.

I also try to pretend that H is a guy I like, but not sure if this will turn into something long term.. Ex When I 1st starting dating H I was not hanging around waiting for him to call, I was strong and made decisions on my own...etc

I also try to stay in the mind set of if H does not realize the great woman that I am, then in the end it is his lost!!! Be that great woman.

[ForeverYoung]

First of all, you did not f'up. Understand that no one encounter is going to make or break your marriage. I want you to relax around your H. You know you are the prize, right? If you're not sure about this, then THAT is what you need to work on! Building up your confidence. I know how hard it is to do this early after BD, but it is KEY.

Yes, you did put some pressure on him. You told him what you wanted and what you would not accept. He heard you so now don't bring it up again. He knows.

If he's not working on the marriage, then make it appear that you aren't either! Give him time and space. It's great that he wants to talk to you about the Big Stuff, your job is to listen and validate. Be the friend who is there for him. Be the ROCK. Do not get caught up into trying to convince him of anything or telling him what you want. (unless he asks) This is all about him right now, he has to figure this out. Your job is to not get in his way.

^^^Right now, this IS how you work on your M.

You mentioned not liking that he "moved half out", and some things about OW and EA's. What are your deal breakers? Think hard about this. Decide what you will or will not tolerate and stand firm on that.

Have you read Michele's chapter on MLC in DR?

[daring]

2BH and FY- thanks for the support and responses.
I know I am the prize ( most days), the one he would be crazy to leave. I think what scares me is he seems to realize that too, even somewhat verbalize it, but still wants to leave.
I know this is about his journey and not really about me but I am really having a hard time with detachment this week.

FY- I have read the MLC chapter a few times as well as Cadet's homework, and the resources on this site and hero spouse. As far as deal breakers- I'm not even positive what they are. They might be different for eventually working on the marriage versus gaining some space and breathing room right now.

He did have an EA with our close friend/neighbor and recognized it after quite some time. It started causing issues in her marriage too and that's what it took for him to realize. That part of their relationship has ended but I am still working through the hurt and distrust- much better than I used to be. There was also a brief one time episode of physical contact many years ago with another if our close friends. ( took him 6 yrs to tell me about that one). I know it's all a symptom of his own childhood unmet needs combined with where I needed to step up better in the relationship but it still hurts. I recognize this as my opportunity to work on me.

As far as I know there are no other OW and he is around so much with me and kids I think I would know- but any thing is possible. What I see is him forging friendships with other people that should be a good thing but I worry about whether he has any boundaries right now since he's trying to "fill his holes".

I guess I was also hoping that he was heading towards the last part of his journey. As best I can tell this started around 2009-2010. Replay started early 2011 ( Harley, sports car, 2 atvs, a dune buggy, kitty cat level mean to me and an EA to top it off). First time he said I'm not sure this is what I want was in Dec 2012 and then we kinda worked on it until full BD sept 2013.

I thought I was doing better but this week has me so confused. I'll take your advice FY- relax, don't work on the marriage per se but keep working on me and no more mention of what we discussed today unless he asks.

[GoatGal]

Wow, Daring...

I just started reading your thread and I admire your ability to stay so compassionate and calm during these emotional transactions with your H!

And Forever Young-- what great feedback!

I am going to look up that Raine thread you mentioned...

Meanwhile, there are some odd similarities between your H, Daring, and mine.

With the exception that mine says/does very similar things, just without any tears or obvious emotion (unless you count a child-like anger.)

I'm going to keep following along here, see how it all unfolds.

Our timelines are somewhat similar as well, but I'm miles from figuring out whether or not knowing what "phase" H is in is any help whatsoever.

I guess it's all just DBing in the end!

---GG

[ForeverYoung]

2BH and FY- thanks for the support and responses.

You are welcome. If I can be of any help, I am honored.

I know I am the prize ( most days), the one he would be crazy to leave. I think what scares me is he seems to realize that too, even somewhat verbalize it, but still wants to leave.

Just goes to show that it's really not about you, right?

As far as deal breakers- I'm not even positive what they are. They might be different for eventually working on the marriage versus gaining some space and breathing room right now.

Deal breaker means: if H does (or doesn't do) X, you're done with the M. And yes, they can change.

As far as I know there are no other OW and he is around so much with me and kids I think I would know- but any thing is possible.

Same for me and my W. This is a HUGE positive. For me, this means we need to do our best to listen, and meet our spouses needs... So they don't have to run to OP to have those needs met.

What I see is him forging friendships with other people. That should be a good thing but I worry about whether he has any boundaries right now since he's trying to "fill his holes".

Let him go. He has to see this through to make it out the other side. Friendships with others is necessary for him right now. If he's anything like my wife, and I think he is, he will tell you about these friendships. Listen and build on that.

Your assignment is to write on the blackboard... "I am the prize!" 500 times.

[daring]

GG- nice to "meet" you, though sorry it is under these circumstances. Thank you so much for the positive feedback- it's nice to have outside perspective that I am being compassionate as it hurts like hell!
I will wander over to your thread and read soon. Have to survive H's sister's wedding today first.

FY-
I wrote in on my phone 3 times as my top note I will reference it often!
Trying to be a friend and stay detached is a hard balance but I'm working on it! I definitely don't want him to turn to anyone else so it's worth figuring out.

Interesting developments yesterday- after the conversation I outlined we went to the wedding rehearsal and dinner. I thought I was doing ok but when they were doing some readings and talking about the vows I had to get up and walk out as it really hit me with pain I hadn't felt at that intensity in awhile.
H noticed I seemed upset and walked to to the car- asked what's wrong. I said I don't know if I can sit through the vows tomorrow- I take them seriously. I wasn't trying to be hurtful to him- just honest.
So he stayed with family at after rehearsal party much later than I and kids did. At around 1am I texted him and asked if he was just staying at family's house for the night. He texted no, on way back and can I call you.
When he called he said he had gone to the beach for awhile to sit and think. He hadn't realized how unfair he has been to me. Hearing the comment about the vows stung. Said our talk earlier in the day was good for him to hear how I see things panning out versus his idealized view of what will happen. He wants us to keep those conversations going. He knows thus isn't what I want, and he figures we will go back and front to extremes. He knows he can't "make" me happy ( I have always told him everyone's responsible for their own happiness and relationships are enhancements of that) but he wants to treat me better. And he cares- a lot. He knows he has a lot of work to do.
I thanked him for sharing all of that and said I would help him as I am able.

My goals for this week-
-Make it through the wedding without balling my eyes out.
-Be his friend but still stand my ground( if he brings it up) that a D means a change in dynamics that does not involve the level of relationship he thinks it will.
-Keep the focus that I am the prize- which involves GAL and creating my own time and space when emotionally needed.

Thanks to everyone for insight and support! I can do this!

[Matt165]

Hi daring,
I can relate to the fact that your H seems to think that after D, there will be a "friends" type of R. I really see my W thinking the same. As she is packing her things and moving this weekend, she is still asking me for my "help" in ways she would never ask just a "friend". The latest being to drive a U-Haul for her and her mother to get some things from her GM's old home. She so wants to be independent, to live her life on her own terms, yet at the same time is expecting me to see her as my friend.

I think this is a big part of DBing. To find a way to show them that there are big consequences to their actions and that they really aren't seeing things as they really are going to be. MLCers seem to have a fantasy mapped out in their heads. This is what they think they will gain by doing what they are. Part of that fantasy involves us just seeing that they didn't do anything wrong. That they aren't "bad" but just doing what they want. What's so wrong with that? I don't think they can see just how much damage they have caused, how much pain until they start to come out of the tunnel. Until then, nothing we say or do will make any difference or help them see the truth. Notice that even as your H validates all the pain his actions have caused you (and still are) he hasn't backed off at all that he is still going to keep moving down the same path.

It's nice that you at least get an acknowledgment that he knows what he is doing is hurting you and that he doesn't want to cause you hurt (more than most of us LBS's get) but at the same time, he doesn't seem to have any thoughts about NOT doing those things. At least not yet.

I wish you luck and really hope that as he starts to understand the consequences of his action, the pain he is causing and how little he actually will gain by moving forward, that he can change direction. I'll be praying for you!

[GoatGal]

Yes. What Matt said, ^^^^ 100%.

[daring]

Well this has certainly been a crazy week!

I met goal number 1, I did not cry at the wedding! Yay me! However, the happenings of the evening were beyond anything I would have expected.

As a preface, out if respect for H I have not discussed out situation with any of his siblings even though I am close to all of them. I let him tell them about what was going on. I have talked to his mom once I made sure he was ok with it.
So last night at reception the eldest of the two sisters starts crying as she hugs me saying I hate that all of this is going on, you're my sister I don't want to lose you. I reassured her I would always be family and visit no matter what happens with H.
Then the sister that got married starts doing the same as we are leaving the reception. Her upset was amplified a bit as she had been drinking and she was just balling and hugging me. Several people went back to the newlywed a house to hang out and she asked me to go. When we got there she was still crying and asking why is this happening, what's wrong with him etc... I didn't say much related to him other than I think he's in MLC and I will always love him and I love all of them too and will still be around for them.
Then H comes over ( after taking home one of the highly drunk sisters of the groom) and she starts talking to him about our situation and can't you just figure it out etc. Wants to understand what the problem is so she doesn't repeat it in her own new marriage ( he couldn't really answer) then brings up things about how their dad abandoned them and stepdad was the only father she really knew and she knows that makes H mad b/c he was the oldest and the father figure etc.
Then says to him she doesn't like how close he had become with her new H's two sisters and she's worried about how that impacts the whole situation with he and I. She thinks it's inappropriate and that one of them will try to take advantage of him. ( this part is interesting to me as those are two of the friendships I had been particularly worried about him keeping boundaries in but I never mentioned it to his sister- she noticed on her own).

On drive back to hotel H was really in a bad place, said he felt like he's failed everyone and they all hate him and he has to go back from vacation to a job he hates.
Said he got sucked into helping the sister's of new husband of his sister and that he just isn't going to interact with them anymore ( interesting that he was able to recognize the toxicity there) and he also assured me there was nothing going on with them. I said ok.
Then he said he hadn't even touched on everything going on with us, add that all together and it's way more than he can handle and he realizes he often underestimates all he is trying to deal with.
I really felt bad for him- I tried to offer comfort and a reminder that his sisters, like us, have abandonment fears and just need reassurance. He was really beating himself up.

He didn't sleep all night. This morning he told me thank you for supporting him and he's sorry he's out of his mind. Also said he wanted to crawl into a hole.
He had to fly out for business trip and myself and kids returned home.
I talked to him briefly on phone tonight and he sounded back to his distant, manage stuff with the kids in a stern manner behavior.

I really hope all if this doesn't set him back. It was awesome to be supported by his family ( even my MIL said he was being an a$$) but I don't want his emotions so beaten down that his progress is stunted.

I am emotionally exhausted! Probably good he is traveling this week as I get a break from interaction!

[ForeverYoung]

Hi Daring, please understand that it really is best to keep family out of all this as much as possible. They will push and pull for resolution one way or another. It is more pressure on both you and H. (Look at how he responded, wanting to hide or run)

My advice is to only feed them the bare minimum regarding the situation. "We're working on things" or "I understand this will take some time to be resolved, and I'm ok with that". <<<stuff like that... and then change the subject. If necessary, you can explain how you are following a "time and space" plan that you believe to be best right now, and hope that they understand and can do the same.

Remember, if they see you are doing well they are more likely to relax too. So, in some respect, you have to "fake it 'til you make it" with them too! Seriously, nothing good can come from getting family involved.

Having said that, you do need one or two people you can confide in who will keep it all confidential. Also who can listen objectively without inserting their opinion or telling you (or H!) what to do. Do you have someone like this?

Use this week wisely and focus on you. Take good care of yourself, do some nice things for yourself. Remember, you (and family) cannot fix H, so try not to spend your time focused on that.

Yes, I know how difficult this can be, and you will have tough moments or even days. But when you focus on the things you can control, you will continue to get stronger every day.