Hope-- think about those fears. .. you are letting them get the best of you. You are strong and resilient. You are not destined to be alone. In fact, it's entirely possible that you'll end up with someone who week not only be a great husband, but a great step-dad, too. (My MiL ended up with a 2nd husband who worships her and loves her kids like they were his own). And your D will not have the same childhood as you, because she has YOU--strong, resilient YOU-- as a mom. And if her dad is not so great? Well, you will be able to help her navigate that, by getting her whatever support she needs to deal with it.
I'm working on them. Really, I am. My H actually has a wonderful stepdad. They had some rocky years when H was a teenager, but I know that his stepdad (the guy I consider my FIL) loves H just like he loves his two biological kids. Really, my D7 is not his biological granddaughter, but he adores her, and she adores him. I was talking to him once and he said, Don't tell the other kids, but D7 is my favorite of all the grandchildren. So, despite my personal experience with not-so-good stepparents, I know there are AMAZING ones out there.
The truth is, my D7 and I both deserve better/more than what H is offering right now.
And this: Still, I have so much fear about her having a childhood that is like mine was. Again, you only have control of your piece but that's a lot to a 7 year old. I'm sure that you've already done more than your parents did. Am I right?
Let go of the fear of what her childhood will be like and do what you know you need to do.
Yes, you are right. Certainly, my sisters and I were never taken to a therapist. D7 has an awesome support system. I still have hero-worship for my dad and I know that he did the best that he could, but he recognized in retrospect (like we all do) that there were things that could have/should have been handled differently. My sisters and I witnessed entirely too many shouting matches.
I'm glad you went out and had some FUN. Yay!! You so deserve it. And congrats to D7 for being a smartypants girl!
Hey, 2 thoughts keep running thru my head when I read your post above. About how you fear he won't really truly "show up" for your d, like his dad didn't and like your mom didn't.
1) even if you stayed married, this "not showing up" might happen. I mean, he's pretty darn self absorbed NOW....
The truth is, he hasn't really ever been a consistently present parent. The more I think about it, I realize that being married to him, as he is now and as he has been for a while, just gives D7 the illusion of having two involved parents.
and
2) while this may be the last thing you want to hear right now, I have to say that a divorce at least would free you up to meet someone you know will show up for her and you.
I cannot help but believe that sometime in the future, you may come to see that in the long run, he has done you a favor....
I just really believe that you'll be better off without this type of man in your life.
Sure, he could change, & we can all pray and hope he does. But if not, I just don't know what it is you are losing in a partner.
I understand if you are not ready to hear this^^...and I'm sorry if that's the case. I don't mean to rush you out of the m at all.
Just thinking there IS a silver lining here....and in time, even if you end up just loving yourself more and living out of his shadow and Not waiting for the next shoe to drop, you'll be more than alright.
Keep on keeping on!
Regarding your second point, my mind has been there a lot over the past couple of days. Also, I get the feeling again that my sister has been calling you, or communicating to you through telepathy or something. Or, more likely, it's just so damn obvious to everyone else.
I've read your posts to a lot of people, and I don't remember seeing this much:
Originally Posted By: 25yearsmlc
I just really believe that you'll be better off without this type of man in your life.
It resonates A LOT. Which leads me to a story and my thoughts over the past couple of days.
On Friday around lunchtime, H called and we had this conversation (which will sound a lot like a conversation we had JUST had the day before:
H: When do you want to tell D7?
Me: I was thinking over the weekend so she would have lots of time with one or both of us afterwards to ask questions or do whatever she wanted to do.
H: You know I'm going camping this weekend. I told you that.
Me: Yes, you said you were thinking about going camping.
H: We could tell her Sunday when I get back.
Me: What time will you be back on Sunday? I don't think it is best for her to be told that evening and then have dinner, a bath, and bedtime and then go directly to summer camp the next morning.
H: Around 3 or 4. You and I could talk and then we can tell her.
Me: I don't think that is best for her. I think it should be earlier in the weekend.
H: Well, you can I can talk on Sunday evening and then we can tell her on Monday after camp.
Me: That still puts her in the same position as telling her on Sunday...not a whole lot of time to process.
H: Are you asking me to cancel my plans?
Me: I have no control over what you decide to do with regard to your plans. I am saying we need to figure out what will work best for D7.
H: Well, those are the two options.
Me: There are only two options? We can tell her Sunday evening or Monday evening?
H: There isn't another time. Unless you want to call and postpone her therapy appointment so we can do it the next weekend.
Me: I need time to think about this. I'll have to call you on my way home from work.
So, I called him on my way home and expressed some concerns about telling her this weekend because of her friends moving away. H agreed that it would be difficult for her. I then said that we could not continue to delay the discussion because of the kinds of questions she is asking. H said, Yeah, the questions make things feel really awkward. Oh, wait, I forgot that we were talking about how things were for H again...I thought we were talking about D7. It just struck me as a really self-centered thing for him to say. I don't care if things are awkward for me or for him. I care that we are handling things in the best way possible for our daughter.
I'm not sure why it was that comment after all the things he's said and done (or not done). Nonetheless, I find myself feeling very done. I recognize that I've only been feeling that way for about 24 hours, so it could just be another swing on the pendulum of this journey. It doesn't feel that way though. I feel pretty unemotional about it. I just don't have any respect for him. I feel sad for my D7 and I know that there are still hard parts to come. And yet, I feel optimistic for me. Does that make sense? I really can't figure out what I'd be standing for.
Along the lines of optimism, something happened on Thursday. Really, just happened in my mind, but it feels important. We hired a new guy at work. I met him a couple of weeks ago and thought, Hey, the new guy looks pretty good. Nothing earth-shattering. Though I've been married for 11 years, I've certainly found other men attractive. On Thursday, he came to my office for help with something. I found myself smiling a lot and thinking that he was really attractive. Still, not earth-shattering. I'm not ready to date. I know that. I don't even know enough about him to know if he'd be a good candidate. I also don't think it is a good idea, generally speaking, to date someone from work. BUT, it was the first time I realized that I could feel attraction/chemistry for someone who wasn't my H. I think that's a pretty big deal for me.
Yes, frequently conversations gravitate back towards them. When I mentioned the better father thing I neglected to say that my h too said " once I'm happy, they will be happy too." Nope- not exactly the way that works. I see you heard that as well.
In regards to your D, good luck. Unfortunately it's a terrible conversation to have. However, I think it's great she sees a therapist.
I can't help but mention (and I apologize as I'm feeling rather feisty today), but I'm struck the number of spouses that say perhaps we can reconcile 2 years, 5 years, or 10 years from now. I understand about 15-20% of divorced couples remarry. However, it's just so completely irrational (which shows the thought process) to assume that the LBS couldn't and wouldn't move on a live their lives. Interesting.
3 kids BD 12/15/13 (IDKIILY. ) Rope dropped Cirque du Soleil style D final 9-9-14 "Some people are born on 3rd base and go through life thinking they hit a triple." Barry Switzer
I can't help but mention (and I apologize as I'm feeling rather feisty today), but I'm struck the number of spouses that say perhaps we can reconcile 2 years, 5 years, or 10 years from now. I understand about 15-20% of divorced couples remarry. However, it's just so completely irrational (which shows the thought process) to assume that the LBS couldn't and wouldn't move on a live their lives. Interesting.
It sounds so crazy. If you think you'll likely get back together someday, why waste all this effort and emotion and time on a D? The sad thing is that I was actually pinning some of my hopes on that. Honestly, that was a fear-based and not a love-based response. I wouldn't want my D to sit around and wait for something that MIGHT happen in 2 or 5 or 10 years if her H was doing what mine is. I've now realized that I can't set that example for her.
My sister was at my house tonight. She drafted my answer to H's petition for divorce. I either have to go to the courthouse next week, or figure out how to use the state's e-filing system. A week ago, I probably would have been sobbing uncontrollably at having to draft that. Tonight, it just felt like a business transaction. After that, she and I worked on these crafty projects she wants done for my nephew's birthday party decorations. I was talking and laughing and NOT thinking about how I had just gotten a step closer to my M being dissolved.
and btw, my h ALSO said "I'd win you back if we divorced" and I think he meant it...I told him right then that I wanted to slap his face. And I did want to. For some reason it irked the he11 out of me.
And imo, if we'd kept going and ended up divorced, my best guess is we would NOT have reconciled, unless he had a really big, awakening, really quickly.
I think it's because I'd begun to move on with plans for a job change and being single (in a positive way) and I was getting happier, that I became more attractive to him, and less of the shrew he made me out to be.
Our bills were still being paid and I was tired of arguing and challenging his choices. So I released him to his "Alaskan mission".
He was alone there only a few months on the "LAST FRONTIER!"...(his words)
I knew he'd had blinders on trying to get up there as fast as he could... Then I imagined him waking up, looking around and noticing we weren't there...probably asking "where is everyone??" And how come things aren't "FANTASTIC yet"?? And that's pretty much what happened.
I know that where we were, contrasted sharply with where he was. Turns out, living on the LAST FRONTIER!!!, kinda sukks when your family is 3000 miles south of you.
I chose to present to h, the reality/image that "the children and I, were where the warmth was, figuratively and literally, and where he was, was whatever it was....." (in terms of weather and daylight, I knew where he was, was NOT warm or bright).
As for ex's remarrying... In my family, I have a cousin, and an aunt who remarried their former spouses.
But when they divorced, to my knowledge, none of the parties (4 people) "expected" that they could remarry later on. As I recall, they all thought it was OVER when they divorced.
But kids kept them bonded so they had to maintain some contact...(My guess is that if you do not have children, it's harder to reconcile, but I don't have any hard data on it).
In my cousin's case, I knew he still had a torch for his ex, but they fought too much and had some baggage. Individually they both went to counseling but did not tell the other. It was a few years before they remarried.
My aunt would see her ex h at family functions. I think SHE filed for divorce. Eventually they got pretty detached from each other, no drama... and that allowed them to become civil and then created a friendship of sorts. 5 years passed, when at one event, my uncle asked my aunt out for coffee (I think their daughter had suggested it...)
There, my uncle point blank asked my aunt "are you happier now?" She said, "Not really". They began dating and they remarried. Turns out a huge problem they'd had in their first marriage, was a horrible miscommunication/misunderstanding, (this was 30 years ago) which almost seems laughable now.
Anyhow, their second time around WAS BETTER...then 6 years later he got cancer. He died with his family at his bedside, and him feeling loved. If they had not remarried, you have to wonder how much worse it would have been for all of them, and him, to die alone or estranged. That's why I do feel pity for the future version of these WASs...
My guess is that if a WAS assumes their spouse would remain available for a reconciliation, after they make such bad choices, inflicting deep pain on their own family members, that it's NOT as likely. It's as if they've given themselves a carte blanche on wrongs...and not facing real or lasting consequences.
I see that our daughters are NOW (7-8 years later!), really giving my h a hard time for leaving..a lot of emotions and resentments are surfacing that I thought had been resolved.
At least they're being aired now, b/c if they still repressed them, I'd feel less hopeful. I resented my parents at various times but eventually felt a lot closer to them...and my h is working on repairing the damage he did. It's not easy.
In other words, we are still a work in progress and I believe nearly all marriages are. We all change, hopefully we all evolve as individuals and thus, evolve as couples. And we have our ebbs and our flows.... but we DO the work. As long as that happens I think we'll be works in progress...and not deteriorating.
Anyhow, I'm rambling. Oh, one other thing Hope, I think it's a good turning point for you to notice OM at your work.
It means that your choices are not based on the fear (or terror) of being alone, b/c at some level you now know you could someday be with another man and NOT be miserable...and that is a key concept for you to grasp now.
I'm slightly uncomfortable admitting this, but early on in our crisis, I daydreamed about OMs in general. No one I knew in real life....And when I met some actual men, kind hearted smart men, who were interested in me, it helped A LOT. But with or without a man in my life, I had gotten over the terror of being alone forever.
I knew that if I ended up divorced, it did NOT mean
I'd also end up dying under a bridge all alone, except for the wild dogs who had had been gnawing for days...
OR in an apartment with 11 cats and litter boxes, too fat to get out of my chair to bathe...
on that note, hugs to you Hope. Delay the talk with your d if you can and when your h keeps reverting to himself, "but then I/me/myself will have to change MY plans..." or "makes it awkward for ME"....
maybe you can say "h, I can't speak to what this is doing 'TO YOU' b/c I really feel as a parent, MY focus has to be on d." and make it your refrain.
If he really pushes you, and or acts clueless, you can only reach him if you are calm (if at all)
but you are allowed to say CALMLY!!, "h, as you know, your choices broke my heart and no matter how much "WE" tell ourselves 'kids are resilient', it's NOT painless for HER.... (AND OR)
"H, I need you to understand empathize with me now. B/c I feel it's very unfair for you to put your discomfort or 'awkwardness' on us, so that I/we have to comfort you for YOUR choices, which surely you know have deeply wounded me/us...I'm just not able to help you with that, b/c MY FOCUS in on our d & HER needs now...
Hope, I'm sending you thoughts and prayers and strength and LAUGHTER.
And tell your sister I totally agree with her, AGAIN!
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
25years, I wanted to let you know this post was enormously helpful to me even though it's not my thread. Thank you so much.
Hope, I'm glad you had a good time with your sister and were detached enough to do the job at hand impersonally. It was kind of her to bring you a project to follow up that bitter work you were doing.
Me42, H40 D12, S8, S7 A revealed: 7/13 Sep 4/14; Agreed to D 1/15
^^^ agreed on both counts! I'm really inspired by 25years story. Thank you for sharing so much and for taking the time to offer such thoughtful advice, 25years.
Hope, unfortunately we can't make our H be the parent we wish they would be (mine is perfectly content to give up time with his D so that he can watch the world cup...or sleep late... ); we can only work hard to be the parent WE want to be. I wonder if it is possible to look at your situation as a wonderful gift... the opportunity to be the kind of parent you wished you'd had.
We told our D today. I decided that I did not want to delay her therapy appointment. She continued to make comments that made it clear that she believed this was a temporary situation and that her expectation was that H was moving back home. I sent him a message telling him that I felt it needed to be done as early as possible so that she had lots of time to do whatever she wanted between then and bedtime. He acted as if it was a huge inconvenience and then said, "I just didn't know we'd be telling her this soon." Well, H, you filed. I can't keep avoiding her questions (which is really lying to her) because the situation is uncomfortable for you.
We told her that we loved her so much and that would never change. We told her that it wasn't her fault. As you can imagine, she didn't understand. She asked a lot of questions, like:
But, you love each other. Why would you get a divorce? Are you going to get remarried to each other later? Are you going to remarry someone else?
H said some things he shouldn't have, like, "Nothing is going to change between Mommy and Daddy." She's seven and perceptive; she doesn't buy that. He also told her that Mommy and Daddy would always be best friends no matter what. I just tried to validate her feelings of sadness and confusion. H's feelings were hurt and he felt that she was mad at him because she was leaning onto me the whole time. I think that she just knows that I'm the one who provides emotional support and so OF COURSE she wants me.
She cried for a few minutes and then said, "Can I go watch TV now?" I told her that she could. She started to walk away and then turned back to look at us and said, "Can you guys come watch with me?" H looked uncomfortable and hesitated. I immediately said, "Yes." After sitting watching the TV for about 5 minutes, H said, "OK, I love you. I'm going to go now." and gave her a kiss. I know that I'm not supposed to have expectations, but obviously I did. I found it disappointing that he couldn't stay a little longer to do what she asked us to do after she had been given such devastating news. If I indulged in mind-reading, I'd say that he felt uncomfortable with either her emotion, or his guilt, or both, and had to escape.
About 30 minutes later, our doorbell rang. D7 immediately said, "If that's my friend, can I go to her house to play?" It was her friend from across the street. I told her that she could go play, but that I needed to talk to the friend's mom first. So, I talked to the mom, who is somewhere between acquaintance and friend of mine, and told her that we had just told D7 we were getting a D (she knew we were separated since she lived across the street, but didn't know about the D). I wanted her to be aware since D7 was in an emotional place. I walked back to my house to get D7. She asked me if I told the mom that I was getting a D. I told her that I did just because I wanted her to know why you might be upset. D7 looked up at me and looked hopeful, maybe, and said, "Can I tell my friend?" I told her that she could if she wanted to do so. I don't want her to be embarrassed or ashamed about this situation over which she has no control. I walked her across the street and went in the neighbor's house. As I was talking to the mom again, I heard D7 say, "Friend, I need to tell you something. My parents are getting a D." Her friend just said, "Oh, that's ok." And then, they just started smiling and playing. I know that doesn't mean she isn't going to still have issues with this, but it felt like exactly what she needed at the time: acceptance.
D7 is still across the street playing. I'm working on reorganizing my closet, including spreading out my clothes into what was H's side.
Thanks all for your thoughts and prayers...and wishes for laughter
Hope, what strength and courage and stability you showed your D. She is lucky to have such a great support and role model. Enjoy spreading those clothes out!!
