Matt, since I recently had that convo with my kids, I would HIGHLY suggest you and W do it TOGETHER.
However, if that is not possible, I re-wrote what you posted in to how I would approach it:
""You need to know that things between your mom and I aren't getting better. I know that I told you that my dad was going to pay to send you to (school she wants to go to) but I don't think that can happen now. We both want what's best for you and may not always agree on what that is but I can tell you I will always take what you want into account. You will always be my daughter and I will always be a part of your life, you mean the world to me and your mother and that will never change. Things are going to be different and we don't know yet what is going to happen, but we will be fine. I know it's hard not knowing. For now just know that I'm here and if you have any questions or want to talk I'm always available and I promise to always tell you the truth as best as I know it.""
Personally, I do not think it is appropriate to bash/blame W in this convo, for your daughters sake and your own dignity. The truth will be known, trust me on that.
Please put the butthurt aside for this convo, show her a man who is strong, reliable in control of himself...she really needs that right now, more than you know...
Just my 2 cents.
In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus
Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm
I think this is what's best..."You need to know that things between your mom and I aren't getting better. I know that I told you that my dad was going to pay to send you to (school she wants to go to) but I don't think that can happen now. Your mom doesn't think it's as important as in the past, before high school and we just can't afford it now. [You cannot speak for your W. I wouldn't bring it up here to make her the bad guy in this. ]Your mom now wants to not only leave here and live somewhere else, she also wants to end our marriage. [Why are you going into too much detail here? Does D really need to know this info??]This doesn't mean she doesn't love you, it's not about you but about her and I. We both want what's best for you and may not always agree on what that is but I can tell you I will always take what you want into account. You will always be my daughter and I will always be a part of your life, you mean the world to me and that will never change. Things are going to be very different and we don't know yet what is going to happen, where your mom will live, where you will live [Yikes! That will terrify D in stating that you don't know where she'll live. Why would you say that to her??], how you will stay a part of both my and your mom's life. I know it's hard not knowing and I would have moved heaven and earth not to have to put you through this but sometimes there is just nothing that can be done to stop bad things from happening. [It does sound heavy and imagine how heavy D would feel hearing this line??]For now just know that I'm here and if you have any questions or want to talk I'm always available and I promise to always tell you the truth as best as I know it." [Huh? It seems to me that you're trying to present yourself as the choir boy and W as the she-Devil when it comes to "truth" telling. That is ho it came off to me in reading that comment.]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ You'd want to rethink those comments and try to think how D would feel with this type of news. You would want to keep it simple to the bare facts, that their mom is on a journey that people may not understand at all, and that you are sad about this.
Oh yes, 25, makes perfect sense. Yes, my W has bigger problems than peri-menopause, that is certain. She stated in the beginning she has no idea why she is feeling so horrible. She even used the MLC word! She hasn't been right since she was depressed. She said she was isolated and went "a little crazy" doing things with her new found friends from work. What she did was stop doing anything with me or the kids and spending all her free time with them or just doing nothing at home. She was always too tired to go do anything with us. She became over-whelmed with everything and just let everything go. Stopped cooking dinners, cleaning, never had time to talk to the kids. Every time our D's came to talk to her she would tell them she was tired and talk later. You can't do that with a teenager! This is why both D's are so angry at her. She doesn't want to remember any of this. Never happened, or now she says it was because she hated being with me so stopped doing anything with the kids but that just wasn't how she said she felt at the time.
She has become very worried that her father will die before she and him can "make things right" (told me just this many times over the last few years AND that until he is dead, there is always a chance he will change). His cancer helped push her into MLC, I'm sure. She has wanted to believe he really loved her no matter what his actions said. Now, he IS giving her attention AND support. It's like this has become the magic thing she needs to do so he will love her again. No mind reading here, I've seen him go from no contact and being awful to her to texting and calling every day! It's like she found a way to get his attention and she is feeding off it. She has even started to call his wife "mom"! This is a woman who broke up her family and she NEVER called her that before. Even now said her dad wasn't to blame for what he did, he was just too "hurt" by the divorce (a divorce he wanted so he could have his new OW!). Yes, emotional problems that are hurting me and everyone I love. One reason it's been so hard for me to just give up and say she's changed. No one in their right mind changes this much, this fast. I worry what is going to happen when her dad does die. She really lost it when he told her his cancer is back, she will be devastated! Not my problem, I know and something I need not think about now as my plate is full. Hell, at one point I thought about having an intervention with her mom's side of the family things got so weird. Glad I didn't but..... She's not evil I know that and I think her actions are evil, not her. I don't think her intent is evil. I think she does care. It's just that she cares more about finding a way to feel better and leaving her marriage is the thing she wants to try and really believes is the answer! Everyone and everything else be damned!
Read my last post to you again, please. Your wife is either not herself or she's been very sick for a long time. Stop all the focus on HER and don't blame her to your d's. They love their mom and she is THEIR role model even more than your FIL was your wife's!
Don't forget that by bashing her to your kids (which your wording was doing), you'll be setting your d's up to feel abandoned, unloved, and perhaps repeat the same thing, like their mom did. Then the cycle won't break. You have to help them by being their rock , and kids know who the rock is.
Don't do this speech without your wife there. I mean, if you HAVE to, then follow the above suggestions b/c your way hurts your girls MORE, not less.
Also Your review of your mistakes isn't as deep as I'd hoped it would be. You essentially blame your w for all of your behavior, as if she caused it all and as if you had no choice. You did have a choice. Even in the context of "walking on egg shells", you had choice and you cannot keep all this blame game going.
Besides, I'm SURE your wife would probably say something different. Can you tell us ONE thing SHE would say about you?
Dig deeper on that.
Looks as if you took the path of least resistance, and put your kids needs far behind your own need to avoid rocking the boat.
Conflict avoidance, in my opinion, leads to MORE conflict or seething resentment and ends up blowing up in our face.
But TODAY you are asking about what to tell your d's. And you have gotten some great advice to modify your proposed comments, a lot.
Please heed their advice...and GOOD LUCK.
If things with your wife have been as bad as you say, for as long, then I don't know what you fear so much about a divorce, other than financial issues...which is going downhill fast anyway, correct?
I do support your move for primary custody. From what YOU say here, your wife won't object much, will she?
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Well, I get what you are saying. The thing is she needs to know that things are changing quickly and that her mom plans on going VERY soon. She was out looking at places over the weekend! She needs to know that she will be making a choice very soon as to where she will live until this gets resolved, that is why I said that her mom is leaving. You're right about the tone with her mom but she knows my dad was going to pay for school and now that can't happen. She also knows it's what I want for her but not her mom. She also knows her mom wanted to try living on her own sometime but now she isn't content with that anymore but I guess that can wait as well.
I'd like to wait and do it together but my W just keeps putting it off. I just made an appt. for tomorrow morning with a lawyer so that begins tomorrow. I also contacted 2 others so I will try and find the best one.
I'll re-think what I'm going to say but I can't not say anything. Ugg!
Blaming your spouse, WILL drive a wedge in the relationships that you have with your Daughters....
Read T2's re-work again to see how it should be approached....
And try this..
Tell your spouse, that you are planning on talking with your Daughters at __ time, on ___ date. You feel as though it is something that you should do together.
I’d suggest that you ask your daughters to go out with you someplace else for the talk if your W is not receptive to doing this jointly. Below is a suggestion...you can change it as you see fit.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
D1 and D2, I wanted to talk to you two about Mom and I. As you may know, Mom and I are having our struggles in our marriage. We do not know what will or will not happen. Please know that Mom and I love you very, very much. That this isn’t your fault nor your responsibility at all. It is between Mom and I as adults. You need to know that there’s a lot going on with grandpa (FIL) and grandma (whatever names you use for them). That can be quite stressful to deal with and Mom is on her own journey that we may never understand fully. She needs to walk her own path. I love Mom and I know you do love Mom too.
Things are going to be different and we don't know yet what is going to happen, but we will be fine. I know it's hard not knowing. For now just know that I'm here and if you have any questions or want to talk I'm always available.
I love you both a whole bunch! [however you want to close the talk...
Tell your spouse, that you are planning on talking with your Daughters at __ time, on ___ date. You feel as though it is something that you should do together.
And if she misses that, then it is on her....
I cannot stress how important it is that YOU make the effort to have W there at the talk.
A lot is riding on this talk for your daughters dude... A LOT.
Slow down and think of how a man with class, dignity and honor would handle this...
And, if you start in on the blaming W, how are you going to feel and handle it when they DEFEND her? Hm? And they likely will, she IS there Mom after all!!!....And how are you going to look in THEIR eyes? How would you feel about that?
Caution here dude...this is showtime and there are NO do-overs...
In the depths of winter, I finally learned that within me there lay an invincible summer. - Albert Camus
Uncertainty is the very condition which impels people to unfold their powers.-Eric Fromm
Well, I get what you are saying. The thing is she needs to know that things are changing quickly and that her mom plans on going VERY soon. She was out looking at places over the weekend! She needs to know that she will be making a choice very soon as to where she will live until this gets resolved, that is why I said that her mom is leaving. You're right about the tone with her mom but she knows my dad was going to pay for school and now that can't happen. She also knows it's what I want for her but not her mom. She also knows her mom wanted to try living on her own sometime but now she isn't content with that anymore but I guess that can wait as well.
I'd like to wait and do it together but my W just keeps putting it off. I just made an appt. for tomorrow morning with a lawyer so that begins tomorrow. I also contacted 2 others so I will try and find the best one.
I'll re-think what I'm going to say but I can't not say anything. Ugg!
Not to quibble, but why can't your dad pay for the school? I mean, how is it related to your wife's choices? And how's your job search going?
I never did understand why you called your w a stay at home mom, and then say she's the breadwinner. What happened?
As for what to tell your d's, let me tell you what our family therapist said about this.
"Do NOT tell your kids you are getting divorce unless you are 100% CERTAIN that it's happening. And only when it's not in the too distant future, do you tell them and you tell them together".
NO blame at all. Never from your mouth and don't let family members bad mouth her to your daughters either.
Your daughters are not fools. They have eyes. If you have been enabling your wife to absent herself for this long, then in their eyes, you can't really blame her now. They may say "oh, NOW you blame her for leaving, b/c she's with OM or acting single, but you let her treat us badly for a long time. She left US a long time ago..."
I'd only say things like "She's confused/searching" IF & ONLY IF you are forced to say something about who wants what or about her, specifically.
Don't worry that you'll be dissed by not blaming her; it's just the opposite. Also, bad mouthing the spouse is called "parental alienation" and you can LOSE CUSTODY if you do that. (You may want your wife to know that as well)
You are modeling for your children what a man of honor and self respect and compassion, does when he faces a blow to the heart.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
