[labug]

SF, your post seems is all about what your W could do to improve the situation.

Have you done everything you can to improve you? I know you've done some self-reflection and see ways things could have been improved but is there more?

If you're done, you can always pull the trigger. Don't wait for her to do that for you.

(this from my thread)

To me some of the things above speak about love (i.e. companionship, life partner, physical connection) but maybe I am missing something from your ?. Given what I know now, I would certainly expect to be more aware of the conflict and would handle it differently.

You can have these things, companionship, life partner, physical connection and not love the person you're with. Love should never be implied. Nor should anger or pain or frustration. A relationship should be strong enough to hold all those emotions.

You're a very controlled guy, or that's the impression I get from your posting. I could be very wrong. When was the last time you were angry? I don't mean the acting out of anger, I mean you felt anger, let yourself feel it, allowed it to cool and went to the other person and said "Let's talk."

It took me a long time to learn that anger isn't the problem it's how we express it that can be the problem. It's even more of a problem when we express it by withdrawing.

How do you deal with anger and your sons?

You mentioned your parent's R and how that has shaped your fear of conflict. We all get shaped by our parent's R but once we realize that, the ball is in our court to change the negative parts of that programming. How are you doing that?

You also mentioned a time when your son found mom crying in the laundry room and you both guessed at what she was crying about but no one asked. That was very sad to me, that we sometimes see people, people we love, in distress and we just walk away.

Just being able to empathize "You're crying, is there anything I can do?" is sometimes all that's needed.

Now I get it that she might have said, "oh, nothing. I'm fine." But that's on her. She gets to decide whether she needs help but it doesn't mean the action isn't necessary or appreciated.

i don't expect you to do that at this stage of your R but it might be something to think about for the future and share with your sons. Remember, they're learning from you, just like you learned from your Dad. How do you see his role in his R with your mother?

It's taken me a long time to be able to look at my parent's R with objectivity. I use to see my Dad as the White Knight and my mom as the source of all the problems. She was what she was and he was what he was. Sometimes the quiet one looks like the hero. Not always true.