Yesterday, In the car together & between clients, I stated that I needed a coffee, would he drive up & get one. At the same time, another client called and said he was at our location. He put the client off for 1/2 hour so we could have coffee time together. During coffee time, we bickered about petty work stuff.
Later, well after client left. I went fishing for a compliment. I asked him if he liked my hair (as I changed it from usual for the day for a wedding). He said it was nice and he liked the way I looked and thats how he was able to be with me for 20 years. He appeared a little jealous that I was going to a wedding, and that I might meet someone. I said "ya, who knows". Playful. He said I might meet a little band man (he is quite tall)...(this in reference to my x-friend that I trusted who intentionally was trying to sabotage any chances for reconciliation). I went eye to eye to clarify, that I was NOT ever interested in that guy. THIS, turned into R talk.
He commented that he missed our time spent, travelling, home time, sunday car rides, coffees by the pool, etc. He missed our sex life & would love to just throw me down, etc. I said that his actions don't match his words. I also said, that ya sounds like a good time, but I want more than an f-buddy. He admitted too that sex was fun, but he wants companionship. Again, his actions don't match his words. He feels overwhelmed with work & home responsibility. That there isn't enough time at the end of the day to socialize. He would love to go sit on a patio, etc. I asked with who? He initially said "with someone". I asked specifically who? He said me or one of his 2 guy friends. (I know he is missing our fun times...so why is he doing this???) I tried to validate by knowing and understanding his responsibilities but asked can he not manage to have both (social & work life)? <<< this brings me to one of our MAJOR problems, he is envious of my social life & he feels angry that he works, while I go off and play. He points it out to me often & even though we are separated.
Several times the convo ended by natural causes, phone, washroom, off topic.... I should have let it go, but I didn't... I wanted to hear more. (Ya, I know!!)
So, I pursued. I leaned into the convo appearing eager (I am sure), I started saying things like "I don't know about him" ... He replied with "I wasn't asking". Statements like I think he needs to figure himself out & what he wants. That he should spend more time thinking. He says he does & thats how he comes up with missing us, etc., but then he gets so overwhelmed with work. He wants a lightening bolt to strike with a direction for him. Right now, priority is the state of our business and that we likely have only 2 more months at this location, which means we must work work work & sell off inventory. (this means being available at ALL times for client appts).
He then asked me to look into his eye, he had hurt it the other day and wanted me to see if there were any scratches, etc. I placed my hand on his shoulder & looked in his eyes. I think at one point he wanted to place his arm around my leg, but held back. I sat down, but noticed a funny mark on his leg and asked him about it. He was bugged by this mark along with a new white spot up near his eye. I went over to his leg, and just picked it off... it was fine. He was relieved.
At this point, I was starting to feel that I knew I was divulging too much/telling him too much of my position. Allowing him to see where I stood. I felt that if I kept going, that I could say the right thing, he will ask to reconcile.... (FOOL!!).
I just kept saying things like I don't know if he has what it takes for my needs. He said he understood what I want & he didn't know if he has it either. I said that I wanted the guy back who loved & appreciated me (the beginning of our rel'p). I said that I needed to see his actions. Again, stating that I don't know about him... and him repeating that he wasn't asking me (with confidence).
*** I am trying to make it sound pretty bad here*** I am trying to be truthful.
AT this point, a friend of his showed up & were chatting about work, etc. & how he might just show up at the wedding (to see pretty bridesmaids). I jokingly said "if you had played your cards right, that he could have come with me".
It was getting close for me to go, so hopped in my car & asked him to come speak to me. Again, I tried to reiterate that he needs to figure stuff out, and that I don't know if he doesn't know. We were then interrupted by a phone call. I left.
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I am beating myself up today. Please send gentle 2x4's & hugs...?? Please advise me where to go from here. I feel like I lost some self respect. I soooo wanted to text him back yesterday to again "clarify" my position. But my daughter and my friend stopped me. <<< this is something that I would ALWAYS do, chase back to clarify my point (bull dog), when I feel like I didn't get my point across (or get my way). So, I really twisted feeling unsettled.
Please tell me if there were *any* positives in that convo.... ???
~~~~~~~~~~~~ The wedding was fabulous. Both daughter & I looked great. Tons of food, drinks, met a new "older" couple & exchanged numbers, danced.
Magic
M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
I'm glad you enjoyed the wedding and you and your daughter looked great. Why did you seek out compliments from him? If he wants to compliment you, he will do so freely.
Why do you have this need to push/rush your situation? It's not like he's going any where fast. In fact, he's sitting right where he was last year...why can't you accept the fact that he's not going to change and the only way to change the dynamics of your situation is for you to make the changes within you and move forward. If your partner really wanted to change, he would have been doing so all along in the last 12 months.
What are you going to do? Are you going to continue sitting there waiting for him to finally say he's ready to commit? What if it never happens? What are you going to do for the next 1, 2, or even 5 years down the road...wait on him????
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
I DO keep believing his intentions without the actions...OK, so he is feeding me BS (to keep me on the hook until he knows what he wants to do and... I allow it)!!
gabby?? "I don't think I you even know how your position".... what?
One thing I realize now is that my usual behaviour of when I don't feel understood (cuz If I was understood, then I would get my way, etc), I keep trying different approaches. I do not know when or how to let it go/give up. But, I am trying!!
So, today when I went to work... I kept my mouth shut, did what needed to be done. Didn't linger. Told him that I had to run into town to meet DD for a minute, then I was heading out of town too. Not my usual, "lets talk so I can clarify myself AGAIN", position.
YES!!! I totally see that his actions are not matching his words, he is ALL talk (because he wanted to make sure "we" were ok, before I went to that wedding)..... but, what happens this week when I suspect he may try to ask me out or for companionship somehow? Wouldn't that then be "action"?...... I see how minimal it would be... so not sure how to respond "IF" it should come this week.
Like I said, I beat myself up .... so, I don't need anyone being too harsh. Gentle 2X4's are ok. I truly want to understand.
Job ~ "What are you going to do? Are you going to continue sitting there waiting for him to finally say he's ready to commit? What if it never happens? What are you going to do for the next 1, 2, or even 5 years down the road...wait on him????"
Well, I don't really feel like I am "sitting"... I am out and about all over the place. I have a busy social life. I am open to meeting new people (always have been), so not "waiting" really either.... I love him and am hopeful, but "IF" I get swept off my feet, then its his loss.
~~~~~~~~~ I am trying soooo much harder to learn and understand this stuff since my weekend away. One thing for sure, is that my dealings with xbf is like a class room for me. I make mistakes and I WANT TO LEARN... even if it means I screw it all up with him. (hopefully not).
SO PLEASE !!!! TELLL ME ALL AGAIN....I am listening!!! (although, I will re-read old posts), but if someone feels the need to be straight up with me again... here is your chance. Don't just slam me with a label. Please describe where or how I can change.
I admit, I am a relentless student/person.... it is that very persistence that makes me successful in business & through 20 years of relationship. So... please be understanding that I just need to learn when and where to apply it. I also see it as a good trait too.
M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
to add: my daughter suggests that "IF" he should request my company this coming week, time spent or a a date of some sort that I should say: that his emotions aren't consistent and that he needs to figure himself out. That his emotions aren't straight and I don't want to be with/around that.
However, my friend suggests to go out. That he can only play me for so long before it wears off and I stop buying into it. She doesn't think that he will ask again, until he is more clear of what he does want & can deliver on what I want. Eg: exclusive.
I really need to be clear and consistent of what I will accept!
I just really don't know what to believe anymore :S
M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
Magic, Your daughter and your friend have given you two different approaches, but only you will know what you want to do if the opportunity arises. However, you've already stated to him several times about how his emotions are not consistent and he needs to figure himself out. Why say it again? It's repeating yourself over and over again. Is this the type of behavior that you want to show him? Repeating yourself?
If you are not sure what to do or believe, then step back for a while. Sometimes when we try very hard to do something or even understand something, we miss the most important part of the situation. Stepping back allows things to play out at their own pace and that's when you will see the entire picture and not miss anything.
Have you been clear and honest w/him on what you will accept? Because it appears that you and your partner are still going round and round on the same subjects and are still stuck in the muck.
I admit, I am a relentless student/person.... it is that very persistence that makes me successful in business & through 20 years of relationship.
I have read where you describe yourself as relentless and compare yourself to a bulldog. You seem to take pride in it, however, I would like to suggest that this could be a place to start change. You see Magic, those traits are not attractive to a lot of people, especially when it's the female being renlentless. A lot of men see a relentless female as a NAG!! Do you know what men do when women nag? They shut you out! They do not see us being attractive or lovable when we are acting like a bulldog. Ugh, why would they want to get close with that?
Have you looked at the definition of the word relentless, it is not faltering. In one place it even says it's persecuting. Maybe he feels like you are persecuting him.
You say this has helped make you successful in business. Do you mean that you won't take no for an answer, or that you hound (another dog btw) your customers? Neither are seen as a feminine quality most people admire.
I wonder if you mean that you don't give up easily when things get tough? B/c applied in the correct way, this trait is necessary to maintain a successful 20 YR relationship and in business. However, I believe you should seriously stop being relentless in trying to pressurize your XBF to reconcile the R. By now, you surely see it's not working. Or do you? It's hard to see ourselves as others can.
I'm sure you are physically attractive, and based on what your XBF said, I think it is the physical attraction that held him in the R so long. However, you are wanting that connection with him that goes deeper than just looks.
Like a lot of people, you try to fix things by talking. You feel that if you don't get your way it is b/c you were not understood? Seriously? Did your parents spoil you that badly? If so, you must break out of it ASAP b/c nobody .........and I mean NOBODY likes being around a spoiled brat. How do you break yourself? By realizing there are several times (daily for most of us) where you don't get your way. You have to accept "no" in most cases (and I won't refer to business operations). It is up to you to decide if it is personal rejection or not, and even if it is......it is up to you how to respond. But don't keep chewing and nagging, thinking "surely I was not understood or I would have gotten what I wanted". You only dig your grave deeper with your mouth.
People who feel a need to please or to justify their actions also try to talk their way through to reach the OP and hopefully change minds. But if I could save a few heartaches, I would tell you that my experience has been that most people have predetermined ideas and will think how they want to think. No amount of clarifying ourselves will change things. The only thing to stand any chance is our actions. In time, we prove ourselves out.......good or bad. But it is still up to the OP make their own decisions, and it may or may not be in our favor. It is not our job to change their mind.
If you keep your mouth shut and come across as mad, cold, pouting, punitive, etc., b/c you didn't get your way........you are digging that grave again. And sweetie, I know b/c I have been guilty. But I have learned I am the one who suffers in the long run of things. However, showing a pleasant and sweeter side has much more positive results. Oh you may not get what you wanted the day before (I don't mean that kind of results), but working toward the bigger picture. Make sense? When you stay consistent with those actions, he and others will notice Magic is starting to change.
The next thing I suggest you start ASAP is to not engage in bickering. It is not attractive! Even if you enjoy it, it is not healthy on any R. Bickering is comparable to nagging. One man said it felt like being nibbled to death by a duck!
I hope you won't say, "But that's just the way I am.". B/c when a person says that, I know they have no intentions of trying to change for the better. Habits may be difficult to break, but certainly not Impossible.
You want to know what to do if he asks you out next week. Do what you want, as long as you think you can control your mouth. B/c your mouth is your biggest trouble. You don't know when to shut up and let it go. I'm surprised he hasn't told you to give it a rest!
You pressure him by being relentless and it's not working. Are you willing to stop being relentless? Yes or no?
Stop being relentless with XBF Stop bickering No punitive actions
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
GM~ For the 1,000,001th time... I went another round with him yesterday. However, I got to a point... told him I was tired of circular convo's that lead back to nowhere. It lead back to him saying "i dunno".
Job ~ Have you been clear and honest w/him on what you will accept? Because it appears that you and your partner are still going round and round on the same subjects and are still stuck in the muck.
^^^^^^ and because of that statement, I took it to the limit and laid it all on the line for him last night. I told him that I am tired of our convo's that end up in the same place. I told him that I want the opportunity to "try" again. That we are worth it, etc. He felt pressured. He is interested in casual dating. I told him that I wanted commitment. He wanted time to think, so I said take a few days. I will respect and accept his decision. I told him I am not an option, but a choice. He didn't understand that comment. Said I was too "dr. phil". I told him that its a "decision" that he wants to work on us. He was anxious to leave the convo. Even admitting that he was not receptive and responsive at the moment. I told him that I was wanting to kiss him. To see where that took us. As we have been getting along, He said he wondered the same often, as well. He is really just wanting fun.
Yes... I was pushy. I don't want it to be viewed as pressurizing, but of "asking".
I called him on the phone moments after we left and said that I was hoping he could see this as an opportunity for us and asked if a few days was enough time. He said NO. I clarified that I did not mean 1-2 days. He was rushing. Then told him to enjoy his dinner with a friend.
Later in the evening... he texted me a business joke & thanked me earlier for the massage on his arm (earlier that day). He also said "sorry about the conversation" cheers.
I replied: Thats funny. Your welcome for the massage. I know you need your time, take it... but I am struggling with this right now and I don't know how much time I can give you. Hugs.
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I really hope I am finally at the end of my rope. Dropping the rope here. Letting go.
My friend pointed out that he wants to have me on HIS terms (casual dating), that Is ultimately not enough for me. I will want more!
I really need to dig deep and find my strength. To really hold out for what I want. Raise my bar!!
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Sandi.... WOW !!! Thank you. Yes.. I am relentless and its ugly! (for the most part). In business it works (not as pushy, but with determination), same as within my relationship (he saw it as attractive). Not giving up! ... I am not proud of the rest.
However, I am at the end here... "stop being relentless in trying to pressurize your XBF to reconcile the R. By now, you surely see it's not working. Or do you?" I do now.
I asked him last night if he only viewed his interest in me as attraction, he admitted that it is there for him but that he does want more as well.
When you state "People who feel a need to please or to justify their actions also try to talk their way through to reach the OP and hopefully change minds. But if I could save a few heartaches, I would tell you that my experience has been that most people have predetermined ideas and will think how they want to think. No amount of clarifying ourselves will change things. The only thing to stand any chance is our actions. In time, we prove ourselves out.......good or bad. But it is still up to the OP make their own decisions, and it may or may not be in our favor. It is not our job to change their mind."
..... this is how I feel... that I can talk my way to hopefully change their mind. I try to clarify over and over...and don't seem to be able to let go. I am really working on this!!!
As for bickering... I used to believe that a good "argument" was good. A debate to be challenged. Some people like a good debate. However, I have no use for that anymore... I would much rather be happy than right.
Now that I feel I have been clear and authentic with him (I was always too scared for him to know the truth about my position, feared that he would take advantage & see me as a pathetic sap, just waiting for him)... now I don't care. Yes, I love him and want the chance to reconcile.... but, its an opportunity that is on the table today... not forever. I don't know what date opportunities I will accept. Knowing that he just wants "fun" and I want commitment.
I will not be relentless anymore with dbf I will not bicker I will not use actions to punish
I will let go. He is currently selfish and confused. He wants to have me his way. He is baiting me constantly. I keep hoping that he is ready & he is not. I do not want to continue to keep disappointing myself & be hurt over and over... I will let go.
I keep hearing Starsky state "why would he want to commit, if I keep accepting mere cookies??"... TX Starsky!
M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
I told him that I do not want to keep going with the unknown lingering. He said he will tell me... I asked how I will know when he is giving me his "answer"... he said he will be clear with his words. <<< this is a relief, as now I won't have to guess... he will be clear with his words.
He also mentioned he wants to help me get into a house. Suggesting again that he may partner financially with a house purchase. <<<< what is the point in that if we are not in a relationship?
M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
He also mentioned he wants to help me get into a house. Suggesting again that he may partner financially with a house purchase. <<<< what is the point in that if we are not in a relationship?
Magic, that is a very good question. Is it to keep one foot in the door and the other outside? Is it a way to ensure that you remain right where you are so that you are a convenience to him, i.e., when he wants you? If your financial situation w/the business hasn't been settled up and you are not put on paper as a partner, then who is to say that you won't be in the same position w/a house purchase?
These are questions that you will need to think about. Are you willing to gamble on the what ifs? You are the prize and shouldn't have to be an "option".
Continue leaving the rope on the ground and now it's time for your words to meet your actions as well. Leave him be to mull over what you have stated and do not say another word to him about it. Give him the time he needs and continue moving forward w/your life.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Are you sure that I don't need to clarify that I was asking him a question, that requires a response? Here comes "SPIKE" wondering if I was heard???
onward....
M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
