Suckerpunch, the final thread

[PatientMan]

I spoke with My attorney today. W's attorney is asking for even MORE financial records. During our conversation, my attorney pointed out that W not working was going to reflect on my support costs. I guess I will have to help fund her goodtimes, while I bust my donuts to pay my bills. Actually no, I am "trying" to pay my bills. I am falling farther behind every month. I took on an extra side job this weekend to pay for daughters dentist visit this week. It just infuriates me to no end! So wrong to me that she can choose to have her sugar daddy pay her way, not work, play like she's 19 years old with a brand new American Express card and have ZERO accountability for supporting herself of daughter. It just erks me! JUST F'IN ERRRRKS ME!

Healing and growing and all that other stuff aside, this would pis$ me off too. I can see why you're so ticked.

Think about whether your ^^words are helpful. It's one thing to "validate" but a whole other thing to enable someone to stay stuck. Why? B/C it projects your experience? Like I said, just think out the likely Impact of your words.


This isn't some benign person who can be detached from emotionally and then won't have an effect on suckerpunch's life.


WELL THEN HE SHOULD GIVE UP, AND ALWAYS BE ANGRY AND STAY ATTACHED TO HOW SHE REACTS,

B/C ONLY HER REACTION DETERMINES WHETHER HE CAN LET GO AND BE HAPPY


She is actively engaging in a lifestyle that affects his take-home pay...his ability to provide for his family. She's gaming the system while he's busting his as$.

Wow, I think you two like spinning in place. SHE LEFT him b/c she was miserable. YES SP still argues his case, still feigns "accountability" by saying he "takes responsibility" for his mistakes. But that is not true.

He isn't responsible in any meaningful way. What's it even mean to say SP "owns" his problems?

HE blames her every chance he gets. Within a sentence or two of claiming to own his stuff, he always then tells us "BUT she.."...which negates the insight he just pretended to have, and shows us that on HIS scorecard, she is and will always be behind him. He's still "winning."

B/C in SP's mind, truly, no matter how belittling or carping or argumentative, HE ever was, or how often she asked him to be kinder (in so many words)
no matter how withholding he was of positive comments and no matter how often he criticized her,

HE did not want to be left, and therefore she was wrong to leave...Period...and SP, fyi, YOU say HER flaws every time you first mention "accountability" on your end...

So, I really don't get PM's comments about the good times You are "funding" for your w...what settlement is there that calls for that?

Oh wait, you are mischaracterizing her request. Who Does that help?

She left SP b/c in her mind, SP was not a h who treated her well enough for her to stay. So she left, but SP stayed in the family home. He still lives and works where he lived and worked before, and SP does have his daughter a few days a week. So, where should his w live...where? With OM? That might seem like a snappy little answer, but it's just a bad idea. I think that is the effect of cutting her off, assuming you could make that happen.

PM< What "should" she get from him, ANYTHING? Be honest. You want her to get nothing. And that attitude keeps you stuck and sometimes it is contagious and keeps others stuck.


I really don't see much difference in what she's doing and the dead-beat dads who don't pay child support or work under the table to avoid making payments. And I don't normally hear anyone tell those women to let it go.


What??
She has not been ordered to pay anything to SP, and she was a stay at home mom WITH her d. What is she failing to pay?

Dead beat dads rarely see their kids, which is NOT applicable here, they disappear from their kids' lives, and they don't send in the court ordered amount (about half of men do not pay what is ordered). With non payment cn come the IRS hassles and AGs offices with their garnishing of wages)

and Dead Beat dads always always always assume they pay too much, of course,

AND that every cent they send to their child is actually going ONLY to their evil former spouses...there are men on this site who wanted to measure and deduct his ex wife's shard of the utilities so she could "not benefit in any way" as it her indirect "benefit" is costing him more...

and as if it compensates for the many changes she is making thanks to his checking out of the marriage (unofficially of course, b/c only she gets blame for the m ending)...

SP's wife is not hiding income that I know of...she is not earning LESS than she was before when they were together. I recall her being mostly a SA Home mom, (and not earning what we ought to earn) So I don't think the two situations are alike.

In case you think I only say that b/c SP is male and she's female... I will say that any parent who earns more than the other parent SHOULD pay more CS b/c they have more and it's their kids who should benefit, not some strangers.
And any parent who is supposed to pay something and does not, and or does not see their child at the appointed times, is a dead beat.

I'm not biased against men here, but I think you are too quick to find a sexist line here. I'm being fair but I see SPs situation a lot differently.



It's WRONG. Just because she's been doing it for a year doesn't mean it isn't WRONG.

Who, exactly, said she is doing something right? And if she is wrong, SO WHAT? You think barking it out and declaring it (why not say it 20584 times?)
It has the same effect if you stomp your feet. Which is to say you are saying things that you feel, which do no one any good, and declaring something to be "WRONG" does not convince anyone. They either already agree with you or they think your spouse had a reason for leaving, as did SPs wife, so none of those comments help.

I hope this gives you (and SP) some food for thought. I'm looking for progress so that SP is not talking the way you are, b/c that is where he was a year ago.

Enough with the stage 1 anger...declaring "right from wrong", like that never makes the WAS change their mind. It just doesn't work. It does keep the LBSer angry and stuck and Not attractive to her ex.

stating what SP thought a year ago, still believes but knows how utterly counter productive it is to point out, only to have you come here and repeat it.

This just fuels his anger which has paralyzed him at times, and set him back at other times.

I am so glad to not be in a situation like this. suckerpunch, your lawyer says there's nothing to be done? She can just reduce her income, live off of her boyfriend, and force you to pay more $?

Is that how the system seriously works?

-PM

]]\\\

NO PM that is not what happened in SPs situation, nor is it about to happen and NO it's not how our system works. SP is not objective at all.

PM, go see a L. Get some good facts and real information or you will let a helpless form of victimhood and bitterness ("they're all against us") take over your life.

I hear fear and victimhood throughout your post to SP, which is not super helpful. But I urge you not to follow your fears, both of you.

PM, talk to your L and do NOT jump back into your victim role, please. Same for you, PM.

Good luck. Be the men you were meant to become.

Don't let your past mistakes do anything to your day now, except to incorporate the lessons learned and

keep your eye on the future you are creating for yourself and your children.

Be men that only a fool would leave.

I don't need to see a L - it isn't applicable to my sitch. I'm also not going to see a lawyer to verify if an anonymous poster on an internet message board who lives in an undisclosed location is telling the truth about his legal situation - I'm just going to take him at his word.

I won't pick apart the rest of your post and argue with you - I respect you too much for that. What I am reading throughout suckerpunch's sitch is that she is gaming the system to make him pay more in child support, so I can see how that would upset him. I've never met him, but that's what buddies do for each other - say it's okay to be angry, then let's deal with it and move forward...focus on what you CAN control.

I see the exact same advice in other threads and I don't see anyone jumping to say that's bad advice. I don't understand the double standard.

Should he be farther along in his moving forward? Who are we to judge? It may have been a year ago that his process started, but he is still actively going through the process RIGHT NOW, as I understand it. It didn't happen a year ago, is over, and he hasn't let go; he's going through it now and that can be emotional. Isn't this a place where people can come to vent? I see that being okay in other threads as well. Not sure why it isn't okay for suckerpunch.

FWIW, I don't want her to get nothing, I want her to get what's fair. And if she's gaming the system, that isn't fair, and I understand his frustration.

My sitch is nothing like that, and I'm very thankful for that.

-PM

[AnotherStander]

SP, hang in there, we're all pulling for you 25's truth darts can really pierce sometimes, even when I read her posts in other threads I can't help but feel like a couple of them hit a target on me too I need 25's gut-checks now and then even when they're not directed at me, because I do fall into the trap of laying blame for everything on my W as if I had no part in it. It's because she's in menopause, it's because she's on A/D's, it's because she's just gone batpoop crazy. Those sound a lot more appetizing then saying it's because I did something wrong in the M. But I did, and I have to own that. I can't own what she did wrong in the M, so there's no use focusing on that. Because this journey isn't about her, it's about ME. How can I be better? How can I learn from the mistakes I've made? How can I move forward? The questions we ask and the blame we lay has to be "I" focused and not include "she" or "her" or, even worse, "but". Not because our spouses didn't do anything wrong, of course they did. But what they did wrong is for THEM to own. Focusing on what they did wrong just keeps us from placing the focus where we need to- on ourselves.

[swoop]

25, I appreciate your input so much. I cannot stress that enough. You have a way of targeting my flaws and pointing them out. Some of them you hit, RIGHT on the head. You are correct on some many things, and like usual, it has opened my eyes. Your words are always very clear and usually very on target. I do want to point out a few things that I feel there is some confusion about. I know you hate this and feel that I am arguing. I see it differently, simply because facts were stated that are not exactly accurate, and I want to set that straight.

First, W was not a STAHM, not exactly. She ran a childcare business in our home. The reason we chose this was, after the birth of our daughter, W wanted to be close to her. Prior to the birth of our daughter, W managed a cosmetics business. She brought home a pretty decent wage and benefits package. After the birth of our daughter, she took one year off to be with her exclusively. The following year, we both decided it would be best if she could spend time with daughter, but acknowledged that we could not do without the extra income. The childcare business was started and brought in roughly $2,500 of net income every month. W did the majority of the work, but I had a 4 hour window in the middle of the day that I was off work, so I assisted her on a daily basis with the kids or chores. Shortly before BD, W decided to change her direction. She no longer wanted to have her childcare business, partly because Daughter was now in school full time. After BD, W got licensed as an insurance agent, and now "CHOOSES" to work 12 hours a week. She has been doing this for well over a year with no effort towards increasing her income. She nets roughly $500 a month. You can draw a conclusion to what her intentions are yourself.

The second thing I want to point out is that I did have a counselor. I actually had two counselors, a marriage counselor and an independent counselor. I also spoke with a pastor from my church regarding my situation. I joined a small group, albeit religion based, it focuses on life skills, as well as Christ. That has been very helpful to my growth. During this process, I came here, which was also very helpful and continues to be helpful in my growth. I attended a one day parenting class, which was required by my state in order for a dissolution of marriage. I paid attention, and I did come away with a lot from that class. I have read several books, something I have NEVER done previously in my life. A few of them I have read multiple times to fully comprehend the messages. My point is, I am not simply wishing on a prayer and spouting off without putting in the work. I am working on myself, and I am continuing to grow.

I just wanted to clear these things up, incase there was any confusion.

[25yearsmlc]

SP, hang in there, we're all pulling for you 25's truth darts can really pierce sometimes, even when I read her posts in other threads I can't help but feel like a couple of them hit a target on me too I need 25's gut-checks now and then even when they're not directed at me, because I do fall into the trap of laying blame for everything on my W as if I had no part in it. It's because she's in menopause, it's because she's on A/D's, it's because she's just gone batpoop crazy. Those sound a lot more appetizing then saying it's because I did something wrong in the M. But I did, and I have to own that. I can't own what she did wrong in the M, so there's no use focusing on that. Because this journey isn't about her, it's about ME. How can I be better? How can I learn from the mistakes I've made? How can I move forward? The questions we ask and the blame we lay has to be "I" focused and not include "she" or "her" or, even worse, "but". Not because our spouses didn't do anything wrong, of course they did. But what they did wrong is for THEM to own. Focusing on what they did wrong just keeps us from placing the focus where we need to- on ourselves.

AS, what are you, some freak genius author who read my mind?

Thanks for putting it into words some may find easier to read than mine.

[25yearsmlc]

25, I appreciate your input so much. I cannot stress that enough. You have a way of targeting my flaws and pointing them out. Some of them you hit, RIGHT on the head. You are correct on some many things, and like usual, it has opened my eyes. Your words are always very clear and usually very on target. I do want to point out a few things that I feel there is some confusion about. I know you hate this and feel that I am arguing. I see it differently, simply because facts were stated that are not exactly accurate, and I want to set that straight.

First, W was not a STAHM, not exactly. She ran a childcare business in our home. The reason we chose this was, after the birth of our daughter, W wanted to be close to her.


That's SO much harder, but good for her! (I can't tell if you realize how you sound to me about her day care. My mom had one. It's freaking exhausting! You don't sound impressed at all; you sound mildly resentful or envious of her...and

I assume you also wanted her home with the baby, AND to earn money, so this was a win win, right? So you are grateful to her, right?

And My point remains, she was with your daughter from birth, til...when?

And fyi, I've done all three, = the working mom (which I had assumed would be IT for me b/c I was very career oriented) and the stay at home mom (way harder, no one thanks you on the outside, they often put it down and then there are the jealous women who feel threatened if you stay at home and they have to work.

AND I've tried part timing at both.

FYI*** I had NOT expected to be so moved by motherhood. My mom seemed like a slave to me, as my dad was a workaholic and mom had NINE kids...so for ME to say that I expected to work full time as a mom is exactly what ALL of my family and friends assumed I would do.
But-- I found it enthralling & demanding. And my career seemed much less important.

But h was in medical school, so, like your w, I did not have a choice about working.

My point here is that I DID NOT KNOW BEFORE HAND that I'd want to stay at home...

I'd hate it if someone resented me for staying at home. It is NOT easy to be a stay at home mom. IT's the hardest of the three, imo. But I figured the one regret I did not want to have a mother, ever, was too little time with my kids. And I had some of that regret with our first 2.

When I first stayed home, I was still in law school so I just finished law school at night & thus, I was with him in the day, til he was 9 months old)

Here is what I noticed SP...when I stayed at home officially with our 3rd, (which h agreed to ahead of time!)...eventually H resented it, even though his pay had more than doubled between the birth of our 2nd and our last one (8 years had passed too). We did not "need" the income in my opinion.

And the more he worked, the more I felt the need to stay home. And with me at home, I think he felt the need to work more. It's a weird circular thing but I'm told we're not the first couple this happened to.

As a working mom, there is always some guilt at home b/c you are not home enough, and your inlaws rarely truly approve of your child rearing, especially if you are on your own (and the sad screaming that a toddler does when you drop them off before work, is no way to start every workday of your life)

and there is guilt at work b/c you know the single folks and the married MEN get to stay late...& bill more hours, look better to the partners, etc....

and trying to do part time of either, still pulls you in every direction. And it pulls you hard.

I think a woman who can stay & wants to stay at home with her child, and who has a h who is supportive and grateful for that, will end up a lot happier.

And if she thanks the h for making this arrangement possible, and he thanks her for giving up some career steps for their child, and they both mean it, I bet their chances of staying married are so much higher.

And in that scenario, no one is measuring, or if they are, they are using tools of gratitude to THANK the other for their sacrifice without pointing out their own.

But I digress...and just thought I'd toss that out for thought or discussion.


Prior to the birth of our daughter, W managed a cosmetics business. She brought home a pretty decent wage and benefits package. After the birth of our daughter, she took one year off to be with her exclusively.

You do know how exhausting a newborn is, right?? Think back, b/c it is easy to forget in our haze...

Regardless, she probably got up 3-5 times a night, every night, for a few years until it got down to one waking, etc. Knowing how fuzzy that first year is, I can only say it'ss amazing she did it and remembers it!

I assume you gave her a lot of breaks at night b/c the birth of a child is under rated as a physical event. IT's a HUGE ORDEAL to go thru.

When you mentiond that she stayed at home the first year "caring for your d exclusively" you say it almost in a way that makes sure I did not assume she cared for another child WHILE caring for her newborn. To which I would say "thank God." A baby under a year is an infant.

If your w had started a daycare then, with a newborn, I'd have said she's crazy. First off, I think it's probably a dangerous and second, it's utterly exhausting to have a baby that age at all, let alone to care for others...
(I'd have chosen a library or bookstore job just for the quiet...)

SP, are you at all happy she had that year with your d? Do you see the value of that? Have you ever thanked your w for it?

Your situation is not that rare.

But whereas SOME women might "game" the system, I can't see how you can argue that with your w.

Oh sure, If she had quit a 6 figure job, you could argue it. But it's not as if she has made any real money in the insurance business and is it all cold calls or what?

I mean, is she AT WORK somewhere? B/C if she is starting up a business, it is not easy to have 40 paying hours a week.

Sure, with her income being lower, it "helps" her with the settlement BUT also it hurts her now, b/c she has less money. You get that, right?

Do you agree with PM's assessment that she is "gaming" the system and holding out for a lot more from you? What more is there? And she can do this, I assume, b/c the OM makes a lot?

At any rate, I do NOT buy the assumption PM made about how "the system works" this way.

It does not work that way.

Assuming your w is "gaming" the system, she would not be the first. But most do not get away with it. Because

Courts have seen this before, and the Court will impute income to her. The court will argue that she CAN make "X" amount and they will simply factor it in as counted, unless she comes forward with proof of less AND a reason for it AND the court may still say "Okay, we'll give you 3-6 months and THEN we'll impute X income", from a full time job. Problem solved.

That's what your L can do for you. They can take her present income, and Compare her prior income, to income other insurance agents who work full time make, and come up with a number between these...and deduct costs of child care for your d, and any other expenses that go Up for this...

it's how the court handles those the Court believes are "purposely under earning income" which is a known phenomenon in this country. Truth be told, men do it more often but they earn more, usually. So I guess their motivation is higher normally.

I knew a man who said he turned down a full time teaching job b/c "then the b-- would benefit", meaning his ex w...Never mind that HE and HIS KIDS would also benefit,...

His priorities were punish the ex first, reward himself second (but Not if it helped his w in any way, direct or indirectly), the family third, (or fifth, etc...) I mean, Talk about cutting your nose to spite your face. And he was not the only client like that. So sad and so frequent.

Back to you, SP...

Does her OM make a lot? Do YOU believe your w will be satisfied with HER earnings for long? If not, why not? So will she go out and earn more then?

I mean, you said yourself that you don't make a lot of money and it's all tied up in "family business" matters. So You won't be paying her any alimony, or if so, not very much, AND Not for very long b/c your m was less than 10 years, correct?

So Financially speaking, SP, what do you see as the the worst (worst but realistic) case scenario?

I think the worst case scenario would be that the court believes what she is earning now is all she could ever earn, (a leap)

AND you are hiding assets b/c your family's home was your home and blah blah blah, (overly complicated arithmetic and another leap)

and therefore you must pay her...X amount for...half the length of the marriage or til she remarried, whichever is first...?? IS that about it?

So a lot of things have to go wrong AND even then, it would still only be temporary and even then, still manageable,

AND EVEN THEN, if you lost your job OR if her income went up a lot OR she married OM, you could modify the agreement...

That is a lot of trouble to borrow from the future and complain about it now. Why do you?

Let her earn peanuts b/c unless OM is well off, you must realize at some point SHE will want and need more money. And she can earn it, right? You are here making that very case so if it is true, then she will earn more and you won't have a problem with paying her b/c she won't need it.

And if the OM is well off, as easy as it is to resent him for that, it could make your life easier in some ways.

The new way of looking at things for you is to turn it in the light and see AND SAY the good side of it out loud. Seriously, try it. The bad side is the obvious one and does NOT need saying...not nearly as much as you may think. WE see the downsides...we get it.

The challenge in life and for you especially (only b/c it shows here but also b/c you admit that your family tends to be negatively programmed).

MANY people are that way and don't know how not to be, and many think it somehow prepares them for life better. But it does NOT and that belief, that being negative somehow offers us protection in life, makes us "realists", is a LIE we tell ourselves, so we can be "right".

But Being negative just makes US & those around us, more negative. Period.

It also sometimes brings about the very things we most fear!

(E.G., when a h or w is being paranoid that the spouse wants to cheat, and then commenting on it a lot and asking for reassurances that are not reasonable, CAN drive a spouse to OP...even a spouse that might not ever have thought of it, and in that situation the very thing the person feared most, they brought about. That's merely one example.)

So tell us the good news about your marital history. See it in a way that flatters both of you...just as an exercise.



The following year, we both decided it would be best if she could spend time with daughter, but acknowledged that we could not do without the extra income. The childcare business was started and brought in roughly $2,500 of net income every month. W did the majority of the work, but I had a 4 hour window in the middle of the day that I was off work, so I assisted her on a daily basis with the kids or chores.


Shortly before BD, W decided to change her direction. She no longer wanted to have her childcare business, partly because Daughter was now in school full time.

Makes sense to me. Having your own chlild there is the one thing you cannot duplicate at other jobs. If her d isn't there, then I can totally see why she'd end the childcare.

Plus, if she was wondering about why she was so unhappy, it's good she looked elsewhere to see what changes she could make in her life to help.

After BD, W got licensed as an insurance agent, and now "CHOOSES" to work 12 hours a week. She has been doing this for well over a year with no effort towards increasing her income. She nets roughly $500 a month. You can draw a conclusion to what her intentions are yourself.

I "draw the conclusion" that she is either very inexpensive to care for, or her OM pays for a lot of things. And why is that bad? Would you prefer supporting HIM or that she ask you for money or what?

Honestly, aside from basic hurt feelings, I don't get what your complaint is, HERE on this^^ statement...


The second thing I want to point out is that I did have a counselor. I actually had two counselors, a marriage counselor and an independent counselor. I also spoke with a pastor from my church regarding my situation. I joined a small group, albeit religion based, it focuses on life skills, as well as Christ. That has been very helpful to my growth.

This ^^ is news to me. Keep it up. I thought you just said you don't have a IC and that you no longer speak to your pastor.

Also, I find that SOME pastors advise the LBSer on how wrong the WAS is, which is not that helpful....it's more of telling them that they LBSer is "Right" and the WAS is "Wrong" and then what?

Is there a reason you stopped seeing the ICs? Did you feel they helped or not?




During this process, I came here, which was also very helpful and continues to be helpful in my growth. I attended a one day parenting class, which was required by my state in order for a dissolution of marriage. I paid attention, and I did come away with a lot from that class. I have read several books, something I have NEVER done previously in my life.

meaning, what? You never read those types of books or you are not a book guy?


A few of them I have read multiple times to fully comprehend the messages. My point is, I am not simply wishing on a prayer and spouting off without putting in the work. I am working on myself, and I am continuing to grow.

I just wanted to clear these things up, incase there was any confusion.

well there was confusion b/c I didn't know you were doing those things and b/c some of what you say recently sounds like what you said before. Backslide??

But I appreciate that you are making efforts. I do. It's your life and you only get one. Do what it takes to make yourself happy. Over time, the efforts made now will yield huge dividends.

[swoop]

Wow, huge info, 25. Thank you so much for sharing your own sitch, as well as helping me along the road with mine!

So, where to start. First, I want to express that I was extremely happy and appreciative that W was able to spend the first year with D. That was huge! I was also very very happy that she was able to transition herself into an at home child care business. We really were reaping the benefits of both sides, in regards to work and raising our child. With my occupation, I have a LOT of at home time as well. Rest assured, I put in a good deal of effort in raising o9ur daughter and helping with the childcare business. It was not solely W's responsibility. Our little family spent a great deal of time together on a daily basis. For me, it was grand. For W, I feel she didn't feel fulfilled. She complained a lot about kids driving her crazy, not having enough adult time, that the parents were unappreciative of the effort she put in, etc. To be honest, my W really liked to complain. She complained about me. She complained about her friendships. She complained about her family, my family, pretty much everything. I don't feel that was because she was unhappy. I think that was imply the way she was, much in the same way I have/had my own issues.

In regards to her working the system, I whole heartedly agree with AS. I think that she is. Actually, not only do I feel she is working the system, but I also feel she is working OM. With her income, she does not have enough to make the car payment on her European SUV, or her unlimited Cell phone plan, Let alone feeding and taking care of our child. I don't think I have seen her in the same outfit twice, in the past year. I know that OM must be paying for an awful lot. I am basing that on the fact that they just got home from a Mexican vacation. They also visited Arizona and Nevada. W recently informed D that she is getting a new motorcycle for D to race on OM racing team. About 3 months ago, she bought D a racing BMX bike. The list of luxuries is long. She is living WAY, WAY beyond her means, and OM is picking up the bill. I feel bad for him, because he recently sold his own mothers house. She has advanced dementia and lives with OM. He is spending the money from the house sale faster than a popper on payday! OM himself has a fairly small means of income. He is a 48 year old carpet layer, who doesn't have a business license. It is still a down market here too, so it seems that he works about the same amount of hours a week as W does, meaning very little. I know that recently he applied for financial aid so that he could go to a trade school. He is now a full time student, I guess.

Wifes finances concern me for two reasons. One, I feel strongly that she is choosing not to work, in hopes of getting a higher child support payment, and possibly alimony money. I also worry about her finances, because she has painted herself, and more importantly my daughter, into a position of relying heavily on assistance from OM. What she chooses to do for herself is fine, but I don't like the idea that Daughter may be stuck in a household, or a relationship that becomes unhappy or unhealthy, simply because W doesn't make enough to leave the situation. Those are huge concerns of mine, and I think they are very valid.

in regards to W's work. She works at a firm. She was given the job by a friend of hers who owns the firm. Her original job was to work 12 hours a week, filing and processing paperwork. Then, the friend offered to pay for W to get her license. She followed through, but still chooses to work that original 12 hours a week, with no effort to advance (much) with a client base of her own. She refuses to cold call, which is almost essential to move yourself forward in that industry. It has literally been well over a year, and she earns $500 a month.

[swoop]

Books....well, books and me don't get along good...haha

I have always been a horrible reader. I read slowly, and my comprehension isn't the greatest. I really have to make an effort to read a book from cover to cover and be able to remember/understand it.

I probably should seek out another IC. I was somewhat unhappy with my last one. Granted, she did help me see a few of my flaws, but overall I felt the experience was only a little beneficial for my growth. In retrospect, that counselor probably wasn't a good match for me. I got much more from speaking with my pastor. I understand what you are saying about a pastor being more of a support base to make the WAS seem wrong. However, this counselor is not at all like that. He is very solution based and is well known in this area for his work with helping troubled marriages. He is truly a great guy, and I gained a lot from him.

[swoop]

A lot has transpired in the last month. I have a court meeting next week in regards to our parenting plan. That caused a little bit of tension with W, but it was manageable. W also contacted me to ask about doing mediation. I think she is ready for this all to be over. She is now fully involved in an open and loving relationship with OM. W's family has accepted him, friends, acquaintances, etc. have as well. They are now a couple, and our marriage has magically been forgotten. So, I figure it is about darn time I get a clue and really move on. It hurts. I am sad about it. I have anger. I don't think it's fair to daughter or myself, but it is what it is. I accept that. Sometimes, life just sucxs. The good thing is, now I have all these news tools and insights about myself. I have a better understanding of the role I played in the demise of my first marriage. I am now in a better position to do it right the next time, which is a good thing. I am coming out of this as a better person and potentially a better husband, if that role every presents itself in my life again. I will stay focused on the positives. There are still a lot of positive in my sitch, and I am aware of them.

Tonight, I have a daddy/daughter dance with my munchkin. W is dropping her off (it's wifes week with daughter), which was very nice of her. I need to polish up my dancing shoes. Life as I know it now is already happening. I don't want to miss any of it....

[3boymom]

Life as I know it now is already happening. I don't want to miss any of it....

I like your way of thinking here SP. Enjoy your special night with your munchkin!!

[swoop]

I haven't posted here in a while. I started a thread in "surviving the big D". I am still actively working on my DBing skills, because I still wish to improve myself. I want to be the spouse only a fool would leave....for the next Wife!

STBXW and I will be starting mediation next week. We have been keeping our distance from each other, living our own lives and the tension is still pretty high. It is weird how this process affects us. STBXW is a complete stranger to me now. I think I have finally reached that point where I have decided the marriage isn't even worth saving. That's hard to stomach, but I honestly don't think I would ever want her back....too much damage, for too long. I am done.


I do have a question that I thought might be better suited for the new comers section. Wife sent me a text today, asking if it would be okay for her to come visit one of her friends at our business this weekend.... Easter weekend, the week before we start mediation, and she wants to come socialize in my backyard. She has bad mouthed my family, made slanderous comments on facebook about us, told me that she wanted out of the marriage, that her life is so much better without me... but she wants to come visit her friend in my backyard? I am sure you know my feelings about this, but I do not know how to reply to her request. I realize I should probably be a bigger person and just allow it, but I am at the point with this woman, that I am done with her selfishness. I am done with her hurting me. How do I tell her in a polite "DB" way, that she can go pound sand? I want to be a good person, but this just seems like another stake in my chest.Let her friend visit her at HER house. She literally lives 15 minutes away. Am I being too sensitive about this, or should I stand my ground and let her know she is no longer welcome here?