I think the big issue is, when is it OK to set boundaries for ourselves? Often times we push our hurt, which is related to unmet needs, down and discount it until we end up with a pile of resentment and pain. We become a tenderbox.
Melissa, from what you've written I get the impression that you've done this a lot in your marriage, that maybe you and your H never talked about what the real issues were but rather got angry, moved to your corners, built the walls higher, made up and "moved on".
Learning that we can set boundaries is important. As I learned in AlAnon, when something is a problem for me I can state that and set a boundary. The other person doesn't have to agree, and usually won't. (re-read your hazelden email)
State it in words/feelings that are specific to your need. Often times people don't know that they're hurting us because not all of us are hurt by the same things. We all have different needs. Or they continue to hurt us because they can.
Clearly stating our boundaries is how we take responsibility for ourselves.
Me 57/H 58 M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13
Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do. I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering. Caroline Myss
"He is what I would call a FB whore - he will be FB friends with anyone who asks, and he asks seemingly everyone he meets. For years, I didn't know who 75% of his FB friends were. He wasn't even sure who they all were. I asked him to please either remove the photos of our children or trim down his friends list. He refused. He told me I was ridiculous."
My ex is the same way. I just dont understand how someone can be "friends" with over 400 people.
Me-35 Com law-28 S-3 T-6 yrs w/14 mnth bu 1st bu- 2/2012 Rec-4/2013 2nd bu-10/2013 IC-2 yrs(anger issues) MC- 5 mnths-fail OM~1/1/14 OM dumped 6/4/14 New OM ~10/4/14
My ex is the same way. I just dont understand how someone can be "friends" with over 400 people.
I think maybe there are circumstances where this is fine, but in my H's case, it stems from his need for constant validation from anyone and everyone. That's why he is constantly looking at his phone - who texted me, who tweeted me, who emailed me? Who liked my FB post?
I found that I started to get obsessed with who liked my FB posts - that's part of the reason I stopped using FB. I realized I was trying to find my self worth there . . . yikes.
My apologies in advance for what's coming, I am trying to work this out in my head.
I'm kind of confused about how to reconcile stating needs/boundaries with refusing to engage with my H, given his recent behavior.
I don't think that I need to constantly tell him everything I am feeling, and quite frankly, I don't trust him with that information anyway. But I do feel like when there is something he is actively doing that is hurting me and the kids, I can't just be a doormat to avoid pissing him off or dealing with his wrath.
I guess the idea of not engaging with him is really more geared toward not giving him more ammo against me, because that keeps the focus on me and what a horrible person I am. Which makes sense, but I can't just let him do whatever he wants that hurts me and my kids forever, just to make sure he doesn't have any ammo. I can only really make sure he doesn't have any actual ammo. If that makes sense. Meaning, I shouldn't argue with him or exchange nasty words, blame, accuse, etc.
Still untangling this jumble of thoughts in my head.
me: 44 XH: 42 M 11 years D10 and S8 Bomb drop 9/27/13 D final 7/1/14
"I think maybe there are circumstances where this is fine, but in my H's case, it stems from his need for constant validation from anyone and everyone. That's why he is constantly looking at his phone - who texted me, who tweeted me, who emailed me? Who liked my FB post? "
My ex is the same way. CONSTANTLY on her phone except she's turned it off while out with mr. Special(speculation on my part but I'm pretty sure it's true). She admitted to finding self worth from her fb friends. She even admitted that she still feels lonely despite having a gaggle of fb friends.
About your ammo thing. Are you at a point where it doesn't matter to you what he thinks or wanting to keep the peace? Even if you act in the most appropriate way he will still find fault in what you're saying. If you want to keep the peace you will swallow up whatever bs he throws at you(not the most appropriate way to handle things because it can lead to frustration from taking all his bs). Which one are you more like right now?
Me-35 Com law-28 S-3 T-6 yrs w/14 mnth bu 1st bu- 2/2012 Rec-4/2013 2nd bu-10/2013 IC-2 yrs(anger issues) MC- 5 mnths-fail OM~1/1/14 OM dumped 6/4/14 New OM ~10/4/14
OK . . . so I decided to just say something about the photos on match. When H came to pick up the kids, we got them and all their stuff in the car, and then I said,
"H, I have a request of you. I would like you to please take down the photos of our children from your online dating profile. I don't feel comfortable having their photos on the internet for anyone to see. And, I would like you to please remove any photos that were taken by me. I feel, for myself and our children, very hurt and disrespected that you would use photos I took for memories of our special family moments in this way."
(I was literally shaking when I said this. WTF is wrong with me??)
He was semi smiling, shifty eyes, looked kind of surprised, and I almost detected an eye roll toward the end. As I finished, he started edging toward the car and he stammered a bit and said, without even really looking at me, "OK, well, ummm, I'll take care of that and I'm sorry that hurt you." Then jumped in the car.
Honestly, I am getting to the point where when he talks, I hear Charlie Brown's teacher. It's all the same meaningless BS. He has now said he is sorry twice in 24 hours, and neither of them meant anything at all.
I think I will just leave that be for a while. I've got the weekend to just focus on me, so that's what I am going to do.
me: 44 XH: 42 M 11 years D10 and S8 Bomb drop 9/27/13 D final 7/1/14
About your ammo thing. Are you at a point where it doesn't matter to you what he thinks or wanting to keep the peace? Even if you act in the most appropriate way he will still find fault in what you're saying. If you want to keep the peace you will swallow up whatever bs he throws at you(not the most appropriate way to handle things because it can lead to frustration from taking all his bs). Which one are you more like right now?
That's a great question. I am still kind of trying to figure that out. I think it's some of each. I have pretty much accepted that he does not want to be M to me, and that he is so incredibly self centered right now that nothing I say to him will really be heard. In fact, it is more likely to give him something to twist around to make himself look/feel better, potentially attacking me in the process.
I'm definitely done with trying to be nice for the purpose of trying to make him come back. It's more just not bitching about things because it's utterly useless.
I do want to keep the peace for two reasons:
(1) I don't want to spend zillions of dollars on lawyers; and (2) I think that it is much easier on the children (who are already the undeserving victims of all of this) if their parents get along. And I will add (3), which is that we have been friends for a long time, and I think somewhere under all that a$$hole-ness right now, there is the same guy I've known for 17+ years. The thought of being enemies makes me feel really sad.
That said, I need to protect myself emotionally, because he has pretty much annihilated me over the course of the M and especially over the past 4-5 months. I just can't let myself get sucked in by him again, so I think I need to keep my distance, remind myself I cannot trust him, and try to detach. So, we cannot be friends.
And on the topic of emotional needs, obviously I am not expecting him to meet any of mine anymore (I almost laughed out loud just typing that), but if he is doing something that is actively hurting me or my children (like this match photo thing), then I will certainly say something, regardless of what I think his reaction might be.
I'm not sure whether that answered your question, or if I said waaayyyy more than you were looking for.
As an aside . . . I gave the kids the packing list that H sent. My S7 immediately noticed that Dad forgot to put underwear on the list. I asked if there was aaaaaaaanything else missing, and after a few minutes they figured out PJS too. As we were waiting for H to show up, it occurred to me that they didn't bring toothbrushes and D9 didn't bring a hair brush, but I figured oh well, I am sure they can stop at a drugstore, or my in laws will probably have stuff they can use.
OK. Adrenaline finally leaving body. I am going to make my massage appointment, eat some dinner and go to yoga tonight. Gotta get myself in a more relaxed mode for the weekend!!
me: 44 XH: 42 M 11 years D10 and S8 Bomb drop 9/27/13 D final 7/1/14
About your ammo thing. Are you at a point where it doesn't matter to you what he thinks or wanting to keep the peace? Even if you act in the most appropriate way he will still find fault in what you're saying. If you want to keep the peace you will swallow up whatever bs he throws at you(not the most appropriate way to handle things because it can lead to frustration from taking all his bs). Which one are you more like right now?
That's a great question. I am still kind of trying to figure that out. I think it's some of each. I have pretty much accepted that he does not want to be M to me, and that he is so incredibly self centered right now that nothing I say to him will really be heard. In fact, it is more likely to give him something to twist around to make himself look/feel better, potentially attacking me in the process.
I'm definitely done with trying to be nice for the purpose of trying to make him come back. It's more just not bitching about things because it's utterly useless.
I do want to keep the peace for two reasons:
(1) I don't want to spend zillions of dollars on lawyers; and (2) I think that it is much easier on the children (who are already the undeserving victims of all of this) if their parents get along. And I will add (3), which is that we have been friends for a long time, and I think somewhere under all that a$$hole-ness right now, there is the same guy I've known for 17+ years. The thought of being enemies makes me feel really sad.
That said, I need to protect myself emotionally, because he has pretty much annihilated me over the course of the M and especially over the past 4-5 months. I just can't let myself get sucked in by him again, so I think I need to keep my distance, remind myself I cannot trust him, and try to detach. So, we cannot be friends.
And on the topic of emotional needs, obviously I am not expecting him to meet any of mine anymore (I almost laughed out loud just typing that), but if he is doing something that is actively hurting me or my children (like this match photo thing), then I will certainly say something, regardless of what I think his reaction might be.
I'm not sure whether that answered your question, or if I said waaayyyy more than you were looking for.
As an aside . . . I gave the kids the packing list that H sent. My S7 immediately noticed that Dad forgot to put underwear on the list. I asked if there was aaaaaaaanything else missing, and after a few minutes they figured out PJS too. As we were waiting for H to show up, it occurred to me that they didn't bring toothbrushes and D9 didn't bring a hair brush, but I figured oh well, I am sure they can stop at a drugstore, or my in laws will probably have stuff they can use.
OK. Adrenaline finally leaving body. I am going to make my massage appointment, eat some dinner and go to yoga tonight. Gotta get myself in a more relaxed mode for the weekend!!
hi M. Vroom vroom hsve a great weekend. You deserve it!
me: 47, W:49 M 16.5 years T 17 years Three kids - D17,D14, S13 Heart 2 heart about M 11/8/13 Bomb drop 11/29/13 W moved out 12/5/13 I Retained L 2/20/14 D filed 3/17/14
I got a text from my H while they were at the airport.
Profile should be down. I'm sorry for that - wasn't really thinking of you and I should have been.
Isn't that interesting that he said that?
Then he texted me when they landed . . . let me know with our little way of letting each other know we landed OK whenever we traveled without the other.
Cheated death again.
My H sure is an interesting guy.
Back to me . . . I went to yoga and was - wait for it. The only one in the class. (Read: the only one without a date on Valentine's Day.)
It was a good class, though.
Then I went and bought myself some flowers. And as I drove home, I thought, I really don't need these flowers. So I went through the McDonald's drive through and gave them to the woman at the window. She looked at me like I had three heads.
It's been a weird night.
me: 44 XH: 42 M 11 years D10 and S8 Bomb drop 9/27/13 D final 7/1/14
You pretty much answered my question. It's not a black and white type of question. I agree that keeping the peace for your children is a must. Protecting yourself is a must. The solutions are grey.
It seems your h is calming down a bit. Just be weary of why he took his profile down. Don't conjure up too many thoughts as to why he did that. I have my own suspicions though.
About your yoga class, I felt bad hearing that. It reminded me of the time I was about 8 years old and I went trick or treating by myself because my friend ditched me. Now that I think about it, that could be a major reason of why I am the way that I am. Hmmmm.
At least you gave somebody some flowers today. I made my son some spaghetti and arranged it in the shape of a heart. Haha. I'm sure today was a lonely day for all of us...
Me-35 Com law-28 S-3 T-6 yrs w/14 mnth bu 1st bu- 2/2012 Rec-4/2013 2nd bu-10/2013 IC-2 yrs(anger issues) MC- 5 mnths-fail OM~1/1/14 OM dumped 6/4/14 New OM ~10/4/14
