Reaching out for support and advice 2

[juliegayle]

Wonka thank you for the perspective from the other side. I was concerned about the comments about feeling trapped and blaming God. It is eerily similar to an uncle who has been in and out of treatment since a suicide attempt several years ago. I have never known anyone deeply in MLC and didn't know signs were similar.

Blues hope that doesn't upset you. I just care about you and want your family to get through this ok.

[labug]

Wonka, why can't it be depression?

[labug]

Sorry don't want to clog up your thread blues. Wonka you can answer on my thread if you like.

[Wonka]

Bug,

Depression is a very big part of MLC.

Blues,

I waded through your most recent previous thread and this one. The reason why I suspect that what your H is going through MLC is this:

H constantly criticizing your GAL activities, being a social butterfly (he's so unhappy so he doesn't want you to be happy)

H choosing not to fully participate in Retrou

H saying "I feel trapped" (classic MLC line)

Not interested in working on the M. Just going through the motions of life.

Doing crazy and unpredictable stuff like taking out large sums of cash

Blowing up over the simplest things

H looks awful and has glassy eyes

OW

Feeling nothing for you (this is MLC numbness)

Honey, when H dropped the bomb on you...did he experience a recent loss such as getting fired, losing someone close to death (best friend, family member)?

I am so sorry that you're going through this. It's no picnic at all! MLCers are very depressed with a lot of anger, discomfort, and a overwhelming sense of helplessness. Their coping skills break down slowly over time.

Unfortunately, you do have a huge target on your back since you are perceived to be the source of their unhappiness in their mind since you are tangible. They cannot figure out why all of their neutrons are misfiring in all directions.

Detach. I know this isn't easy at all.

[labug]

Those are also symptoms of depression.

Blues, here's the thing, If your H is depressed he can get treatment. He's not yours to fix so whether he does or doesn't isn't your responsibility. If he chooses to not get treatment, it's within reason that you set a boundary that says, "I can't be with you if you don't get treatment."

You're in a tough spot, I wish you the best.

[bluesgal]

Wow everyone-thanks so much for the support. Wonka-it's so ironic, I was just reading your posts in "A voyage in MLCers mind" and others.

If anyone shows concern towards H, he distances and withdraws. He is offended at the thought of being "diagnosed" with depression. Typical blah blah.

He came over to visit the kids tonight. Was fairly 'lucid' it seemed. He became teary eyed when he discussed that he is "not feeling settled". " I don't have my feet under me." "I do not like this situation"

But, he does not ask to move home. He is trying like crazy to spend more time here....just not live here. I must be careful of cake eating as that annoys me and I feel used.

S7 had 2nd behavior note sent home from school this week from: Teacher, substitute teacher, music teacher, and classmates mom regarding him being "mean" and acting out. Sigh. Poor little man doesn't know what to do with these feelings. The last time he had these was when we moved out. H actually acknowledged it could be due to our sitch....Cue Hallelujah music.

I will say something mean and undetached. I'm ready for 2x4's but I have to be honest: I hated hearing my H sadness and desperation on Monday and by the way, I don't think he's suicidal. I just don't. But....seeing him seem a little happy tonight bothered me. A small (maybe medium) part of me wants him to be visibly miserable so I know the kids and I aren't suffering alone....I know it sounds terrible. But it's how I feel right now.

And while I feel less stressed and more detached and moments of real happiness, I am feeling rather hopeless about our M. MLC is so scary and intimidating...and his blaming me seems so real. I mean, I just can't imagine this 'fog' being lifted and him no longer having anger, resentment, blame. I can't picture him having love towards me again.

[bluesgal]

Oh BTW Wonka,
He lost his grandma and close uncle just months before BD. I've heard that death or trauma can trigger MLC and that BD may follow a vacation or home project. Well, we had a wonderful vacation just 3 months prior to BD and purchased our 3rd rental property that was a chore to get ready in a week before new tenants arrived...then a week later BD. Why can't I just show him this, and he'll read it and go "Oh I get it. Let's stop this nonsense and move forward with our lives" J/K of course

[Wonka]

Bug,

--Blues, here's the thing, If your H is depressed he can get treatment. He's not yours to fix so whether he does or doesn't isn't your responsibility. If he chooses to not get treatment, it's within reason that you set a boundary that says, "I can't be with you if you don't get treatment."--

Nope. This wouldn't work at all since depression is part and parcel of the MLC process. Just gonna have to let H work through it himself. You can't force someone to seek treatment and it is a "disease" that is temporary with MLC. Oh my! If you bring this up to the MLCer, they're gonna think you're the crazy one!

Blues,

Yup. Your H does have MLC based on all of the indications that are ticked off from the checklist. So sorry that this is happening to you. I've posted in my thread asking folks to swing by from time to time to help you along this process. I'll be watching you here.

[job]

Depression is the main ingredient in MLC and it will run its course throughout the years of crisis. It is up to him to figure out that he's depressed or that something is wrong and seek treatment. Many of the crisis people will say that there is nothing wrong w/them if you should point out that they are depressed or something is wrong. Bottom line, if he's in crisis, he has to be the one to seek treatment, i.e., just like an addict, you can put them in rehab many times over, but until they are willing to do the work, they won't.

Your h is going to seek out all sorts of self medication during the crisis and some of those possible medications are: spending money, gambling, drinking, drug use, porn, dating and possibly living w/someone, etc. They are seeking changes to their lives, but don't see or understand that the change has to happen from within. They seek outside sources to make them feel better and one the euphoria of those changes wears off, once again they are out there seeking something else.

Your h will become the mirror image of himself, i.e., the exact opposite. He'll change his appearance, you'll notice that his eyes have lost that lively twinkle and become very blank, he'll either lose weight or gain it, some getting body piercings and tattoos, he'll dress younger and his "toys" will become more expensive and he won't care if his bills stack up.

Please, make sure that your assets/finances are in order. Open a separate checking/savings account and start putting money in them. If you have joint credit cards, you need to think about getting your name removed from the ones he has. You don't want to be left holding the bag paying his large credit card debt. Watch your utility bills and mortgage to ensure that it is being paid on time, if he is paying them.

Bottom line, you didn't break him, therefore you can't fix him. He is the only one that can do that. The more you try to fix him or reason w/him, the more he's going to run in the opposite direction and he will shut down on you and not listen to anything you have to say. Set boundaries that you can adhere to and will help you move along the path.

Please, take some time and visit the MLC Forum. We have some wonderful posters over there and they would be more than willing to answer any questions that you may have.

Please take care of yourself.

[labug]

Wonka, just to clarify.

Nope. This wouldn't work at all since depression is part and parcel of the MLC process. Just gonna have to let H work through it himself. You can't force someone to seek treatment and it is a "disease" that is temporary with MLC. Oh my! If you bring this up to the MLCer, they're gonna think you're the crazy one! grin

This is not about forcing anyone to do anything. You've read my posts, you know me. This is a boundary with a very bright line to protect the spouse of someone with a problem, be it an addict, problematic alcohol use, untreated MI or a mixture of those as is commonly the case.

It's not my belief that because someone is going to laugh at boundary setting it shouldn't be done. Teens laugh at boundary-setting all the time, it still needs to be done.

I see women (and it's mostly women} in very difficult situations who are afraid to set and enforce boundaries to protect themselves and their families. I think the most important thing we can learn here is our boundaries and effective boundary-setting.

Depression like addiction, affects the whole family. Recognizing that and protecting ourselves with boundaries is a step in our healing process.

Blues, I also agree with Job that you need to protect your assets.

Wonka, I respect your knowledge and advice, but I disagree on this topic.