Don't know if im on the edge anymore or not....

[sandi2]

I'm not making myself understood about the email response.  Forget about what was said or not said for a minute.  Just take your focus off the words in your response for right now.  The issue or point I was trying to get across was I thought you were going to stop contacting and you had decided to give her space.  I thought you were going to stop being available when she called, TM, or emailed.  I was trying my best to encourage and support you through what we knew was going to be like "withdrawal pains" for you.  The fact you didn't answer her first two, three or ever how many emails is not a drop in the bucket!  I got the impression you thought that was enough time to merit breaking the NC.
You have been giving all kinds of rationalizations about it.

You have to make up your mind. Dingo, about your plan of action.  You may think you've had one or have been sticking to one, but It has to be longer than a week or so. It's like a weight loss diet, if you decide to eat sugar every few days, you aren't going to achieve your desired goal.

 You say you have clearly laid out your boundary and do not feel it needs to be said again.  I believe you said it had been told to her too many times as is.  I agree!  But the problem is she doesn't buy it b/c she is seeing a man who is too eager to come running when he hears from her.  I'm trying to tell you what it is like from her POV and that mindset of a WAW who has one foot in an A and one foot in the M.  Sweetie you have to be tough and firm b/c she has to see a man with strength and integrity.  And, it is possible, and i think necessary, to do that without being mean, nasty, or cold-hearted.  But your fear of losing her is over-riding everything else.....and has been since
you first found out about the A. Until you deal with your fear, I don't think you will be able to be a confident man who stops making this all about her and finally decides to take space for himself to think about what he deserves. And you do deserve to have a W who loves you more than some possible OM right around the next corner. She has admitted this OM may not be the one, but she wants to see if there is another one. Do want to live the rest of your life snooping around to see if she has found that other person? Now listen carefully please, if your fear is greater than your dignity as a man......then she can see it. I promise you she will never be attracted to you if you operate from a position of fear. You will never be "enough" for her and she will continue to search for the next AP.

So make up your mind what you want, so we can keep up.  We know she can't stay on the same decision for two days straight, but I read one night you weren't responding and the next time I looked......wham! Just remember I'm not the bad guy here, okay?  I really do want to help and have an idea so don't let me forget to go back and talk about
it.

Okay, I will try to answer those questions:

1. Are you suggesting that before I respond to my wife in any
way, shape or form, that she has to begin a conversation with
something along the lines of 'the affair is over, I want to
re-commit'?

I don't know if that is directed at me or Bug, but I don't remember suggesting any particular words she must use to began her conversations,  However, I agree with what Melissa said.  If she really was fed up with OM and has once and for all ended the A, I doubt she would have used the words she did with you.  You saw her message as "missing you" but I don't think we women saw that at all. When thethings with OM is finally over, and she is no longer playing games (maybe she wants to date others to see, etc) and is serious about never wanting to lay eyes on him again as long as she lives (if she even mentioms his name. And btw, this has to be different than her getting mad at him and turning back to you out of spite to him. That is why you cannot wait around to think this other guy is going to step out of the picture and make things easy for you. He is not your problem! This is what I try to tell the LBH'S, and even she has said she may shop around if it doesn't work out with him.

Some women don't talk about the AP when the A has ended, but you will get a softer, more humble, sounding email.  If you had been doing what you should have done since it first happened, she would know that you havenothing to discuss with her unless she has ended the A.That was the boundary. Wasn't it?  What is there to talk a out if there is a third person in the M?  This other stuff from her about meeting up to talk? I think
it will be more of the same you experienced before. You are wanting to see or read meaning into it that's not there.......b/c things have not "processed" yet?

2. Is this realistic? Does this actually happen after weeks/months of no contact/ignored attempts at contact? Or is it more realistic for the WAS to approach slowly, maybe ask to meet up to discuss it in person?

Yes, it is realistic after she ends things and stops the notion of shopping around for someone better. That second part of your question is the mindset of a LBH, and sound reasonable, doesn't it. But you have not been out of her life enough for her to get through the process a WAW in an A needs to do. You are wishfully thinking you can meet up and slowly get around to R. She has to have a longer time without dingo in her life. When she contacted you, it was a hook, and you bit.

I have already answered questions 3 & 4.

5. Where in my response or in any of my subsequent posts did it come across that I wanted to be her friend as opposed to just being friendly?

Again, I am not referring to the words in your response. You bit the hook and she is reeling you in. Look how much time, focus, and energy you have put I to rationalizing your response and the whole friendship thing. Look at how much time I have tried to help you get your head on straight after just one response to her.

Finally, it will not work to try to be her friend at this point and time of the process. You deceive yourself and It confuses her vision of your boundary! I don't know what else to say to get you to see it. . After a much longer period of NC and space........then you might try, but for now, you will get more of the same b/c nothing has changed!

[2ndTimeHurt]

Sandi2 makes a lot of sense. I haven't been following your entire thread but if sandi feels you're not in the right stage to be "friends" it seems like it would make sense to stick with your boundaries.

I believe there is a time and place for everything. Seems like the people here don't believe it's the right time for you to be engaging in your w.

[paul19510]

Dingo, in essence then, your W was 'pinging' you to see if you were still on the hook...(according to my understanding of the stuff above). She wants to stay in a fantasy that says she has all the time and choices in the world. Dingo's in the for the long haul.

Sandi, did I paraphrase this correctly or am I misunderstanding. and if I'm correct, damn that's not a nice thing for people to do....

[sandi2]

I forgot to got get back around to the idea I mentioned last time. If you make up your mind to stick with NC and giving/taking space, you can let her know at meet-up, if it happens. If you discover she really is just doing more of the same behavior, you need to speak up and let her know that "you" are the one who needs space from her now. Tell her "you" need to think about what "you" want from this point forward, and to do what is best for "you".

Sound a little self-centered? It's okay. I am saying all of this hoping you won't do it just as a tactic to get the girl in the end, but b/c you get your eyes opened and stop making everything about her. You may even have to spell it out and tell her, "W, this is about me and what I deserve, and I deserve to have a wife who loves me completely and I don't have to worry about her being faithful".

You see, by saying that, you take back the power over your life. You've been waiting to see what OM decides to do......hoping she would return to you if he pulled out. What kind of MR is that? What kind of life is that? Start doing what is best for your life by "your own decisions" and not what your W decides......and certainly not what some other guy decides.

The only way this succeeds is for you to be not just "ready" to walk away from her.....but actually do it. Otherwise, you hesitate and wait just a second or two to see how she is going to react to this information........and by waiting to see if she tries to persuade you not to........you've lost. You relented again. You have handed her the power over your life again. She sees it nothing more than a tactic on your part, so it in the long run, it is not successful for a y means.

I believe the only way you will be free of your fear is to take back the control over your life. Let her go.

You are so afraid she won't get her act together and come after you, that it has paralyzed you into being less than what you can be.

Letting her go is the first step.

[sandi2]

Sandi, did I paraphrase this correctly or am I misunderstanding. and if I'm correct, damn that's not a nice thing for people to do....

Yes! And you used such fewer words to say it!

[paul19510]

Sandi, did I paraphrase this correctly or am I misunderstanding. and if I'm correct, damn that's not a nice thing for people to do....

Yes! And you used such fewer words to say it!

Sandi, then I second what you just by paraphrasing again for Dingo. if you we watching anybody else go thru this, would you tell them to tell the person to "...go pound sand" until they could get their act together and then maybe you would think about being around for them (if you were still available...)

not as a tactic, but seriously do it. Take you life back. you don't have to actually those words, but think like that...."the heck with you!....you don't treat me nice and the world is full o people who will....get your sh!t together..." something like that

[paul19510]

sorry for the typos, but you get my meaning. Sandi you are the master! I am always amazed by your insights and I realize they came at a cost to you. You had to earn it.

[sandi2]

In a stitch where you have a WAW in an A............and especially when she has said that even if OM doesn't work out that she wants to see what elseis out there (or words to the effect she wants to window shop to sleep with someone else), I would tell that LBH to drop the rope immediately. When there are no children, I believe going dark works better, but so many men are afraid it ends any chance of R. Which really shows that he is being clingy and needy......and assures no chance or hope for a good outcome.

I say this about those women in an affairs. I believe that has a whole can of worms that a WAW who is not in an A has. That is why I try to add the part "who are in an A". I personally believe it calls for a tougher love than the majority of newcomers are willing to apply. The WAW in an A can be selfish, cruel, unrealistic, rebellious, irresponsible, untrustworthy, deceitful, and unstable. That is what you are dealing with!

What may work in a stitch where the WAW is not in some type of an A..........will probably not work the same or as well in the stitch where she has walked away or wants out b/c of another person. The things that can be applied in both are the 37 do's & don't tips, but if there is an A, the LBH better gear up for a tougher time of it. When she isn't messed up by some A, then the LBH becoming a man only a fool would leave works great! And no disrespect intended toward my fellow board member from whence that saying came, once the WAW is involved in an adulterous A, she may already be at that place of being a "fool" that doesn't see her H's wonderful changes. At the risk of criticism at this anology, she often needs something like an emotional slap in her face, in order to bring back her senses. Sadly, nothing is a garantee.....especially when she's too far gone or she sees the wrong actions from the LBH.

[dingo]

Wow guys - thanks for all the great responses. There's a lot in here for me to think about.

My wife did call me this afternoon and I did pick up the phone. She started in with a bunch of small talk, telling me about her family and her weekend, etc. After a minute or so, I stopped her and reminded her that we agreed that we weren't going to talk until she was 100% done with the affair. I asked her if that was the case. She told me that she hadn't seen him or talked to him in a few weeks and that she was working on it but its hard because she doesn't know what's "right for her" (fvcking hate that phrase). She has an appointment with an IC this week and still wants to talk to a DB coach. She accused me of seeing someone else (apparently that's what she assumed when I didn't respond to her emails right away). I told her that I was trying to respect her need for space to figure herself out and that she needed to do the same to allow me to figure out what I wanted. She responded with 'I thought you wanted to work on our marriage'.

Anyway - the call lasted just over 5 minutes or so and ended with me again reminding her to respect what I was asking her for which was NC until affair is over.

I am going over to a friend's house to watch the game but I will post more later/tomorrow.

One thing I did want to ask Sandi is where you got the impression that my wife wanted to see what else was out there beyond the OM? I don't recall her ever saying anything like that to me.

[paul19510]

Wow guys - thanks for all the great responses. There's a lot in here for me to think about.

My wife did call me this afternoon and I did pick up the phone. She started in with a bunch of small talk, telling me about her family and her weekend, etc. After a minute or so, I stopped her and reminded her that we agreed that we weren't going to talk until she was 100% done with the affair. I asked her if that was the case. She told me that she hadn't seen him or talked to him in a few weeks and that she was working on it but its hard because she doesn't know what's "right for her" (fvcking hate that phrase). She has an appointment with an IC this week and still wants to talk to a DB coach. She accused me of seeing someone else (apparently that's what she assumed when I didn't respond to her emails right away). I told her that I was trying to respect her need for space to figure herself out and that she needed to do the same to allow me to figure out what I wanted. She responded with 'I thought you wanted to work on our marriage'.

Anyway - the call lasted just over 5 minutes or so and ended with me again reminding her to respect what I was asking her for which was NC until affair is over.

I am going over to a friend's house to watch the game but I will post more later/tomorrow.

One thing I did want to ask Sandi is where you got the impression that my wife wanted to see what else was out there beyond the OM? I don't recall her ever saying anything like that to me.

you da man! Nice job. Enjoy the game. Do you feel good about it?