Please do not see my response as attack against yours or anything negative or as ignoring your advice (I am not).... I am just trying to understand.... so, I ask more questions (this is me)... and would really like to have a few others opinions too. Vet or not.
Isn't THIS a place that we all strived to get too? A place where our MLC/WAS decides that "they" want to talk?... isn't it my position to now STFU and listen, validate?
He admitted he doesnt want to go through with mediation, isnt looking forward to it, but wants to make sure that I am protected financially. Secure.
He said: When I reflect back on relationships and look at how nasty we can get and then bounce back to a happy place. He likes that we have that resilience. He brought up our old "theme" from the movie The Mexican. Where Brad Pitt and Gina Davis take their relationship to the edge, but their vow to eachother is no matter how far its stretched and you bang heads... you dont give up.
So, wouldn't it be better to hear him out? At least once?
The way I understand my next action to be (based on reading others posts, and jobs advice), is to sit and wait. See if he promotes another R talk (although he said he wants me to do it), and again to listen and validate as he pours his heart out... for me to say things like "I understand your confusion, it must be frustrating, etc"... for me not to judge but to listen empathatically. For him to not be afraid to tell me. To somehow not interject what I WANT (from Bond) into the convo (pass the duct tape please..)
And as read from AS on another thread "great job on validating and not trying to force things too quickly! I think too many people get to your point and forget the squirrel analogy and just want to get everything back to what they perceive as "normal" ASAP, so they start applying too much pressure too soon and it pushes the confused WAS right out the door again. But it's not about going back to what was, it's about building a new relationship, and that takes lots of time. It's just like starting a new R with a new person, it has to develop slowly over time."
"if he insists on relationship talks, remind him he's a grown man and you'll talk about your relationship only after he's figured out what he wants, and that you have no interest in being involved with his confusion. and then leave it at that, end the conversation. show some self respect."...isnt this just where I put in a new boundary... and say that I have not interest in relationship talks as long as he is dating, that he needs to remove OW? I would love to just say to him, that I don't need any more of his honesty...if its just going to hurt me.]
"following mediation, determine how to separate yourself from the business, either sell him your portion or whatever mediation determines."as I will still proceed with mediation... I agree I need to separate myself from the business ... as much as I love being in a business/love R with him. I cannot have one without the other
"get yourself a new job." at some point, after I review my financial situation
give yourself space away from him on a daily basis, this is only adding to your inability to see whats going on. I try to do this now (give myself space)... and he has noticed and commented on it yesterday.
"and then dont wait around for him to figure out his confusion, that's ridiculous at his age. to me its BS, and he's playing both sides, and keeping his options open." yes, I agree here... and find it cruel (not intentional Bond), but still cruel
"if someday things changes after the dust has settled, then maybe consider reconciliation.
"in my opinion there is no chance for a healthy reconciliation while you work together, and while he claims to be confused and while he's dating someone else."He down played their dating, and im not sure why... if he was into it with her, wouldn't he be happy to say he has moved on? He was the complete opposite and offered details of their 2 movie dates and one dinner. They have fooled around but not sex... barf
M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
to me, this is the key: "He admitted he doesnt want to go through with mediation"
my gut says he's protecting his assets, he's hoping to get you to agree to what he wants and that he can easily manipulate you by claiming Confusion. and he knows a mediator wont fall for that BS.
my guess is his confusion didnt begin until you mentioned mediation.
as far as boundaries, i gave you what i considered a boundary, when you give more details, it only give him/you more opportunity to argue the insignificant details and brush off the important ones.
and removing yourself from daily contact, including working together, is for you. you are clearly spiraling out of control. the faster you do it, after mediation, the better.
but the intertwining of working together, the money, the business, the OW, will ultimately prevent you from moving in the right direction, and is just adding to the chaos.
i believe you have to give up on the idea of reconciliation or the relationship WHILE you're so out of control. you dont have the strength or the self-respect to deal with it while you're working together. then go and get your act together, build up some self love first, and then decide what you want to do.
one thing i found about myself which was odd/interesting, is that after the BD i wanted what i couldnt have. before the BD i didnt want her, but suddenly she's sleeping with her boss and i honestly believed i had lost the greatest woman in the world - but that was a lie my mind told me. after i gave up on the relationship and stepped away, i realized i was better than that, and i didnt want her back and i saw her for the POS she was.
"In a ham and eggs breakfast, the hen is involved, but the pig is committed".
He down played their dating, and im not sure why... if he was into it with her, wouldn't he be happy to say he has moved on? He was the complete opposite and offered details of their 2 movie dates and one dinner. They have fooled around but not sex... barf
i'm sorry, but my x claimed the same thing, even though i had proof they had slept together.
"In a ham and eggs breakfast, the hen is involved, but the pig is committed".
Magic, We all can't be wrong if Ken is coming here and advising you of the same thing, i.e., your SO is hoping to placate you and claiming confusion, i.e., he's wanting to ensure that his assets and finances remain the way they are. The longer he can string you along, and tell you what you want to hear, the better.
As for dating and fooling around, didn't Bill Clinton say he didn't have sex with Monica? Well, I hate to say this, but it's the script being spoken once again and many of us have heard it.
Ken, Mr. Bond and all of the other posters have given you the same advice about the business and getting yourself set up financially and secure. It's time to do that and hopefully it can be completed within the next couple of weeks. After that, you seriously need to consider finding a new position. It's not going to be very healthy for you to continue working with/for him and yet, trying to maintain some distance and live your life as well as moving forward.
I do hope that you will truly listen to what Ken and others have told you. Seriously, you need to focus on you and what you need to do in the next few weeks. Write up your questions/concerns for mediation and be prepared to ask them in the meeting.
As long as your SO thinks he can string you along, the happier he's going to be about it because it suits his needs and continues to pad his wallet w/o him having to do anything to ensure that you are set up and recognized legally as a partner.
Listen to what the posters have told you. No one has given you bum advice. Had you been seeing a counselor, you would have been paying big bucks for the advice you received here.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
OK (possibly)... why bother to tell me AT ALL? I don't need to know this stuff. If we aren't reconcilling, why discuss it at all?
He is really shocked that I haven't been dating someone. He said he made decisions based that I was done with him, that I said I dont look back once I am done.
He said he wants what we used to have.
M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
Magic, We can't read your SO's mind, but we can only go on what you've told us and what we've experienced ourselves. He's telling you this stuff to keep you dangling from the string that keeps you tethered to him. Go back and -reread Ken's last posting to you. He told you what his gut was telling him from reading your posting and the other posters, as well as myself have told you as well. In fact, I believe I touched on this keeping you on a string yesterday in one of my postings to you as a possibility. They will use any excuse to keep their assets to themselves and not share them or want to divide them up equally.
Well, if he wants what you use to have, then that can be done after the mediation meeting and things are settled up. You need to ensure that you are well protected financially. Why raise this issue now that the date has been set? I can tell you why...he's hoping you'll change your mind, drop the subject and continue on being his worker bee.
He's mixed up a nice batch of Kool-Aid for you to drink. Focus on what is important right now...you and your financial future. Let's see how much he wants what you used to have after the mediation meeting.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
HI Job and anyone following... thanks for all the advice.
I have made progress for mediation. I have an appointment waiting to be firmed up. Mediation office contaced h this morning, he is rearranging the date to a better suited one because it falls on a busy business day.
For the record, I am not suggesting ANYONE is WRONG... to each their opinion.
But, is it not possible that H is now reaching out? What happened to that DB theory? I too am "skeptic" and scared and want to be CAUTIOUS...but, its not his style to be sneaky or play dirty, he is an honest person.... so not sure WHAT to BELIEVE. Why believe the worst without KNOWING? Isn't that mindreading? Shouldn't I hear him out? What makes everyone 'think' he is stringing me along? When I suggested this as a possibility, I was shot down by Bond and told to stop mind reading!
I am very scared and will absolutely continue with mediation and to protect myself. My h has not veered from agreeing that I need to be protected and secured. Not sure why anyone is doubting this or his tactic.
I have been listening and ACTING on what the posters tell me...
M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
Hi Magic, I just wanted to stop by your thread and thank you for posting on mine!
Just catching up on the latest in your sitch and it looks like you are in a tough spot right now. I know you are getting great advice from the vets here, so I will butt out and just let you know you've got another DBer supporting you.
((Magic))
me: 44 XH: 42 M 11 years D10 and S8 Bomb drop 9/27/13 D final 7/1/14
Thanks Melissa... welcome to my confusion!! LOL (I would welcome your opinion too)
Thanks Gabby.... yes, wonderful advice... much appreciated. I know everyone gets upset with me. Thinking that I am not listening, but I am... I am!! Yes, my h's motives "might be"... its possible, and will keep that in mind. I just don't know if its him.
Kens words: my belief is that he is telling you what he thinks you want to hear, and when you press him for his thoughts he just gives you more. yes, this is a possible scenario... but, I wasn;t asking for his thoughts... he started volunteering them.
but that doesn't mean he believes what he's saying, or that he actually feels that way. in his mind he's trying not to hurt you. and he doesn't want have to keep telling you he is done and its over. he's told you that before and his actions tell you that. but your actions and words are that you haven't accepted it yet. again, he doesnt want to hurt me.. so why even tell me? I didn't ask for any of it... my actions are that I have accepted what he said and am moving forward to mediation.
my x claimed to be interested in reconciliation and gave me the same vague answers, but in reality it was simply lies, for whatever reason - she didnt want to be seen as the person who ended the marriage, or she didnt want our friends to look badly at her, or she was just buying time until the paperwork came through. the reasons dont matter, and the lies are just lies, maybe well intended but still lies. I can see this as a possibility too as my h doesnt like people to think poorly of him... so I keep assuring him that people wont think badly. I am not convinced he is lying. Possible tho. At this point anything is possible.
you will continue to be confused and lost as long as you try to understand what he's doing. things will become much clearer when you ignore what he's saying and focus only on yourself. AGREE!! which is WHY I am continuing to mediate (appt in February)
Going back to our convo of last night... H wants assurances that I am still willing to R . He wants to be sure that I havent had a bf.... Why does he get all the assurances? Shouldn't I be getting some? Maybe thats why the "honesty" is coming out... I dunno..He assures that he misses me, and longs for our old relationship (the good parts, not the yelling), that we have 20 years and that means alot to him. He sees value in that. He doesnt see spending the next 20 years with anyone else...or even anyone.
He is nice today. Very responsive and texing/communicating alot. I will be seeing him within the hour to work due to a client appt. My head wants to throw things at him. My heart needs bandaids... How am I to be around him? Still friendly? or distant/aloof...skeptical?
Now he is here to repair my DD little car.
M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
IMHO, I really think your H is being honest and not trying to "protect" himeself or take advantage of you. I think like most people in MLC, he's confused and taking his time sorting things out because non-confrontation or non-conflict is what he's looking for.
The part where you are controlling and manipulating is that you keep pushing and pushing (yes you do) him to make decisions about your R just because YOU can't handle it and are anxious. You've done it to everyone who posts to you. You push and push and push for answers. We all tell you the same thing, but you push some more AND THEN you ask someone outside and come back and tell the rest of us about it. And guess what? Their advice is the same as ours. You only hear what you want to hear.
You have to understand that in KenF's case, his W REALLY took advantage of him and flaunted her OM in front of his face. Your boyfriend (and yes, that's what he is) didn't do that. I could be wrong, but it really does seem like he didn't think it was a big deal because you're not together any more.
During this time I haven't seen you actually work on your insecurities. You ridicule him, yes you do. You keep saying you don't mean it, etc, but you do it alot. In fact, I don't know how many times you kept saying he treated you like a doormat.
It is HIS MLC. YOU can't control it. HE has to be the one to reach that understanding on his own WITHOUT your help. This isn't him reaching out. It's him answering you because you need to control what's going on in your life and his.
I don't know how many times we've told you this...take care of you and fix yourself first. If you do get back together again, could you honestly say that you have changed enough that things would be great living with you? No resentments? No insecurities? No need for constant validation? Be honest.
M-43 W-40 2D - 9 and 5
Emotion, yet peace. Ignorance, yet knowledge. Passion, yet serenity. Chaos, yet harmony. Death, yet a new life.
