I wondered, while reading, was he returning to his true self and hiding it from you all those years? I'm certainly no expert, but it seemed that way while reading your posts.
He was pretty consistent over the years. Initially he gave me just as much love and affection as i could tolerate, having been raised to be very uncomfortable with those things. His meanness grew over time always with an element that if i objected my judgment was wrong. He only escalated to destroying property in the few years before bd. i didnt see him for who he was because my concerns were regularly minimized and i was in denial. And he wasnt consistently mean, so i would doubt myself when i felt mistreated.
So now, i'm learning to navigate this life. I've got a sometimes nice sometimes mean ex. I've got a kid who stopped picking bleeding sores after his dad left and was no longer verbally abusing him. And another son who seemed to be using drugs to numb the rage he felt at being abandoned. He seems to be doing mostly better but still can't stand his dad.
I dont denigrate their dad to them, but i'm not going to blow sunshine up their skirts either. I'm not going to tell them mean is nice because it's not.
Quote:
Avoids expressing emotion and seems to fear intimacy? Could that also be how he interacts with is kids? I would think so and I can easily see how that would come across as not caring. But they are not the same thing - expression and motivation are two very different things to me.
H was a great dad when the boys were small. He liked to be their ringleader and loved to say "say xyz" and they would, so he could laugh. Near the end it was sad because they would refuse to say whatever inane thing and he would get enraged and threaten them. He seemed to like them better when he could control them. He's missing their teen years. He went to bed and withdrew from us from the time they were about 10 and 12.
If you read my early threads, i think it's important to know that i was in complete denial and/or unaware that my h was abusive, until at least a year into ic. I minimized and justified it until i was brought to question whether his treatment of our kids bordered on abuse, and researching that opened my eyes. There was then a shift in my focus from saving my marriage to saving my kids and myself. Even now i argue with myself that i'm being too melodramatic. But I'm not.
I am trying to heal and protect myself and my boys, hopefully give them better skills than h and i grew up with, and tools for coping with their dad with their selfesteem intact, and allow whatever relationship h and the boys can create with one another, and not get in the way of that.
I do get mad sometimes that h doesn't convey the kind of love and acceptance that i think my boys need from their dad. That makes me really mad sometimes. Sometimes it may even blind me to whatever little bits of good do come from him. Being mad that h is the way he is is as pointless as being mad at a tornado. Instead i have to work harder at getting along with him and fulfilling my obligations as a coparent.
Adinva 51, S20, S18 M24 total 6/15/11-12/1/12 From IDLY to H moving out 9/15/15-3/7/17 From negotiating SA to final D at age 50 5/8/17-now: New relationship with an old friend __ Happiness is a warm puppy.
His son is not reading it that way. If i said son, just realize that your father is only yelling and berating you because he really loves you, i would look like a crazy person.
My h is verbally abusive.
I don't disagree. He is verbally abusive. You would be crazy to say otherwise to your sons. That's not what I'm talking about.
The third quote was from one of your past posts. In one of your early ones, your H was heading to vegas with his HS friends. You wanted them to talk some sense into him
Let's face it, you're closer to the situation than I am. I can only see what you report, right? And at the end of it all, I do see a man who is emotionally limited, although I see one who cares. Sociopathic? I don't have enough information for that but the word did bounce around my head when I was reading some of your older posts.
It's a tough spot to be in regardless. And one that will be tough on your kids to be sure.
Peace, AJ
"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK Put the glass down... "Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
You're righ, i forgot all about that trip to vegas.
But that's like someone pleading with their spouse one time right after bomb date, and two and a half years later someone says you're pleading with your spouse. Who hasn't had a moment of wishing their sitch would somehow change, and who here hasn't quickly been educated by the vets that it just doesn't work that way. Back then i couldn't fathom why h would leave me either. It took a lot of vers and counseling to figure out my own role in all of this.
My niece is struggling with some big issues getting started in life, way bigger than i could possibly help with, and my plate is very full. I'm learning to put down the savior of the world mantle i tried to wear in the past. I don't see how my post of frustration about her related in any way to my h. Other than maybe...that it's not my role to help him either?
Adinva 51, S20, S18 M24 total 6/15/11-12/1/12 From IDLY to H moving out 9/15/15-3/7/17 From negotiating SA to final D at age 50 5/8/17-now: New relationship with an old friend __ Happiness is a warm puppy.
Feh spelling. Vets, not vers. A lot of vets told me my h was not wrong to want to leave me. Or one vet told me that a lot.
I had to drop the anger. Sometimes i struggle with that.
I'm angry about some other things right now, and it's bleeding over. I take my rage out in kickboxing class and that helps some. It's not all about h.
I have fear about how i'm going to survive, and anger about more bitter pills i'm having to swallow. The only way out is through, and i'll get there.
Adinva 51, S20, S18 M24 total 6/15/11-12/1/12 From IDLY to H moving out 9/15/15-3/7/17 From negotiating SA to final D at age 50 5/8/17-now: New relationship with an old friend __ Happiness is a warm puppy.
That's not what I meant, but it's a true statement.
My point was that it's not their role to help him "snap out of it" any more than it was yours to talk to and help your niece as your sister wanted (side note: what she really wanted was to a) know you care about her and her daughter and b) to have yet another person give it a try in the hopes this time might be the time it works; substance addict, MLC, WAS - I see little difference in those in many cases. The addiction is very similar). There are things you can do for your friends/family. There are times to tell them. There are also times when you can better help them by NOT helping them. As you have decided is the case the of your niece. I tend to agree with approach that a person has to be motivated to do differently. Hitting bottom can help with that and has for many people. But in the end, they have to want to change more than they want to stay the same as they currently are.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist (although I've played one (well...maybe with one) on the internet) to see you're angry. Looking back through your posts, that stood out loud and clear.
Huh. A website where we come for help with our relationships and offer a safe place to vent and there's anger. Who'd have thought it right?
I don't for a second see that as an excuse for your H to leave. I don't see it as a reason to be the way he is with his sons.
I'm not him. I don't have to walk a mile in his shoes.
I would imagine from your postings that he's as angry as you are.
Like the Hatfields and McCoys, the war continues even if you aren't seeing it. That was the first thing that came to my mind when I read your posts. And one reason I responded.
Like the H & C's - nobody really remembers who "started" the slide into where you two are now. Entire families will be destroyed in epic ways (not made for movie in most cases.)
And like the H & C's, who started it is not the important question.
Which makes me wonder: What's your most important question in this family dynamic, adinva? You do realize you'll be tied to your H in some way or fashion for the rest of your days, right? It's a worthwhile question to ask.
AJ
"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter" MLK Put the glass down... "Yesterday I was clever so I wanted to change the world Today I am wise, so I am changing myself."
Survive - i meant put food on the table and keep a roof over our heads. I never thought i'd lose this job i've been great at for nearly 20 years. I'm afraid i wont find another job and i'm afraid my savings isnt enough to last very long. Those arent RATIONAL fears but they lurk anyway. The unknown is scary. I address it by trying to squelch negative selftalk, working out at the gym, planning my next 6 months out, and taking concrete steps as much as possible toward getting a job. But right now i'm workng around the clock to put together my last convention for this client. And take care of my head injured son. That's what i mean by survive.
Wonder where you're pushing ajm. Toward releasing the anger?
Adinva 51, S20, S18 M24 total 6/15/11-12/1/12 From IDLY to H moving out 9/15/15-3/7/17 From negotiating SA to final D at age 50 5/8/17-now: New relationship with an old friend __ Happiness is a warm puppy.
In my world survival rates are a very different thing, it means the opposite of dying.
I know D changes the financial circumstances of women.
Have you ever not had food on the table or a roof over your head? I know I went through that OMG what if... and then when I thought rationally, using that question above, I knew that I would be OK because I always had been. My life might be different but that didn't mean it would be worse. When things got tight, I got a second job (which I disliked, immensely)but I did it until I didn't need to do it. I cut what wasn't necessary, didn't but anything new, don't have a phone plan (!) blah, blah, blah
Ad, don't let your fears cloud your vision of what can be. You're an intelligent, savvy woman who has been living in a difficult, repressive situation. Open your cage, see the possibilities.
Your next job could be your best job ever. Or your next job could be a svcky job that leads to your best job ever.
Me 57/H 58 M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13
Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do. I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering. Caroline Myss
If expecting or hoping h would change came through my threads as a theme and not an early one-off i"m surprised. I thought that was a db lesson i picked up well and quickly. Never hurts to get a remedial lesson tho.
Anger is a feeling i feel sometimes. It doesnt define me and isnt how i think i feel generally. I cant deny it i have to feel and process it. It is a big step forward in my life to be able to admit to myself how ii feel and that it matters.
Adinva 51, S20, S18 M24 total 6/15/11-12/1/12 From IDLY to H moving out 9/15/15-3/7/17 From negotiating SA to final D at age 50 5/8/17-now: New relationship with an old friend __ Happiness is a warm puppy.
Survive - i meant put food on the table and keep a roof over our heads. I never thought i'd lose this job i've been great at for nearly 20 years. I'm afraid i wont find another job and i'm afraid my savings isnt enough to last very long. Those arent RATIONAL fears but they lurk anyway. The unknown is scary. I address it by trying to squelch negative selftalk, working out at the gym, planning my next 6 months out, and taking concrete steps as much as possible toward getting a job. But right now i'm workng around the clock to put together my last convention for this client. And take care of my head injured son. That's what i mean by survive.
Wonder where you're pushing ajm. Toward releasing the anger?
Adinva - For me, if I had lost the job I had done well at the past 20 years then I would be concerned with surviving also and all of the above would be rational fears for me. I personally think you are handling things pretty well. I think it also speaks volumes about your work ethic and character that even though you are losing the client, your focus is on working around the clock to put together the last convention for them. I hope they notice your efforts and it either gives them pause to reconsider the direction they are taking, or encourages them to provide you an excellent letter of reference for your job search.
I know it's easier said than experienced, but I have found it very true that when one door closes another one opens up somewhere. I hope a new door opens up for you sooner rather than later and that your son recovers from his head injury quickly as well.
