I'm still here. Internalizing lately. I think H is more MLC and on his own path, the info I read on the MLC side is very insightful. I need time to update things.
H texted about plans for 4th of July today. I actually didn't think we'd hear from him about the 4th and dds & I were still trying to decide what to do. I replied that we were thinking of going to same town as always & asked if he was working (he usually does on 4th of july). H said no, not working & to let him know if we were going. that's him asking to join us for holiday? I answered ok, we were thinking of maybe going to freedom fair in another city as well. He answers 'whichever one is fine with me'.
okay so he does want to spend the 4th with family. Didn't expect I'd have to get the kids on board though. They want to do their own thing and, as d18 puts it, she's resentful she always has to 'make time for' her dad. I just validate and encourage her to voice her feelings with H.
Opinions? Is it more important, for the sake of family (and maybe future family) to be there if H reaches out & spend the day together? Or better to let kids do what they want & live in reality, but risk losing family connection?
It's been a very slow and painful road to H reconnecting with dds. For his sake, I don't want to turn him away for a lonely holiday. My db coach says I'm supposed to show H image of family that could be restored & healed. But it seems I have to force dds to play house... maybe it's advice for families with younger kids.
Your kids are at an age where they can decide. Trying to control them is like trying to control anyone else, it usually back fires. They'll figure out a R that works for them.
If you and your H were still together and the girls wanted to do their own thing on a holiday, would that be OK or would you expect them to be with you?
I've had to do a lot of letting go in the last couple of years and more to come. It's difficult.
Me 57/H 58 M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13
Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do. I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering. Caroline Myss
I haven't updated in awhile... have had a lot going on that has little to do with my marriage. Getting d18 ready for college, went back east for a couple weeks with d15. H and I have had a distancing since July which has been good. We continued with MC until a few weeks ago when I postponed any further involvement with me. The focus of the MC for the first couple months was all about helping H reconnect with dds. We did transition to dealing with our marriage issues. But H doesn't want to commit, praises my changes but repeats that he doesn't see how to get back those feelings. And he is drowning himself with work, so it's an easy distraction. I've basically dropped the rope, as they say. At our last MC appt 3 weeks ago, I questioned if I was standing in the way of H doing his own personal work in therapy. H has admitted many times that I've changed so much but he hasn't at all. He says he's the same man that left over a year ago now. So the therapist made a couple appts with him, then said we could continue together later in September or not, depending on H's decision.
I have no regrets about the MC, and am proud to have been of service in helping him improve his relationships with dds. Everyone is still walking on eggshells, but the foundation has been laid. But I'm ready to move on and I made it clear I don't want to be 'cool exes'. We've gotten into this familiar, sibling-like relationship where we communicate better and have family time - but it's been clear to me for awhile that I don't want a friendship with H outside of our marriage so I'm trying to distance myself further.
Until... a friend told me of the Retrouvaille workshop being held this weekend in our area. I wasn't going to say anything about it to H because we seem to be so far off that path. In some ways we're much better, trust is starting to build again after another bump in July, he's moved down to our area (lives across the street from my work of all places!), he's been very supportive in asking how I'm doing every 1-2 days because I revealed in MC that his silence over the past year makes it seems like he didn't care at all. But there seems no intention of wanting to try to build a new relationship with me. But I brought up the Retrouvaille as a hail Mary and asked if he would consider going. He agreed almost immediately and said 'best to leave no stone unturned'. Funniest thing of all was, after reading the website in front of me, he said 'looks like at least we'll get some good communication skills out of this. I thought we were going to get that with MC, but not so much.' I just replied 'well, we spent a majority of the time on your relationship with girls'. But that was BECAUSE he said he didn't want to work on our R! Truthfully, this feels like another thing for H to get through so he can be done. I know that's mind reading, but the whole MC experience and basically forcing him to go on his own & now retrov, I can see the 'can we be done yet?? look in his eyes.
The reason I'm putting this out here today is because I had a bit of a revelation I'd really like some opinions on. My H works too much. Far too much. Last month after learning about my grandma's stroke and leaving to take care of her, I was emotionally charged and started a fight about his working too much. I said that it wasn't worth it, he's losing everything, he has a lot of 1099 income and he won't have kids to write off for much longer, it's not even financially worth it because he's going to have to pay so much in taxes without our house to write off - I said about his extra work - 'it's a dead limb! Cut it off!'.
He was cool, but when we had the discussion about Retrouvaille this weekend he brought up the argument and said that he'll never be in a relationship again where he can't do what he wants to do. He's proud he can work and provide for 2 households and pay for our dds to go to college. I've realized and read that men equate their worth to their earning power, and MC said H needs to heal from 'shame and poor self image'. So the money he earns, for now, makes him feel good about himself. And, for my part, I understand that H's LL is acts of service and I never gave him enough credit for wanting to care for us... but as a sustainable way to live life and have fulfilling relationships? I'm having a hard time reconciling the two.
Most importantly, I've understood recently that the working to much was a SYMPTOM of the problem, but not the problem itself. The problem were the feelings of neglect and being unappreciated, that were a result of his schedule, but if he were at all engaged in our family when he was around things would have looked different. And if I had appreciated having him around when he was, that would have been different too.
It also crossed my mind, that any relationship I am in with a different man will probably have an ex and kids to support - and will have to work to support the situation. What I thought was a deal breaker for me is turning into a reality check.
How have others lived with this situation? There's a lot of work left to do in my own head and the pressure of Retrov this weekend is making me rethink everything. About Retrov, H has already given me the 'no guarantees of outcome, okay?' text, so the pressure is all my own. I've been so focused on NOT having our old relationship, but building a new one. And I envisioned a different work schedule as part of that new relationship. But what I am seeing H being able to offer, at this time, is a whole lot of the same. And I can't decide if it's what I want anymore.
There's a lot of work left to do in my own head and the pressure of Retrov this weekend is making me rethink everything. About Retrov, H has already given me the 'no guarantees of outcome, okay?' text, so the pressure is all my own.
I've been to RetroV, it is a great program but when one spouse is a full-blown WAS my opinion is that it is of limited benefit. My W was actually the one to sign us up, but here we are some 8 months later and W is finalizing the D papers as I type this. I'm not saying to give up hope, but I am saying you need to drop any expectations you have that it will save your M. Just go with an open mind and open heart and see where it takes you, that's all you can do.
Thanks AS, I remember reading about your experience there. I unfortunately have little hope for my marriage. It's more about pressure for me to keep my heart and mind open for this weekend, because my preconceived idea is that it's just another thing to check off before finally being done. I sound like the WAS more than him lately I think.
My head has been spinning with new understanding & evidence about h's drinking and the deteriorating effects on his relationships. I sent my version of an intervention letter about 6 weeks ago, and he has avoided me since. I've also been attending Al anon for the past couple months BUT I'm stuck on the first step and I haven't heard a similar story at any of the various meetings I've been to. But maybe someone here can relate...
Does anyone have some advice about detachement, in relation to mlc & alcoholism? In this situation where we don't speak anymore, detachment feels hostile. Like he is choosing to avoid me for whatever reasons, but if I choose to not care anymore then his boat is really adrift. I haven't quite figured out how to be the lighthouse and be fully detached in my heart. I can demonstrate it on the outside, I make absolutely no contact to him and when I do see him I am gracious and warm. But if I turn my head the other direction and truly detach all the way, that feels like the end.
The Al anon meetings and literature have a lot of worthy material about detachment, but I keep thinking 'yeah, it's easier to be detached when your qualifier is living in your home and still in your life'.
Then if I follow the path to total detachment, the next thought in my head is, i'd better file for divorce. But I'm close, but truly not ready to do that.
So how does one sit on the fence with detaching but not filing and truly 'moving on'?
Then the issue with the first step, of me being powerless to the effects of alcohol... i"m again trying to figure out how that relates to me since I don't live with H. Maybe that one is just easy to accept because I have truly given up, with or without him drinking.
If anyone has some greater understanding on this I'd appreciate it. I feel like I need an al anon for dummies version... or like my brain is fighting the material and I don't want to be like that. It feels like there have been so many mountains to cross in the past 18 months, to finally get around the corner and see the biggest one ahead. And this one has nothing to do with H, but only with me.
