Updated response email- short and simpler, still got some good validation, no retirement account talk
Hello W,
I understand that you do not feel it is appropriate nor can think of an appropriate manner to share your feelings with me at this time. I appreciate your commitment to continue discuss these matters in a civil manner moving forward. If at any time in the future you do think of an appropriate manner, or feel like sharing your feelings with me or towards me, I want you to feel free to do so without fear of repercussions. I will just listen or read.
I am really sorry to hear about the car dying on you. I promise that I had no issues with it during the 3+ months that I had it after the battery dying on September 9th and no indication before I gave it back to you that anything was potentially wrong with it other than the age and mileage. I also understand that after a really long day at work, that is a very terrifying and extremely frustrating experience. I understand that finding a new vehicle will add to your list of upcoming expenses, I hope you find something that works for you and is reliable.
As far as focusing on the numbers, I am trying to do that because I think that numbers are objective and fair. In my opinion, they give a clear view of what each of us brought in, what we accumulated/spent together, and what would be proportionate to leave with. The reason I am trying to use numbers is because I, like you, am also very emotional and hurt. We have each broken our vows to each other, albeit in different ways. I agree with your statement from your "blunt email" that we both feel deceived for different reasons as well, and that both of our dreams are shattered right now. For these reasons, I am trying to leave as much emotion out of figuring all of this out as I can. What are your thoughts on that? I want to make sure we are on the same page regarding the best way to divide things fairly and unemotionally as possible.
Regarding the house- when you say " Selling the house right now would be a wash (any profit going towards closing costs and realtors)." can you give me your breakdown and thought process on what that means to you? I want to make sure I understand what you mean there, I was under the impression there would be a minimum of $20k to a max of $40k depending on selling price in equity leftover after all closing costs and such.
Thank you for getting copies of the dental receipts, I appreciate that and will need them as tax time steadily approaches.
Also, a letter arrived addressed to both of us from Mr. John Hughes in St. Louis, MO. He addressed it to our old El Cajon address. I have not opened it as I figure it is for you. It is in the garage on the gray tote, feel free to pick it up at your leisure.
I did end up talking to Charlie one evening, and he mentioned that the day you picked up the mail, he wasn't sure it was you. He did not recognize you since he only talked to you the couple of times, he said you looked different than before. He said that is why he was watching you. I did not tell him you felt uncomfortable or anything, just said you might be stopping by occasionally to get mail.
Respectfully, H
H: 29 WAXW: 30
Bomb Drop- 9/9/13 Negotiated Settlement- 5/9/14 D Final- 5/21/14 XW has breakdown in attorney lobby- 5/30/14
I think you might be foundering because you don't know who you want to be right now. What does KdoGS want to show the world?
To address this- I don't just want to show the world something. I am already living my changes, and have been for 3 months now. I am showing what a great person I have become, pulled myself out of depression and alcoholism. Re-devoted myself to my faith and am attempting to live out my values even through this painstaking process. That's why I am still trying to be so nice I guess, turning the other cheek, treating her as I would want to be treated, forgiving.
H: 29 WAXW: 30
Bomb Drop- 9/9/13 Negotiated Settlement- 5/9/14 D Final- 5/21/14 XW has breakdown in attorney lobby- 5/30/14
You're trying to get her to see the light. Let it go.
I know this is painful but at this point stick to business.
Thanks labug, I value your opinion. I really do want her to see the light, that it's not just her that's hurt. I feel like I am trying to be objective about it and explaining my rationalization.
I work better with 2X4's, what is it specifically that will feed the fire? I re-read it and I didnt think it was accusatory or anything, more fact stating.
H: 29 WAXW: 30
Bomb Drop- 9/9/13 Negotiated Settlement- 5/9/14 D Final- 5/21/14 XW has breakdown in attorney lobby- 5/30/14
I understand that you do not feel it is appropriate nor can think of an appropriate manner to share your feelings with me at this time. I appreciate your commitment to continue discuss these matters in a civil manner moving forward. If at any time in the future you do think of an appropriate manner, or feel like sharing your feelings with me or towards me, I want you to feel free to do so without fear of repercussions. I will just listen or read.
I am really sorry to hear about the car dying on you. I promise that I had no issues with it during the 3+ months that I had it after the battery dying on September 9th and no indication before I gave it back to you that anything was potentially wrong with it other than the age and mileage. I also understand that after a really long day at work, that is a very terrifying and extremely frustrating experience. I understand that finding a new vehicle will add to your list of upcoming expenses, I hope you find something that works for you and is reliable.
As far as focusing on the numbers, I am trying to do that because I think that numbers are objective and fair.In my opinion, they give a clear view of what each of us brought in, what we accumulated/spent together, and what would be proportionate to leave with. The reason I am trying to use numbers is because I, like you, am also very emotional and hurt. We have each broken our vows to each other, albeit in different ways. I agree with your statement from your "blunt email" that we both feel deceived for different reasons as well, and that both of our dreams are shattered right now. For these reasons, I am trying to leave as much emotion out of figuring all of this out as I can. What are your thoughts on that? I want to make sure we are on the same page regarding the best way to divide things fairly and unemotionally as possible.
Regarding the house- when you say " Selling the house right now would be a wash (any profit going towards closing costs and realtors)." can you give me your breakdown and thought process on what that means to you? I want to make sure I understand what you mean there, I was under the impression there would be a minimum of $20k to a max of $40k depending on selling price in equity leftover after all closing costs and such.(if you include this give her the facts you're in possession of that prove your assertion)
Thank you for getting copies of the dental receipts, I appreciate that and will need them as tax time steadily approaches.
Also, a letter arrived addressed to both of us from Mr. John Hughes in St. Louis, MO. He addressed it to our old El Cajon address. I have not opened it as I figure it is for you. It is in the garage on the gray tote, feel free to pick it up at your leisure.
I did end up talking to Charlie one evening, and he mentioned that the day you picked up the mail, he wasn't sure it was you. He did not recognize you since he only talked to you the couple of times, he said you looked different than before. He said that is why he was watching you. I did not tell him you felt uncomfortable or anything, just said you might be stopping by occasionally to get mail.
Respectfully, H
Me 57/H 58 M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13
Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do. I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering. Caroline Myss
Leave all the emotion and hurt feelings out, this is business and that's what she wants to get done. She doesn't want rationalizations, she wants to get to an agreement.
KdoGS, I used to write emails very similar to what you wrote above, deep down it's trying to manipulate emotions-there's your 2x4 from my own experience.
Me 57/H 58 M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13
Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do. I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering. Caroline Myss
Leave all the emotion and hurt feelings out, this is business and that's what she wants to get done. She doesn't want rationalizations, she wants to get to an agreement.
KdoGS, I used to write emails very similar to what you wrote above, deep down it's trying to manipulate emotions-there's your 2x4 from my own experience.
Thanks, and thanks for showing what I should include, that really helps.
H: 29 WAXW: 30
Bomb Drop- 9/9/13 Negotiated Settlement- 5/9/14 D Final- 5/21/14 XW has breakdown in attorney lobby- 5/30/14
Re-devoted myself to my faith and am attempting to live out my values even through this painstaking process. That's why I am still trying to be so nice I guess, turning the other cheek, treating her as I would want to be treated, forgiving.
I know you're a man of faith and I sense that you may be letting your interpretation of that direct your actions, so I'm going to try and appeal to that side of you with the following:
I think people misinterpret the meaning of turning the other cheek:
Matthew 5:38-40 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’ But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well.
People think it means to completely surrender yourself to others, if they want to run rough-shod over you then let them. But there's a more accurate interpretation. In the Middle East, the left hand was used for "unmentionable" acts and so it was a huge insult to be slapped with the left hand. However, if you turned the other cheek it would force the person to use their right hand which is an insult to THEM. It was an act of defiance. Likewise, If someone wanted to take your shirt and you gave them your coat as well, you would be left naked, an act of terrible embarrassment in that culture to the person suing you and also an act of defiance.
Are you familiar with what Jesus did in the temple when he found the "money changers" there?
John 2:15 So he made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple courts, both sheep and cattle; he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables.
Hardly an act of sheepish compliance. Jesus wasn't meek, he was a force to be reckoned with. He was a rebel to the established religion of the time.
I say this because as men of God we're called upon to emulate Jesus, but that does not mean to smother someone who doesn't care for you with love. Not at all. Jesus told his disiples this:
Matthew 10:14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet.
Your W is like those townspeople, she doesn't want to have anything to do with you and she doesn't even want to talk to you other than to work out logistics in the S and D. Your direction as a Christian is not to overwhelm her with kindness, affection and validation, that is just going to make your sitch worse and it also conflicts with DB'ing. Your W told you she doesn't want to share her feelings with you and she told you she wants to keep things "civil", not friendly. So LISTEN to her. Give her what she is asking for. Quit doing what YOU think is "right".
LA's edit is a good one. Go with that! I think she's right that you're trying to manipulate your W into liking you again, heck I tried it too. But it doesn't work. Your W is on her own journey, she'll get there at her own pace. You can't speed her up.
