It was the best of times it was the worst of times

[labug]

I didn't say push it through or do any work for her or act for her sake alone.

The process is already in motion, right?

KdoGS said this: She has not responded to that email, and I really don't want to be dealing with this over Christmas/New Years/my birthday Jan 2. I am going to lay low for awhile and see what step she takes next unless you have some other advice to offer?

If she responds and wants to talk, I'm saying talk. Don't push it off unless she's willing to do that. If she doesn't contact you, she doesn't contact you.

She did request that it be handled expeditiously.

I'm not saying you act expeditiously just because she asked but what is the win in acting the opposite? I'm also not saying act carelessly in regard to your interests. Take the time you need to make good decisions, just don't drag things out for effect.

I think it even says in DR not to hamper the process once it's in motion.

Does that make more sense?

[KdogGS]

Thanks for clarifying. I have handled everything she has sent thus far expeditiously. My average response time is 2 days. Hers has been 5 days to 1 month. I'm not the slow link in this process, but all of a sudden she calls me asking for info for the divorce decree.

We haven't decided on retirement assets, the house, property, anything. I don't think we're anywhere near that.

[KdogGS]

I understand she thinks it's all about her. She has stated before to me to stop making myself the victim.

Right, and that's the difficulty in dealing with a WAS is YOU have to see everything through HER eyes and respond accordingly. You have to constantly ask yourself things like "If I say X to her how is she going to interpret that and how will she respond?" I think I saw this in DR- it says to ask yourself two questions before saying/ writing things to your spouse- 1)what is my overall goal and 2)is what I am about to say/ do moving me closer to that goal or farther away? So if the overall goal is to save the M, then you have to constantly ask yourself if your words and actions are moving you closer to that or farther away. And to know the answer to that, you have to try and see things from your W's point of view. The problem is she's a WAS and her view of things is very distorted. You are the bad guy, you're responsible for the break-up of the M and for every bad thing that has ever happened to her, you can't change, etc. etc. You have to look at yourself through THAT lens and say/ do things that are contrary to that view (180's). And I think you're doing that pretty well, maybe not perfect but who among us is perfect at this?

Thanks for this, the problem is, I do things and she seems to interpret everything differently. I know I can't mind read, so I have no idea how she will respond to each action or words. I'm trying to see things from her point of view, but I feel it's distorted. I also think there is alot of parental influence going on as well in regards to what is fair/reasonable. I could be completely wrong, but I lived with her parents for 5 months, I saw the hold/influence they have over her and her brother, so this isn't just a random statement, I have a frame of reference. So her lense is distorted and she's got cheerleaders championing the cause.

[KdogGS]

In other news, I haven't heard anything since my last response to her email (knock on wood.) I don't know if no news is good news or what. I'm really not sure what to think, so I'll keep doing what I'm doing.

I finally found the motivation to start working out again, and my parents and sister fly in to town on Christmas Eve through New Years, so looking forward to them coming as well.

[Mimi00]

Please spread your motivation to work out over this way....I have yet to have the bug bite me. It needs too lol

Thats great that your family has been supportive in visiting you. I hope you enjoy the holiday with them.

[KdogGS]

CHOMP CHOMP- you've been bitten with the workout bug. It was a big one too.

[KdogGS]

Remember when the W and I switched vehicles last Friday?

I signed in to my auto insurance providers site and saw an auto claim from today. Looks like her car broke down. Please don't hear this as I am happy that the car broke down on her, I'm not. But part of me thinks this is karma. The day she was going to meet with her lawyer to file for D, the battery on that same car died out of the blue with no prior indication of an issue. I had no issues with it for the next 3+ months, and she has it less than a week and it apparently dies. Coincidental?

I was thinking about contacting her about it to ask if I could help out, but she filed a claim with my insurance, so I've decided not to since she hasn't reached out to me about it.

[KdogGS]

Help! Got this email from W this morning. Somehow she thinks that she is going to move me out of the house?

This is what she sent-
"Thank you for sharing that with me, however I cannot think of an appropriate way nor do I feel it is appropriate for me to share my feelings with you. Moving forward, I will continue discussing matters in a civil manner.

With that being said, I wanted to cast light on the fact that the car I've had for 6 days is now immoble. It broke down on me while driving home tonight on the road after a really long day at work, someone had to come get me, and the car had to be towed. I am safe, but I'm sure you can imagine it was quite terrifying and extremely frustrating. I am going to have a lot of expenses coming up with needing to buy a car in the next week and then all the little things adding up (table, chairs, tv, etc). Not to mention trying to live on a X salary again.

Moving on to your previous emails... it appears you are really focused on the numbers (understandably). Based on my overall calculations, when all is said and done, you will be walking away with more than 50/50 in terms of finances because you will have all of your investments and more than you came into the marriage with. Selling the house right now would be a wash (any profit going towards closing costs and realtors). With me refinancing the house in my name (or assuming the loan if possible) and you keeping all of your investments (IRA, 401K, and Roth- all things you were able to better contribute to due to my income), you will end up better off financially.

Speaking of the house, I would like to discuss your living arrangements. In the spirit of hospitality, I wanted to give you the option of staying in the house till the end of February with the understanding that you will continue to be responsible for the costs associated with living there during such time (house payment, water, electricity, cable, internet, phone, trash, insurance, etc.). This timing would work out for me as well with refinancing.

I am beyond exhausted right now with the day I've had, but I wanted to let you know I got copies of the dentist receipt you were asking for. I will make copies and email it to you tomorrow."


I mean, I guess at some point I'll have to send her the real information regarding the finances. Thoughts on how to respond?

[KdogGS]

This is what I've come up with as a reply. I tried to validate as much as I could, let me know if anything is sour/ugly!

"Hello W,

I understand that you do not feel it is appropriate nor can think of an appropriate manner to share your feelings with me at this time. I appreciate your commitment to continue discuss these matters in a civil manner moving forward. If at any time in the future you do think of an appropriate manner, or feel like sharing your feelings with me or towards me, I want you to feel free to do so without fear of repercussions. I will just listen or read.

I am really sorry to hear about the car dying on you. I promise that I had no issues with it during the 3+ months that I had it after the battery dying on September 9th (thank you again for replacing it that same day) and no indication before I gave it back to you that anything was potentially wrong with it other than the age and mileage. I am relieved that you are safe, and hopefully were in a good area and location for it to happen. I am also glad you were able to have someone come meet you and help out. I did see the claim on my homepage, so I'm glad you were still well insured. Our insurance covers a rental car up to $30 a day, I hope you take advantage of that. I also understand that after a really long day at work, that is a very terrifying and extremely frustrating experience. Again, I am sorry that it broke down on you. I understand that finding a new vehicle will add to your list of expenses, I hope you find something that works for you and is reliable.

As far as focusing on the numbers, I am trying to do that because I think that numbers are not emotional. I am trying to leave as much emotion out of figuring all of this out as I can. I feel that is the fairest way to do things. What are your thoughts on that? I want to make sure we are on the same page regarding the best way to divide things fairly.

Regarding the house- when you say " Selling the house right now would be a wash (any profit going towards closing costs and realtors)." can you give me your breakdown and thought process on what that means to you? I want to make sure I understand what you mean there, I was under the impression there would be a minimum of $20k to a max of $40k depending on selling price in equity leftover after all closing costs and such.

What I think I hear you saying is that you are assuming I want to keep all of my retirement funds? I have no problem splitting my retirement accounts to give you what portion was earned during our marriage, especially since as you noted, I was able to do so in part due to your income. I checked with Vanguard, and the best way to divide IRA's due to divorce is to have a QDRO put into the divorce decree outlining which IRA account funds are coming from and which account they are going to. This negates any tax event that would otherwise result in an IRA distribution. I understand you think me keeping all retirement funds will leave me better off financially, and thanks for thinking of me in that regard. I slightly disagree that it will leave me off better financially to keep my retirement funds and take none of my share of the home equity. I would have no cash readily available, so we will need to discuss this further to come up with a solution agreeable to all.

Regarding the living arrangements, thank you for being so hospitable. We will most likely need to figure out how the equity of the house shakes out before you can decide on refinancing. I am also under the impression that someone's name cannot be removed from the deed/mortgage or refinanced, unless it is stated in the divorce decree. So neither of us would be able to refinance the house until after that time. Please correct me if you have a different understanding. Have you already started the refinance process? If so, we should probably start discussing how to divide the equity so you can get accurate estimates of the costs associated with home ownership.

Thank you for getting copies of the dental receipts, I appreciate that and will need them as tax time steadily approaches.

Also, a letter arrived addressed to both of us from Mr. Hughes. He addressed it to our old CA address. I have not opened it as I figure it is for you. It is in the garage on the gray tote, feel free to pick it up at your leisure.

I did end up talking to Charlie one evening, and he mentioned that the day you picked up the mail, he wasn't sure it was you. He did not recognize you since he only talked to you the couple of times, he said you looked different than before. He said that is why he was watching you. I did not tell him you felt uncomfortable or anything, just said you might be stopping by occasionally to get mail.

Respectfully,
H"


Feedback?

[KdogGS]

I guess my mind is just going crazy- I was thinking on expanding on why I want to use numbers rather than emotions with something like this. I know it is really anti-DB but it seems like my train is headed for derailing regardless of what I do, so maybe getting it off my chest would at least help me. How badly would this go over? Love to hear from a WAS on this too.

"The reason I feel that numbers are objective and the best way to be fair during the division of property is that I too, like you am hurting. I know you were honest and blunt with me before, and I do need to be with you too as well.

You stated you felt deceived by me from Day 1, and previously stated multiple times that I did not adhere to our vows and thus shattered your dreams. I do not pretend to know exactly how you feel, but I am experiencing the same circumstances. We made vows of "in sickness and health, for better or worse, until death do us part" not until adversity do us part.

I admit that I did not adhere to my vow of forsaking all others, as I was having an emotional affair. Right now you are not living out your vows either. You told me repeatedly before we got married that "divorce is not in my vocabulary." The woman I married and intended to spend the rest of my life too has gone back on her vows as well. My dreams are also shattered at this point, like someone took a big eraser to my vision of my future. I am not saying I didn't give you lots of reasons to do so, but those are the facts as I see them. We both did not stay true to our vows for different reasons. I was in a deep depression and needed my wife, and she abandoned me emotionally.

This is why I think that the numbers are the best way to do this, we are both really hurting and emotional. I know that was blunt, but I needed to say it. I feel that during our relationship, we were both avoiders, which is why we never talked about issues and thus never fought at first."