Look what the cat dragged in! (TL)

[Pudmuddle]

Oh tiger, sorry you had a bad evening. HUGS.

Twinkle twat, lol, that's a good one.

I'm sure that you needed to get this out, because it hurts so much. In reality I don't think he has the capability right now to understand any of it. So it will fall on deaf ears at the moment. If you don't feel bad about it, it was probably something you needed to get out.

So how do you feel today? What are you going to do going forward? Take the focus of Beardometer and Twinkle Twat and do things for YOU tiger. You really need this right now. Giving him the focus gives him a sort of power over you and I can tell you are much stronger than that. You took some of it back by expressing your deep feelings but don't let it consume you.

You are a very strong person, I know you can do this.

[tigerlily78]

'The only difference between me and him is that I know I'm mad'

He thinks he's acting rationally and you know you're not. Give yourself a few days away from his drama and relax. Make decisions when you're in and even place. Emotional decisions are for mad men and idiots!

Thank you for this CC. I needed to hear it this morning. I need to keep reminding myself that he is looking for every chance to be angry with me or to feel attacked by me, I need to work all the harder to be neutral or just not engage him.

[T-boned]

Ok, so I posted about the same time you did today and when I was done went over to your new thread to check up on you. I am not having such a good day, but I gotta tell you T, I spit out my coffee when I read "Twinkle Twat" - so thank you for making me laugh.

I was so happy to read about how things seemed to be going in a positive direction (up hill side of the coaster) but then BAM! down the other side. I'm so sorry. Your outburst was a much needed release of pressure which no one here could deny you. It's a survival thing. Did you catch LoisB's vent a few days ago??? Whoa!! So as others have said, give yourself a few days, dust yourself off and get back on the DB horse.

I can't imagine how I would deal with your situation if I were in it with my H. Seeing SO on a regular basis sounds like it would be easier, yet, I think in reality it makes things much harder. I respect you so much for the way you are dealing with this so far. Grace under pressure, even though you had a little melt down. You're good.....

Oh, WTF, no matter how you slice it, this is all a pretty sH!!ty loaf of bread!

AARRGHHH!!! We all just want our lives back!!!

Guess I better quit. I'm going down hill fast and not being very supportive.

Know I just want to give you a big hug and that my heart is there with you.

Take care, Tigs . . I'll check back in when I dig my way out.

[tigerlily78]

Well, after the packing incident we had another argument. He tells me I don't get to decide these things, etc. That I can't force the issue and that he is really confused by the swings in my attitude from day to day. I explained to him very matter of factly that my swings are actually directly related to and playing off his swings in behavior. When he is nice to me it is very easy for me to be nice to him, when he practically ignores me then I start to get the feeling I am being taken advantage of and that he only wants to be here for food and laundry and to make it an easier transition on HIM to leave here. He also gets all angry and says he feels like he can't trust me, that the packing up his clothes is evidence that I will "do crazy things to hurt him" so this is why I can't have his debit card and he doesn't even want me to have the spare car keys, etc. Really pretty stupid, paranoid stuff coming from the person who first breached the basic threshold of TRUST in our relationship. I handed over the spare car keys, which he accused me of "hiding." I pointed out that I didn't realize it was such a big deal to him and that I had simply left the keys in the pocket of a coat I wore earlier. I told him I hoped he would at least keep the spare set somewhere in the house where he can remember in case we need them again like we did when he locked the keys in the car... it wouldn't be good for both sets to be in the same place. I asked if he wanted me to unpack his things. He said he didn't want me to because then I would act like he owed me something. I said no, I would feel like doing it is a good way to make amends. So I did unpack his stuff. Managed to get the tip of my middle finger (right hand)caught in a door in the process and I think the last joint may be broken and the skin is kind of cut/mangled. This did buy me some legitimate concern and aid from him, but we both decided that based on past experience, a doctor wouldn't do more than put a splint on it anyways probably, so we bandaged and splinted it with a finger splint we already had.

He later did finally addressed some of the things I have been dwelling on, why we didn't get married (because we have had some rough patches over the years and he mistakenly assumed I would want the big ceremony and the dress and to have it in my home state in front of people who don't like him)... He couldn't be further from the truth, but I guess that just goes to show how bad our communication had gotten. He assumes he knows everything about me and all I am capable of and that I never change.

He admitted he does actually have a lot of times when he misses me, he admitted he realizes he did actually love me, that a lot of what he said in the beginning of the sitch was done "because of intoxicating emotions." But he feels like there have been a lot of times when life got in the way and he feels like I put other people's opinions and issues "above" our relationship. (I think this is funny because I have actually fallen out with my family many, many times defending him, but I guess I was supposed to march around the house bragging about it, not quietly solving my own issues with my family). Because I am an idiot I asked him how much he thinks he loves HER on a scale of 1 to 10 (1 being no love, and 10 being I want to marry you and spend my life with you), he said a 6 or maybe a 7. Hmmph, I am not sure what to make of that. Does that mean it has decreased somewhat from the euphoria of the bombdrop week where he was absolutely certain they were destined to be together? He says that it's not a competition, that he can't help how he feels, but that I also have a giant advantage over her in that he has known he so long and we have a child together. (wow, somewhat shocked he sees that as an advantage, since most of previous talks seemed to hinge on how he never wanted to be a father and I have spent 16 years making awful, unforgivable mistakes!)

Of course the weight of some honesty and connection has thrown him right back into a bit of Monster.

He came home in a rush today, had apparently ignored a voicemail I sent him earlier today to give him some reminders and a note that has been posted in his den for a WEEK so he made other plans. He was clearly coming home "just for a minute" to change clothes (stupid), and I asked if he was getting back in time later for our son's event. He got super pissy about it, like it is MY fault he didn't read the note or decide to listen to my voicemail. :P So he is apparently going downtown to an indoor farmers market with zipperface, so it seems pretty obvious he can't get back here in time for son to go to his thing. Or even if he does it will be super resentment city. Of course he and OW are in no way responsible for this situation. :P

We also are pretty bare in the pantry for some staples and need to do some grocery shopping (this was in the voicemail), and also our internet had stopped working due to something with the router and I couldn't figure out how to make it work even bypassing the router... turns out I just had to reboot the cable modem, but I don't know these things, he DOES. And son and I had email/website stuff we needed to be able to access today for scouts. So me asking him for advice on this was ALSO a giant imposition, even though it only took him 20 seconds to give me an answer. :P

So yes "all" of these pressing concerns were raised with him while he was trying to change clothes. I did it very calmly. He started raising his voice right away.

It clearly didn't occur to him that yesterday he told me he would be around today and that *I* am not the one who "just" decided for him that he had to come change clothes and go downtown to the farmer's market on a whim. He also didn't come over here until 2pm... clearly he could have spent him morning differently and avoid some of the pressure, but I had the good sense not to say that. He also tried to use the excuse that "He doesn't read the notes I leave because he is too busy and when he is here in his den he can't even relax!!" Ahem, so yes, me leaving him alone in his den for 2 - 6 hours at a time uninterrupted just isn't enough time because once a day or so I actually have to go in there and talk to him about something. :P

I almost kind of hope the pissy mood carries over to the farmers market and zipperface can get a taste of the "I'm too busy and pressed for time and stressed out" H. :P

So, I guess son and I are not going to the scout thing this evening. It was not required and it is kind of chilly anyways for an outdoor thing, but I feel bad because we did RSVP.

I have to give space, so much space. I have to take off more pressure (which is tough to do with the car/money situation as it is).

As for me, I am still running (I ran today even though it was pretty chilly and windy by southern standards). I was showered and had makeup on (even lip tint) when he came home. I have a few more job applications to turn in on Monday or Tuesday, but I am worried my finger situation will make it difficult to land a job where there is any food service involved until it is healed. Going to try and convince son to help me get his super messy room cleaned up over the long break for Thanksgiving. I also have a walk in closet or two that are on my "to do list" for getting cleaned out and reorganized.

[tigerlily78]

So how do you feel today? What are you going to do going forward? Take the focus of Beardometer and Twinkle Twat and do things for YOU tiger. You really need this right now. Giving him the focus gives him a sort of power over you and I can tell you are much stronger than that. You took some of it back by expressing your deep feelings but don't let it consume you.

You are a very strong person, I know you can do this.

Thanks Pud. I can't take credit for Twinkle Twat, I am pretty sure I read it in someone else's really old thread. For whatever reason it was in my head. His OW seems so obvious in her need to attention, so it seemed apt. "Look at me! Look at me! I have an edgy hairstyle! I dyed my hair!" I got tattoos! I wear crazy clothes! Look at me so I know I matter and am alive!" Her twat probably IS lined with seasonal decorations and lights.

Oh one more nugget I thought was kind of funny. I asked in OW gave him the cologne he has been wearing. He says he bought it for himself (weird, out of character, but I guess he is self conscious about his odors)... OW got him a massage at a spa for his birthday. OMG. I immediately knew how uncomfortable he would be with that. I asked if he enjoyed it. All he says is, "The minute I walked into there I wanted to leave." Oh that brings me so much joy. I wonder if he actually told her or if he just smiled and pretended it was right up his alley. I kind of think OW probably got them both massages for his birthday, so it was more about her and what she wanted and was a total miss for him.

I give good massages, my H knows I would never waste money on sending him into a public place to get one where they make you get half naked and wear throw away flipflops. Man, I can't believe she still gets a 6 or a 7.

[tigerlily78]

I was so happy to read about how things seemed to be going in a positive direction (up hill side of the coaster) but then BAM! down the other side. I'm so sorry. Your outburst was a much needed release of pressure which no one here could deny you. It's a survival thing. Did you catch LoisB's vent a few days ago??? Whoa!! So as others have said, give yourself a few days, dust yourself off and get back on the DB horse.

Thanks T-Boned. I am sorry you are going through your own rough patch too. I am starting to think it has a lot to do with the holidays coming up. So much pressure anyways and both us and our SO's are dealing with more on top of that.

Can't remember if I read Lois's or not yet. I lost internet for about 48 hours and have a lot of catching up to do.

Thank you for reminding me to get back on that horse. I know that my angry outbursts are counterproductive in a lot of ways, but at least it did seem to drag a little bit of information out of him about where he is and what he is feeling.

He DOESN'T want to move out, he does have some feelings for me, he DOES miss me... those are all positives. I have to get my head back on straight and do a lot more with my meditation and calming and reminding myself that PATIENCE is key. SPACE is key. I can't rush the process as badly as I want to.

[Pudmuddle]

Well gosh tiger, sounds like you kind of reeled it back in with the last convo.

I was so glad to hear that he did admit to still loving you, still missing you. That is a good sign. He is terribly confused right now. I wouldn't put too much significance on his rating of her. You asked for something specific so you got it...don't do that again! It will only defeat you and I would bet he won't remember that conversation.

You and I both need to work on the space and STFU thing, lol.

I'm sorry to hear about your finger, I hope it doesn't get more serious and heals well.

[tigerlily78]

Yes, STFU. Why is it so hard? I need to get myself one of those plastic bracelets that says STFU, maybe a stretchy one that can snap me like a rubber band when I pull on it. :P

I think based on my rating system a 6 is not really that tremendous, especially knowing my H. His ratings systems seem to be rather skewed anyways when it comes to people. Either he thinks you are wonderful and worthwhile or you are a waste of oxygen and time.

And I think based on his other comments he and I had been at 10 plenty of times in life but he let his assumptions about how we would HAVE to get married keep him from going there. How sad is that. I am pretty sure I have mentioned several times that I didn't expect a big to-do. Just a ring and a justice of the peace and some nice pictures to remember the day would have been enough for me. Maybe splurging on a nice new outfit would have been a nice bonus, but I am totally not the type of person who is excited at the prospect of buying an overpriced dress I should only wear once. :P

He also said he has just never really cared that much about marriage as a "thing"... and this is something we have in common. His mom sort of made marriage look like a hobby for bored people with young children to support. I have 2 uncles who have each been married 4 times and have multiple children with these women. When I got pregnant these were the first people in line to badger US about getting married. Needless to say, that advice coming from them made us both VERY apprehensive.

For me marriage was never because I needed the reassurance of the commitment (I trusted him SO much, I never in a million years could imagine him WANTING to find someone else, let alone doing it), it was more for reasons like sharing insurance coverage (we worked that out without M) and getting Social Security Benefits if one of us died, and for the sake of our child socially. But we have been calling each other husband/wife for at least 8 years without it being the real deal. :P

[Pudmuddle]

It's hard because we are hurting and have some feelings and emotions we need to get out and deal with. I think of it as PTSD. You might have something on that rubber bracelet STFU.

You'd be surprised what you can find at near new type shops on dresses, wedding or other nice ones. Lots of nice things for cheapy.

I don't think two people HAVE to be married to be married, but that's just me. It still is the priority that you make each other and how you treat each other every day that matters. I wish I'd know those things earlier. Ah, well.

Another Groundhog Day of STFU. c'mon tigerlil, we can do it!

[tigerlily78]

I sure hope we can do it.

Yeah, it is definitely the case that I have a lot of emotions and I think his general indifference towards me really makes it boil to the top sometimes. It really pisses me off to be treated like a roommate and as if me and our son are secondary concerns, when he is off doing so many ridiculous and self destructive things. Also I totally do not like him projecting distrust on to me when he is the one behaving distrustfully.

Reading the boards it is clear that really being married doesn't make anyone less prone to being cast away by their MLC spouse, but it is a sad reality that it puts me in a weaker position financially if we do end up splitting for good. He keeps saying he loves our son and will never make us have to leave this house and his school situation and stuff. I mentioned that it might make me feel less anxiety about it if he signed something stating his intentions to continue to pay for the house regardless of what happens to us. He did not like that idea at all. He seemed to think that if he signed something like that I could "use it against him" ...more wacko thinking. If his intention is to do it, then why would I HAVE to ever use it against him? I just told him that because he changes his mind a lot these days I am just having a hard time taking his word for it on something as big and as important as the housing situation. I told him I didn't expect him to sign anything, I just felt like the reassurance would help me feel a little more secure about the future for my son and I regardless of what happens down the road.